2021–2022 Riese & Müller Homage

[Alaskan]

this is a nice bike thermometer that takes up little handlebar space

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[Clamps]

That's a really neat idea. I love how modded out these bikes get.

 

[Spiffyflyer]

Brand new never ridden riese muller homage with rolhoff and duel batteries , 49cm gx model for sale. Every option for sale. I can ship now. 10500.00.

 

[Clamps]

If I didn't already own one, I'd buy that. It's such an amazing bike. Much better than the SuperDelite (which I've ridden for a few weeks and did not like... so impractical when compared to the Homage, and has "please steal me" written all over it)

 

[Neville Welsh]

If I didn't already own one, I'd buy that. It's such an amazing bike. Much better than the SuperDelite (which I've ridden for a few weeks and did not like... so impractical when compared to the Homage, and has "please steal me" written all over it)

That's interesting? What made you dislike the Superdelite - compared to the Homage?

 

[Spiffyflyer]

It's purely vanity. I have not ridden either.
Especially the homage in my garage. I gave myself 4 weeks to sell the homage. My bike shop offered me a smoken good deal on the superdelite. I am absolutely in love with the color with the superdelite.
I have a few posts offering the homage with zero miles. Lucky for any buyer my bike shop gave me a attractive price where I can pass on the savings selling the homage. It should sell as it is 8 or more weeks to get one now.

 

[Spiffyflyer]

I'm leaning towards keeping the homage. I have been visiting several of my local bike shops. I've been told more and more that a step through is going to be their next bike. I guess I'm not ready to accept the fact that my body is not as agile as it used to be.
So I figured out how I can be happy. I have been shopping for a value priced bike with front suspension and a frame that fits. I am going to build a ebike using a bafang mid drive.
My local REI outdoor sports center has their name brand CO OP bike on sale. I can build a super fast road/gravel/light mountain bike for under 2k. Then I will have the best of both worlds.
I entertained purchasing the superdelite also. Just couldn't wrap my head around having 22k in bikes.

 

[RAB63]

What type of seat is on your Homage?

Yes, I agree, an inbuilt ambient temperature display would be useful.

The lack of it is partially compensated for by the weather screen.

To be able to know what the immediate ambient temperature is, I attached a cheap ($13) digital display temperature probe to the handlebar. It works well but doesn't have back lighting for night-time viewing.

View attachment 130667

View attachment 130668

How do you get to the weather screen? Is is displayed on the Nyon itself or on a phone running eBike connect?

 

[Stefan Mikes]

this is a nice bike thermometer that takes up little handlebar space

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Did you know Richard that Garmin Edge and Wahoo ELEMNT bike GPS computers had the thermometer in them? Just saying.
(You once said you trusted integrated hardware solution. Here's one of them!)

 

[Alaskan]

Did you know Richard that Garmin Edge and Wahoo ELEMNT bike GPS computers had the thermometer in them? Just saying.
(You once said you trusted integrated hardware solution. Here's one of them!)

What is your point? No device is 100% complete and every device lacks something found on others. The device makers play leap frog with product features, software and development. None of the devices you mentioned offers complete information integration with an ebike drive system.

Your noted exception does no negate the rule. Nyon lacks one sensor and data point that is available in Garmin, Wahoo (and on my Hammerhead Karoo2).

Note: With Nyon you get cadence without having to buy and add another sensor, not true for Garmin Wahoo and Karoo. Nyon also gives the rider the most complete past ride data base of the group. finally if your Nyon is connected to your phone there is a weather screen with temperature, forecast etc. for the nearest weather station. An internal thermometer would be a redundancy. Point is each device can claim limited advantages, strengths and weaknesses. Which one is best? It all depends on what you want it to do.

 

[peterh_nz]

How do you get to the weather screen? Is is displayed on the Nyon itself or on a phone running eBike connect?

The screen is selected via one of the screens/tiles setup options on the Nyon. I'm not near the unit at the moment so I currently can't detail the actual selection procedure.

Yes, it's displayed on the Nyon as a full screen tile (see above photo). The met conditions and forecast are updated via a BT connection to your mobile running eBike Connect. Of course, for regular condition updates during a ride a mobile data connection is needed.

There are three different weather parameter views chosen by tapping or swiping the weather screen.

I expect it would be easy and useful for on-bike ambient temperature to be displayed in a corner of the weather screen. However, in saying that, so far there's been little difference between the temperature shown on the on-bike thermometer and the local area temperature displayed on the Nyon.

Cheers

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Note: With Nyon you get cadence without having to buy and add another sensor, not true for Garmin Wahoo

True for Garmin and Wahoo as long as the brands are Giant or Specialized Any newer e-bike from these brands supports the full LEV ANT+ protocol. Just to let you know. Additionally, Garmin and Wahoo provide GPS navigation to the level the Nyon is unable to match. (You do not need to buy a temperature sensor, either).

Karoo 2 is not LEV ANT+ compatible.

 

[peterh_nz]

True for Garmin and Wahoo as long as the brands are Giant or Specialized Any newer e-bike from these brands supports the full LEV ANT+ protocol. Just to let you know. Additionally, Garmin and Wahoo provide GPS navigation to the level the Nyon is unable to match. (You do not need to buy a temperature sensor, either).

