Barbecue grill for a safe charging station?

 
edit: I wonder if something like this makes more sense.
Not to put out the fire but contain it to a small area by tenting?
What worries me about that is that the blanket will hinder my ability to haul the bike the hell out the door as fast as possible. For a bike like this, with the battery permanently enclosed under the floor inside the box (it would take a good 10-15 minutes to take the floor off) I don't see a fire blanket having any positive impact wrapped around the whole bike or somesuch.
PXL_20211118_162858750_cropped.jpg


Even for a less esoteric daily driver, its too much of a PITA and I am creating a new avenue to cause that same risk. I mean... am I potentially causing trouble by fiddling with connectors, fumbling with and lugging around a big heavy battery, and putting wear and tear on those same connectors? When instead I can leave that high quality battery I had made with specific, safe components the hell alone, while I charge it safely at low amperage using a charger I know is safe, and that is charging to less than 100% at a very low amperage, with a cutoff timer killing the power well before it can ever overcharge?

I don't mess with removing batteries or charging outside in a bunker. I do a ton of other things that reach back to not cutting corners when I build it in the first place.
 
Complacent maybe, from many years using/charging batteries in Radio Control, but I'm comfortable charging the batteries while installed in our bikes, indoors, without removing them (knocking on wood), using the chargers that came with them.

That might (would) not be the case if there were anything unusual about the batteries (e.g. home made, questionable integrity, cold, etc.) or the charger was questionable. If radio control has taught me anything over the last several decades, it's not to trust anything like that. Just replace it!

That's me though. You do whatever it takes to allow you to sleep well....
 
What worries me about that is that the blanket will hinder my ability to haul the bike the hell out the door as fast as possible. For a bike like this, with the battery permanently enclosed under the floor inside the box (it would take a good 10-15 minutes to take the floor off) I don't see a fire blanket having any positive impact wrapped around the whole bike or somesuch.
View attachment 126784

Even for a less esoteric daily driver, its too much of a PITA and I am creating a new avenue to cause that same risk. I mean... am I potentially causing trouble by fiddling with connectors, fumbling with and lugging around a big heavy battery, and putting wear and tear on those same connectors? When instead I can leave that high quality battery I had made with specific, safe components the hell alone, while I charge it safely at low amperage using a charger I know is safe, and that is charging to less than 100% at a very low amperage, with a cutoff timer killing the power well before it can ever overcharge?

I don't mess with removing batteries or charging outside in a bunker. I do a ton of other things that reach back to not cutting corners when I build it in the first place.
I actually do the same as removing my battery is a little tedious and cycling connectors does have a downside.
And I don't see you stuffing that into an ammo can or bbq grill for that matter either.
I think we take a similar approach to charging and for now I'm comfortable with it.

That said my suggestion was to the latter and directed more towards the OP... Maybe instead of trapping heat and gasses into a small potentially explosive container perhaps allowing for better cooling may actually avoid some runaway situations and the blanket could stop /slow the spread of fire to near by combustibles when charging indoors. This is just a theory as I haven't implemented or tested either.... and probably won't in the future for that matter.
I'll add every charger/battery set of instructions I've ever seen recommended a well ventilated area... just sayin...
 
Good videos.. And you can see the amount of venting on the Bat Safe box so there is a real concern. But it doesn't address that you may be adding to the fire hazard by trapping heat to begin with and actually contributing to causing a runaway event . Additionally that looked like a total of less than 16 cells..not your typical ebike battery that has a lot more potential. I think an ammo can is safe storage, not sure I'd use it to charge.
 

Yes I’m sure. You chose passenger aircraft. If I were a shop I’d look to Domino’s EU. There’s a lot more details than your pick. But I will agree that outdoor may be the least expensive solution but doesn’t solve charging through a MN winter. I’m seriously considering adding a blanket. But they are expensive. At least the truly effective versions are.
I suggest that you read it again as it was not limited passenger aircraft.
And you may want to rethink your all in one fire cabinet as cell isolation is a key factor.
 
Mr. Coffee said:
I'll stick to it, though. E-bike fires appear to be fairly common and are growing more common,


I'll push back on the 'fairly common' contention. They're not. That guy who made a point of documenting every fire he could find only managed to find 49 of them in 3 1/2 years.
This is pretty much where my mind goes regarding how much to fear battery fires. Of course it's just something I read on the internet, so I'll take it with a grain of salt, but really, 49 battery fires or even 4900 battery fires out of how many ebikes in the world? Not to mention smart phones and drones and myriad other battery-using-devices??? People post the horror stories, but the internet would bog down and die if the same percentage of people who don't have battery fires posted their "nothing happened today" stories. No kidding, the internet would go down in flames!

