Juggernaut FS Ultra vs Frey EX

[Jgreen92]

I'm currently trying to decide between the juggernaut fs ultra 21ah with 3'' tires and the Frey EX Advanced or pro. It looks like the Frey has better suspension/brakes by default but comes from China so probably a longer wait.

I did see some information the motor programming was better on the bitrix if anyone could confirm? Im currently waiting on exact pricing info for both these bikes and not sure on the wait for either. I also like a more upright/relaxed ride and it looks like there is enough cable room to raise the handlebars on both I think?

Does the Frey have warranty and would it be effective?

Anyone have more info to help me decide?

 

[reed scott]

It takes a lot of riding to drain a 21Ah battery. You sure you want a bike that carries around two of them? Very heavy. I have a Frey AM 1000 and it's heavy enough. I don't care personally about warrantee issues. If it breaks, other than the frame, I'll just fix it. Biketrix would be your best bet for any real support. Don't know your budget but the FS Jug can be significantly upgraded. Unless you plan on jumping the bike or doing wild downhill either of the bikes you mention are tough enough.

 

[Jgreen92]

Yeah I was thinking I could get the upgraded suspension for the jugg to make it more on par with the Frey. But those 4 piston brakes on the Frey would be nice for a motor as powerful as these. I won't be doing any big jumps or crazy things as I would just need more stitches lol. My understanding though was the Frey had 2 14ah batteries rather than 2 21ah. Do you know if the Frey would still get a good bit of range like 20-30 miles with just the integrated battery attached using low power? The only gripe I have with the Fray is the 2nd battery makes it not look quite as slick but its not bad at all. I think the Frey's weight is very close to the jugg also even with both batteries but not 100% sure. As long as its 75lb or less i'm fine with it. Getting over 80 is a bit much.

Thanks for the info.

 

[reed scott]

Check the brake options on the Jug. You can get quad cylinder Magura.

 

[reed scott]

Don't know about range for a 14Ah battery. Of course it all comes down to weight and how you ride. You won't go wrong either way but the wait with Frey is tough. Then again we don't know when Biktrix will have FS Jugs back in stock . If you can stand the wait with Frey you WILL get more bike for less money.

 

[Ebiker33]

I'm currently trying to decide between the juggernaut fs ultra 21ah with 3'' tires and the Frey EX Advanced or pro. It looks like the Frey has better suspension/brakes by default but comes from China so probably a longer wait.

I did see some information the motor programming was better on the bitrix if anyone could confirm? Im currently waiting on exact pricing info for both these bikes and not sure on the wait for either. I also like a more upright/relaxed ride and it looks like there is enough cable room to raise the handlebars on both I think?

Does the Frey have warranty and would it be effective?

Anyone have more info to help me decide?

Other than Watt Wagon Biktrix has the best programing on the Ultra, we know this because of feedback, some posters swapped out the Frey controller for huge gains, on the Biktrix not as much, is seems Roshan has mastered the programing without the upgrade, and it's not something anybody can even do with the program on a computer, he went next level with hex coding that only stocking dealers can get from Bafang, as far as I know he is the only Ebike company to go that deep in customizing it without changing the controller.

 

[reed scott]

Other than Watt Wagon Biktrix has the best programing on the Ultra, we know this because of feedback, some posters swapped out the Frey controller for huge gains, on the Biktrix not as much, is seems Roshan has mastered the programing without the upgrade, and it's not something anybody can even do with the program on a computer, he went next level with hex coding that only stocking dealers can get from Bafang, as far as I know he is the only Ebike company to go that deep in customizing it without changing the controller.

Not a dig, don't want to discourage anyone. If you max out the FS Jug with the best components you are over $5k. It's worth it.

 

[Jgreen92]

I think i'm probably going to get the jugg due to the better programming and I might be able to get one before winter.

Also I read on another forum several people had their Frey frames snap at the rear triangle last year. That is kinda worrying.

 

[Ebiker33]

I think i'm probably going to get the jugg due to the better programming and I might be able to get one before winter.

Also I read on another forum several people had their Frey frames snap at the rear triangle last year. That is kinda worrying.

Have you seen the new Pro model looks and specs seem awesome. I think upgrade to the 52V is worth it too, more power and run time.

 

[reed scott]

Have you seen the new Pro model looks and specs seem awesome. I think upgrade to the 52V is worth it too, more power and run time.

Just checked it out. Looks great. I put everything on it component wise but the light and it came in just under $5k.

 

[Jgreen92]

So the Ultra Pro would have more range with 52v even though its 17.5 ah vs 21ah? Also is that coil suspension as good as a air? I don't know a whole lot about the coil vs air.

 

[reed scott]

Where'd the pic with a second battery come from?

 

[reed scott]

That's Eunorau, not Juggernaut.

I was showing that pic to make a point how Eunorau looked better because it was silver (from my perspective).
Now that Biktrix has silver, it looks much better now.

Oh. Thanks

 

[Jgreen92]

It looks like that Frey weighs close to 80lb also with both batteries while the jugg is around 73lb. So that should be a noticable weight difference. Pretty sure I want the jugg with the wren fork and 4 piston brakes. Hopefully it will be coming in stock later this month or next, would be depressing to ride in the winter with it.

I also hope some kind peek gear gets made for it as that would be extra good. But if its a noisy I might open it up and put some better grease in there which sounds like it will help.

