New Riese and Müller Delite Review

[Stefan Mikes]

Congratulations! Nice to hear you being so happy!

Some remarks:
No reason to lock your suspension whatsoever. Suspension locking is only used on steep climbs with traditional MTB to increase the pedalling efficiency. No reason to do it on e-bike. The primary function of the suspension is to maintain the traction at all times. I assume some deep pothole can happen in your area!

I am also very negative to "replacing the Devil with the Satan". In my opinion, Johnny Watts are the ultimate SUV e-bike tyres. Their tread is of dual nature: the hard small knobs in the centre are almost silent on the pavement. The bigger soft ones help on hard cornering and offroad. Why should you replace these marvels with inferior tyres (Marathons)? I'm talking for myself: I will never ever return to Marathons. Not that Marathons are bad. They are just inferior compared to JWs!

 

[Neville Welsh]

Congratulations! Nice to hear you being so happy!

Some remarks:
No reason to lock your suspension whatsoever. Suspension locking is only used on steep climbs with traditional MTB to increase the pedalling efficiency. No reason to do it on e-bike. The primary function of the suspension is to maintain the traction at all times. I assume some deep pothole can happen in your area!

I can agree with that! May I also add that with a healthy dose of rebound one can also avoid "packing" the dampers and the bike will feel quite stiff - which is no bad thing.

 

[Muso]

Some remarks:
No reason to lock your suspension whatsoever. Suspension locking is only used on steep climbs with traditional MTB to increase the pedalling efficiency. No reason to do it on e-bike. The primary function of the suspension is to maintain the traction at all times. I assume some deep pothole can happen in your area!

I only locked it out on nice smooth dedicated bike paths, where I often ride without assist... we actually have a few nice paths in Southern California like the Pacific Electric Trail (some parts of it are pleasant, but not all). I like the occasional exercise of moving this heavy beast of a bike on my own It's actually not that bad without assist as long as the road is flat lol. But yeah, everywhere else I open the shocks. They're the primary reason I got this bike, after all!

I am also very negative to "replacing the Devil with the Satan". In my opinion, Johnny Watts are the ultimate SUV e-bike tyres. Their tread is of dual nature: the hard small knobs in the centre are almost silent on the pavement. The bigger soft ones help on hard cornering and offroad. Why should you replace these marvels with inferior tyres (Marathons)? I'm talking for myself: I will never ever return to Marathons. Not that Marathons are bad. They are just inferior compared to JWs!

Almost silent ;-) They do make some noise and a bit of vibration in the handlebars when riding on the street. Not bad at all though, but it's noticeable. I don't dislike the JWs, but I want to try the Marathons for myself. Which will be a while, since I haven't worn out the JWs yet lol.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

I don't dislike the JWs, but I want to try the Marathons for myself. Which will be a while, since I haven't worn out the JWs yet lol.

There are some old school paving-block bike paths around. Riding Marathons, they behaved erratically there (I felt I was losing control). While Johnny Watts were so good I dedicated a separate thread in these Forums to them. I simply cannot understand what makes you believe Marathons could be better than the premium SUV e-bike JWs. Just because they came stock with your R&M?

 

[Muso]

There are some old school paving-block bike paths around. Riding Marathons, they behaved erratically there (I felt I was losing control). While Johnny Watts were so good I dedicated a separate thread in these Forums to them. I simply cannot understand what makes you believe Marathons could be better than the premium SUV e-bike JWs. Just because they came stock with your R&M?

Nay, the JWs came with the Überbike lol. But I'll check out your thread on them!

 

[Bluebomb]

Loved your review. I agree with almost everything you said. I test rode a delight but I am not getting any younger doesn’t with a dual battery Homage. Had an all electric car a few years ago and batteries have come a ways but range anxiety is very real especially in winter. I also cried about the Rohloff but added it. Went with the low speed for legal reasons. I think you are right if you ride sanely you won’t get caught but I don’t trust myself to be sane. (I was born with a birth defect…lead in my right foot). I have no issues in first 128 miles. Love the Bosch Nyon

 

[Muso]

... but range anxiety is very real especially in winter.

Good point - I live in Southern California so I didn't have to consider cold weather in regard to battery life.

 

[sammcneill]

Good point - I live in Southern California so I didn't have to consider cold weather in regard to battery life.

Just hit winter here in NZ and with my new job commuting to work every day. Seeing battery range decline in the colder days

 

[Brendon@OEB]

Rohloff:

• Less efficient than the chain/derailleur
• Heavy, with wrong weight distribution
• Harder to do any field repair of the rear wheel (a flat)
• Probably susceptible to things that could be picked up and entangled into the drivetrain such as little twigs. It is easy to remove such things on the chain/derailleur system
• If anything goes wrong, hard to find a mechanic to fix the things while the chain/derailleur can be fixed by anyone.