So, they may be my famous last words, but I'm not going to do anything about e-bike battery fire prevention other than use normal, day-to-day good sense in choosing batteries and how I charge and handle them.

I'll take all the money I save on flammable cabinets and fire blankets and buy lottery tickets. I know how to spend my money wisely!!

To each his, or her, own, absolutely. Just saying where my head is on this at the moment.

TT
 
I had the experience of having two battery makers having catastrophic failures . Lives were devastated. But hey anyone that wants to convince themselves that the reports are akin to lottery ticket odds… Well… Best of luck.
 
Nice build! I might try the ammo can approach for individual charging but the cabinet would be necessary to store my other 5 batteries.

BTW, I don't use the plastic case for charging, just for physical protection during transport.
I think you'd be better with individual ammo cans for storage.
Again I think this document highlights some very important considerations.
 

U.N. Certification is available on select cases for domestic and international shipping, including UN3090, UN3091, UN3480 and UN3481.

- For 1 – 1,500 Wh batteries(at 100% state of charge)
- Intumescent glass fiber fire-retardant anti-stat lining and cushioning
- Aircraft Grade Aluminum Construction
- Case outfitted with three separate cavities, each 17 x 5 x 5″Cavities may be subdivided (x2, x3, x4, or more) with BatterySafe intumescent glass fiber pad.
Extra pads may only be ordered with BatterySafe or after online purchase
- Custom Configurations for Higher Wh Batteries
Passed Fire Test with Three 500 Wh Lithium Batteries:
- Fire completely contained and filtered
- No thermal runaway, ajacent cells protected
- Exterior temperature remains below 100°C

USE CASES:

- Prototype and Damaged Batteries
- Hybrid and Electric Vehicles
- Drones and UAVs
- Electric Bicycles
- Medical Equipment
- Power Tools
 
I had the experience of having two battery makers having catastrophic failures . Lives were devastated. But hey anyone that wants to convince themselves that the reports are akin to lottery ticket odds… Well… Best of luck.
What does that mean? "Two battery makers having catastrophic failures"? Who were these battery makers? Were they top-tier battery makers? What was your experience with them?

I remember when phone batteries were exploding and blowing peoples' ears off. How should we manage that? Smaller ammo cans?

I'm open to being convinced on this, but I'm not nearly there yet. And, as implied at least, I'm all in favor of other folks doing whatever they think is best for themselves.

TT
 

U.N. Certification is available on select cases for domestic and international shipping, including UN3090, UN3091, UN3480 and UN3481.

- For 1 – 1,500 Wh batteries(at 100% state of charge)
- Intumescent glass fiber fire-retardant anti-stat lining and cushioning
- Aircraft Grade Aluminum Construction
- Case outfitted with three separate cavities, each 17 x 5 x 5″Cavities may be subdivided (x2, x3, x4, or more) with BatterySafe intumescent glass fiber pad.
Extra pads may only be ordered with BatterySafe or after online purchase
- Custom Configurations for Higher Wh Batteries
Passed Fire Test with Three 500 Wh Lithium Batteries:
- Fire completely contained and filtered
- No thermal runaway, ajacent cells protected
- Exterior temperature remains below 100°C

USE CASES:

- Prototype and Damaged Batteries
- Hybrid and Electric Vehicles
- Drones and UAVs
- Electric Bicycles
- Medical Equipment
- Power Tools
A bit more than an ammo case filled to the top with batteries...
Still not sure I agree with aluminum construction though... The filling must be one hell of a heat shield
 
LEVA editorial. And with that, good day…

“The ingredients of the battery packages that are so unlikely to be trouble are Quality cells, well-designed battery packages, well-made battery packages, well-designed and manufactured battery management systems, good BMS software, well designed and manufactured chargers. Good motor controllers, and sensible ebike owner/operators.”

Is this what we’re getting from self regulated sub $500 batteries and unregulated sub < $1500 OEM direct eBikes?
 
Is this what we’re getting from self regulated sub $500 batteries and unregulated sub < $1500 OEM direct eBikes?

At those prices you can be pretty confident that they are cutting every corner they can.
 
I'm sure I don't understand all that, but it says in 2019 there were 119 ebike fires among about 250,000,000 ebikes in China. Thats one fire for every two million one hundred thousand ebikes. Of course nobody wants to be that one, but the odds are extremely good you won't be. And I don't know, but how good do you think the batteries are in all 250 million of those bikes? Now I'm being silly, but out of all of those bikes it seems possible at least one of the fires could have been due to a lightning strike.

TT
 
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