Karoo 2 is not LEV ANT+ compatible.

Following an imported GPX works fine in the Nyon navigation function. That's my preferred use regardless of the current Nyon navigation issues. If I remember correctly, you import GPX files created in RideWithGPS into your Wahoo?

Are there online versions of the Wahoo and Garmin bicycle route planning systems?

 

[Stefan Mikes]

If I remember correctly, you import GPX files created in RideWithGPS into your Wahoo?

I often use the RWGPS with my Wahoo, true. The process is very easy because it is like "sharing" a route (you do not think in the GPX terms there); same for Garmin. However, I use the native feature of Wahoo called "Take me to..." as often. You just enter a street address or point at a map location in the ELEMNT Companion App, and the new route is being transferred to the device. No smartphone with you or no mobile internet coverage? Just use the "Pan & Scroll" feature on the device to get to your destination point. (I can hear touchscreen Garmins are even better in this respect).

Are there online versions of the Wahoo and Garmin bicycle route planning systems?

Not for Wahoo. That is, you cannot plan your "Take me to..." route on a PC, for instance.

There is yet another remark. Both RWGPS and Wahoo are cycling related. Therefore, these will select bike-friendly routes, using bike paths whenever available. But you know the problem related to HS e-bikes well, Peter (my Vado is a 45 km/h e-bike). Technically speaking, you cannot ride a HS e-bike on bike paths in Europe (Denmark is the only exception). Therefore, whatever route planning system you have chosen, you won't be allowed on a road if an alternative bike friendly path exists. That causes some trouble for me as I know I am allowed to ride with the traffic but the app or the device are not aware of that...

The segment marked blue is where HS e-bikes are allowed to travel. Bike route planners specifically disallow you riding there.

 

[peterh_nz]

I often use the RWGPS with my Wahoo, true. The process is very easy because it is like "sharing" a route (you do not think in the GPX terms there); same for Garmin. However, I use the native feature of Wahoo called "Take me to..." as often. You just enter a street address or point at a map location in the ELEMNT Companion App, and the new route is being transferred to the device. No smartphone with you or no mobile internet coverage? Just use the "Pan & Scroll" feature on the device to get to your destination point. (I can hear touchscreen Garmins are even better in this respect).


Not for Wahoo. That is, you cannot plan your "Take me to..." route on a PC, for instance.

There is yet another remark. Both RWGPS and Wahoo are cycling related. Therefore, these will select bike-friendly routes, using bike paths whenever available. But you know the problem related to HS e-bikes well, Peter (my Vado is a 45 km/h e-bike). Technically speaking, you cannot ride a HS e-bike on bike paths in Europe (Denmark is the only exception). Therefore, whatever route planning system you have chosen, you won't be allowed on a road if an alternative bike friendly path exists. That causes some trouble for me as I know I am allowed to ride with the traffic but the app or the device are not aware of that...

View attachment 130826
The segment marked blue is where HS e-bikes are allowed to travel. Bike route planners specifically disallow you riding there.

Hello Stefan

The procedures and options you describe for creating routes both on the actual devices and remotely are quite standard/common across the systems I use, have tested or have otherwise assessed. Ditto touch screens, scrolling and offline maps.

That includes the Nyon which also has a touch screen and cursor/select buttons integrated with the power assist level select function cluster on the handlebar.

Your comments have made me more convinced that the problem I experience when using Nyon in-device route planning/routing is simply to do with HS bikes and EU cycle regulations. Turn that constraint off for countries where the regulations do not apply (eg NZ) and problem solved. The glimpses I've had of the underlying Nyon navigation system reveal that it is sophisticated. I forget the name of the company that developed it for Bosch.

Of course all cycle routing systems are "cycle related". Specialist cycle routing algorithms are used, accounting for riding style, trip objectives and topography. And, of course, giving priority use of cycle paths, lanes etc, where practicable.

Sophisticated cycle routing is clearly not the exclusive domain of a couple of brands.

Interestingly it seems that most systems I've come across or use are based on OpenStreetMaps which have very detailed and comprehensive cycle related data sets. This, as far as I know, includes Garmin. Is this also the case with Wahoo?

Cheers

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Interestingly it seems that most systems I've come across or use are based on OpenStreetMaps which have very detailed and comprehensive cycle related data sets. This, as far as I know, includes Garmin. Is this also the case with Wahoo?

Wahoo does not indicate the source of their maps. Or, I could not locate that information.

 

[peterh_nz]

Wahoo does not indicate the source of their maps. Or, I could not locate that information.

Okay. Thanks.

 

[DiggyGun]

Wahoo does not indicate the source of their maps. Or, I could not locate that information.

Bosch use OSM.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Bosch use OSM.
View attachment 130853

Updated?

 

[peterh_nz]

Updated?

As far as I know the latest Nyon map update was last October. Not good enough in these times of rapidly expanding cycle path infrastructure.

In stark contrast, OSMAnd's maps may be updated hourly and by default monthly. I don't know the frequency of updates of Garmin and Wahoo maps.

Cheers

PS: I subsequently did a search and it seems that Wahoo maps are also based on OSM. I see someone has written software to be able update the Wahoo maps more often.