Yes, there are bikepackers who have travelled for half of the world with Rohloff, also on R&M e-bike. However, you will never find a Rohloff on a gravel bike used in ultramarathon races. Your gravel bike weighs 9 kg, you have added a lot of cargo such as several bidons, a saddle bag, a handlebar bag etc, are to ride for 550 km and hopefully win the race and now what? Adding a heavy Rohloff when you often need to lift your gravel bike and carry it through a creek being immersed to your waist in water, or negotiate a huge fallen tree? Come on

Stefan, there's a few points here that missed the mark!

The Rohloff is actually the easiest to repair in the field as you just unplug it and undo the skewer, easier than a chain/derailleur setup! Also servicing the system is pretty easy too and you can get the oil kits to service it yourself. Also the belt drive is much more protected than a chain/derailleur as there's no derailleur cage hanging in harms way. Granted an internally geared up is heavier than a traditional chain/derailleur, you're talking about small amounts of weight on a 50+ lb bike...

 

[Stefan Mikes]

. Granted an internally geared up is heavier than a traditional chain/derailleur, you're talking about small amounts of weight on a 50+ lb bike...

Not on a 37 lb e-bike though.
The IGH makes Como SL the heaviest of Specialized SL e-bikes, almost as heavy as the derailleur Como (a full power e-bike).
You say "unplug Rohloff and release a skewer". What about the belt-guard and retensioning the belt?

My derailleur procedure is:

• Release the clutch
• Downshift to the smallest cog
• Removing the thru-axle
• Removing the wheel.

That complicated?

 

[peterh_nz]

Stefan, there's a few points here that missed the mark!

The Rohloff is actually the easiest to repair in the field as you just unplug it and undo the skewer, easier than a chain/derailleur setup! Also servicing the system is pretty easy too and you can get the oil kits to service it yourself. Also the belt drive is much more protected than a chain/derailleur as there's no derailleur cage hanging in harms way. Granted an internally geared up is heavier than a traditional chain/derailleur, you're talking about small amounts of weight on a 50+ lb bike...

I agree. When I first changed the rear tyre on my S2 equiped with an E14 I was surprised that removing and reinstalling the wheel was even easier than my other bike that has a chain/derailleur.

Because I don't ride competitively, and if I felt it relevant, I would consider component weight in relation to total weight of bike plus rider.

Does it really matter, especially if you enjoy riding the bike you have with the parts and accessories you've chosen?

Cheers

 

[peterh_nz]

Not on a 37 lb e-bike though.
The IGH makes Como SL the heaviest of Specialized SL e-bikes, almost as heavy as the derailleur Como (a full power e-bike).
You say "unplug Rohloff and release a skewer". What about the belt-guard and retensioning the belt?

My derailleur procedure is:

• Release the clutch
• Downshift to the smallest cog
• Removing the thru-axle
• Removing the wheel.

That complicated?

In my experience the belt does not need retensioning. The wheel/axle easily slides back to its previous preset position and therefore belt tension.

 

[sammcneill]

In my experience the belt does not need retensioning. The wheel/axle easily slides back to its previous preset position and therefore belt tension

Same for me.

 

[Brendon@OEB]

Not on a 37 lb e-bike though.
The IGH makes Como SL the heaviest of Specialized SL e-bikes, almost as heavy as the derailleur Como (a full power e-bike).
You say "unplug Rohloff and release a skewer". What about the belt-guard and retensioning the belt?

My derailleur procedure is:

• Release the clutch
• Downshift to the smallest cog
• Removing the thru-axle
• Removing the wheel.

That complicated?

For most folks yes this is very complicated.

 

[AvalancheRun]

Been curious to hear a comparison to the Priority Current with its enormous 140 nm of torque. Based on the one YouTube video that exists of the Current doing a hill climb, I’m not surprised to hear that it’s roughly on par with the Performance Line Speed/CX (85 nm).

Could they be measuring torque performance differently & is there a standardized method that all manufacturers use?

 

[Muso]

Been curious to hear a comparison to the Priority Current with its enormous 140 nm of torque. Based on the one YouTube video that exists of the Current doing a hill climb, I’m not surprised to hear that it’s roughly on par with the Performance Line Speed/CX (85 nm).

Could they be measuring torque performance differently & is there a standardized method that all manufacturers use?

That's one of the things I was wondering. I haven't seen anything resembling a standard for this. Of course, that doesn't mean one doesn't exist, but I sure haven't found it. What input current at what rpm, for instance? How about showing the torque plotted on a curve? It seems to me there's a bit of room for fudging things in the advertising.

Having owned both bikes, hills on the Delite are about the same as the Current in a roughly similar gear, even with the Delite being a heavier bike. With the Rohloff, the Delite is much better. After a few months, I'm still thrilled with this bike!

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Been curious to hear a comparison to the Priority Current with its enormous 140 nm of torque. Based on the one YouTube video that exists of the Current doing a hill climb, I’m not surprised to hear that it’s roughly on par with the Performance Line Speed/CX (85 nm).

Could they be measuring torque performance differently & is there a standardized method that all manufacturers use?

The torque figure only exists on paper. What really matters is the Motor Mechanical Peak Power (which is, for example, given by Specialized in their whitepaper). Also, specifying the maximum electrical power instead of the mechanical power is the marketing thing.