 

[reed scott]

It looks like that Frey weighs close to 80lb also with both batteries while the jugg is around 73lb. So that should be a noticable weight difference. Pretty sure I want the jugg with the wren fork and 4 piston brakes. Hopefully it will be coming in stock later this month or next, would be depressing to ride in the winter with it.

I also hope some kind peek gear gets made for it as that would be extra good. But if its a noisy I might open it up and put some better grease in there which sounds like it will help.

Wish I could make a sound recording for you but the ultra is not noisy at all. Yeah you can hear it when its pushing out the power but it is not even approaching noisy. I call it a 'contralto whir/whine'. Not Soprano. It's lower in register than that. My Norelco electric razor makes about as much noise.

 

[Jgreen92]

Yeah I think the places I have read about it being loud are exaggerating the sound, and I also know that the camera recordings amplify the sound a bit. Do you know if the ultra's coming out now can still be programmed or are they using the can bus? It sounds like they have good programming so I probably won't need to mess with it though.

 

[Jgreen92]

When you set this bike to the 20mph mode does that limit the wattage to 750w or still 1000w with earlier cutoff? I like to do rides with low level assist for more range and exercise and the 750w limit would help with that. But fine either way

 

[reed scott]

When you set this bike to the 20mph mode does that limit the wattage to 750w or still 1000w with earlier cutoff? I like to do rides with low level assist for more range and exercise and the 750w limit would help with that. But fine either way

The 20mph limit is the Cover Yer _ss mode for Biketirx. Get the unlimited version. No price increase. Limit yourself if you want to by selecting the modes but don't let the 'regulators' control you.

 

[greeno]

I have a friend who has the Biktrix Ultra FS and he's had it about 6 mos or so. I ride with him quite a bit and here's my impression of his bike.

The front head tube angle is VERY slack and if I remember correctly it has only a 100mm travel inverted "Biktrix" fork. Steering is tight on some of the single track we ride and creates a problem in being able to steer precisely . Downhill it's very stable because of the wheelbase length. The main thing I don't care for is the wide rear end (190mm) spacing. This puts a lot of flex on the rear hub. He is on his 2nd one. We threw away the first one after it blew apart going up a small rise ( not very steep ). Opened it up and the teeth inside the hub housing was toast so no way to rebuild. Upgraded to a DT Swiss hub and it seems to be ok for now at least. He ended up going with a 150mm fork on the front which is wide also. I think having a 190mm in the rear and a 150mm in the front is a big downside. Most MTB's are 148mm x 110mm Boost or 142mm x 100mm regular. I think the tighter the better. If you go with the 27.5" x 3" tires it looks a little funny.
If your going to ride easy and mostly on the road it probably would be fine but getting on it off road is just a time issue IMO.
As far as the programming is concerned we did have to do a bit of adjusting on the controller settings that came with the bike to get it to his liking.
Two other friends have a Luna Apex ( which I have not ridden) and a Bafang Stock Andy Kirby Bike ( which we need to adjust the throttle programing ) and they seem pretty close to the Biktrix performance in PAS. Again JMO

As far as range is concerned it's all about Watts not voltage. More watt hrs more range.

Example #1: 52v 14 amp hrs is 14 batteries in series and 4 batteries in parallel giving you 728w hrs. 56 batteries total

Example #2: 48v 14 amp hrs is 13 batteries in series and 4 batteries in parallel giving you 672 w hrs. 52 batteries total. A tiny bit lighter in weight but less approx 9% range.

Have not seen a FREY in person so I can't comment there

 

[reed scott]

I have a friend who has the Biktrix Ultra FS and he's had it about 6 mos or so. I ride with him quite a bit and here's my impression of his bike.

The front head tube angle is VERY slack and if I remember correctly it has only a 100mm travel inverted "Biktrix" fork. Steering is tight on some of the single track we ride and creates a problem in being able to steer precisely . Downhill it's very stable because of the wheelbase length. The main thing I don't care for is the wide rear end (190mm) spacing. This puts a lot of flex on the rear hub. He is on his 2nd one. We threw away the first one after it blew apart going up a small rise ( not very steep ). Opened it up and the teeth inside the hub housing was toast so no way to rebuild. Upgraded to a DT Swiss hub and it seems to be ok for now at least. He ended up going with a 150mm fork on the front which is wide also. I think having a 190mm in the rear and a 150mm in the front is a big downside. Most MTB's are 148mm x 110mm Boost or 142mm x 100mm regular. I think the tighter the better. If you go with the 27.5" x 3" tires it looks a little funny.
If your going to ride easy and mostly on the road it probably would be fine but getting on it off road is just a time issue IMO.
As far as the programming is concerned we did have to do a bit of adjusting on the controller settings that came with the bike to get it to his liking.
Two other friends have a Luna Apex ( which I have not ridden) and a Bafang Stock Andy Kirby Bike ( which we need to adjust the throttle programing ) and they seem pretty close to the Biktrix performance in PAS. Again JMO

As far as range is concerned it's all about Watts not voltage. More watt hrs more range.

Example #1: 52v 14 amp hrs is 14 batteries in series and 4 batteries in parallel giving you 728w hrs. 56 batteries total

Example #2: 48v 14 amp hrs is 13 batteries in series and 4 batteries in parallel giving you 672 w hrs. 52 batteries total. A tiny bit lighter in weight but less approx 9% range.

Have not seen a FREY in person so I can't comment there

Definitive analysis to my mind. These bikes are not for hard hard riding. Lots here do not really test their machines and they should be OK. I'm in that camp for sure. Too O L D for that stuff.