Watt Wagons Critical Product Availability Status

[Cuz Vinny]

Page recently updated

Critical Product Availability Status

We are taking a step towards providing additional transparency on our component, bike, accessories availability and shipping times. We are trying not to get too granular but provide a more macro visibility on delays / shipping and any delays with your order. We plan to update it every week...

wattwagons.com

 

[Fast n' Furious]

These are trying times with a lot of chaos and we appreciate transparency.
The above CPAS page was last updated on 9/21/21, now begs several questions.
Motors: Next batch of motors was delayed due to chip shortage. Original ETA was 8/31, new ETA was 10/30.
Status please.
Ti Frames: All ETAs Late October / early November at the earliest.
Any news on factory production/ shipping?
Controllers: What's the story with Archon?
Will this affect all the Ultras? Do we have to downgrade expectations of 2.3Kw orders to 1Kw controllers?
I'm hoping Pushkar takes time to addresses 'status' and realistic outlook matters to us soon.
Fn'F

 

[blueskyca]

I received an response from WW 11/15 that my Hydra Black would be delivered early - late November, then 5 days later received an email saying they were being delayed to Jan 31 at the earliest. Last 2 emails to WW have been non responsive. Any clues what is going on?

 

[WaxedWookie]

I appreciate that there has been a string of logistical challenges, but the level of transparency from Watt Wagons is concerning.

• The last update to the status table on the website was 9/08/2021.
• The "we answer immediately" chat on the website appears to be unstaffed and unresponsive.
• My support tickets have been ignored for the last month.
• I haven't had any meaningful updates via email at all (although I'm getting spam)
• There's been no meaningful update on these forums in months (Pushkar's last response in this thread was more than 6 months ago)
• I've had to chase up every couple of months to get any kind of update on the timeline, and commitment after commitment has been missed with little to no explanation.

I know I haven't been waiting as long as others (sorry Helios buyers - but from what I've seen, this is consistent with the experience you've had), but my shipping date has slipped from ~08/16 to 10/06 to ~11/4 to who knows when without any proactive communication, and now I've been ignored for a month by a company that is holding a few months' of my salary.

Delays happen - that's understandable - particularly given recent global events. The silence isn't. Putting aside the ongoing fit and finish issues I've seen (paint, cabling, chainline, etc.), Watt Wagons can't expect to be taken seriously as a premium brand if they're ignoring their customers creditors like this.

@pushkar what's going on over there? A more substantive update/explanation is months overdue.

 

[greeno]

Crickets, crickets, crickets..... Sad I guess no one is manning the helm.
On this website I had some questions on another manufacturer's section on a new bike they are coming out with and the actual owner answered that same day. So I asked a few more questions and those were answered as well. Why is this so hard for some companies to do. Once a reputation is damaged it's hard to rebuild.

This brand has lost me as a customer or supporter unfortunately.
To get support you gotta provide support to your customers, I learned that my first day in my high school business class back in 1975. I guess nowadays there are different priorities for companies to follow.
In trying times only the strong survive.

 

[Fast n' Furious]

Old post. Problem happens again, check here https://california-ebike.com/shop/gasket-bafang-g510-ultra-motor-cover/

 

[Merle Nelson]

Old post. Problem happens again, check here https://california-ebike.com/shop/gasket-bafang-g510-ultra-motor-cover/

F&F did you mean to post this in another thread?

 

[Fast n' Furious]

I hope this is relevant and appropriate. I do blunder a bit. lol
But I say: let us continue to support and have faith in Pushkar.
Demanding answers will only lead to "I don't know" - How could he?
He was savvy enough to put these products together and I think whatever happens, he'll have done his best. For me, that's all I can ask.
This was a matter of faith from the start. Would I prefer he was prescient and stopped future orders, or fought on and went down in flames?
I clicked 'buy' for my Cross Tour in October, knowing what is now happening would. Perhaps it's different for those waiting several months prior.
I'd've had a lot less faith if he'd stopped all future production orders.
We're seeing failures at the foundations of institutions long assumed, taught at Phd level economics as correct.
The fabulous worldwide "Just in Time Trade" economy, now = millions of bottlenecks, that will destroy millions of businesses.
Pushkar can create the best outcome - if he doesn't have a nervous breakdown. So I keep the faith in my decision and cheer for him.
But look at this stuff below.
And take care
-
11/26/21: China is now quarantining returning cargo ship crews for up to seven weeks.
Winter is coming. A deadlier variant is on the loose.
The Automatic Identification System (AIS) — which relies on ships to send data to stations along the coastline or via satellites — has witnessed a massive plunge in the signals it receives in recent weeks.
Data from market intelligence and valuations provider VesselsValue show the number of signals in Chinese waters plunging 85% in under a month — from more than 100,000 a day on October 28 to over 15,000 a day on November 17.
The steep decline comes after China Personal Information Protection Law came into effect on November 1. The new rules regulate how domestic and foreign organizations collect and export the country's data.
There are no specific guidelines on shipping data due to the new regulations, but some domestic providers in China have stopped providing information to foreign companies due to the law, Reuters reported earlier this month.

The questions: Is China covering up a massive shipping back-up and slowdown, or being opaque due to privacy concerns?
Why the sudden switch, abandoning reporting? Privacy? In China?
-
Germany's current outbreak is more than twice as bad as they've faced in the last three surges.
Never mind the media (Opinion). You can track everything (the depressing facts and graphs) https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/germany/.
Norway? Same story - Winter is coming https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/norway/ except three times worse now than ever before.
Since my birthday, in Mar 2020 I've relied upon worldometers.info for a lot of information for many judgement calls.
I was ready and during the lockdowns I rode my machine and fished - mostly at night. The emptiness was eerie.
Like ghosts in the fog, during the first wave I'd encounter brethren, we'd nod, giving wide berth (our secret rule being a 10' rod's length) in passing, and ask: Are the corbina biting?
I don't have a crystal ball, but when the bait-shop opens, I'm stocking up. Winter is coming.
Yes, Pushkar needs to speak up. Just as we need to be prepared for the answers. We can't blame at the answerer. We're not rabble.
'Just in time' has become 'maybe some day' with a side order of 'no information' salad.
The Hydra Black offer led to a lot of orders - then trade lines started sputtering and collapsed.
Other issues like paint and QC on chain-lines, are 'lack of staff' related - We all have private lives. During a pandemic, when specialized technicians become unavailable, or a paint shop is short-handed there will be errors.
I appreciate the suggestion I 'make it know I'll take what's available' in parts.
A reason I ordered a chain & M7's. I only to now worry about them having my 197mm CT frame - they sold Deacon, lol.
-
Can't wait for my CT - to extend my range to over 30 miles.
Surf fishing will be great this winter, but I can't safely do the beach w/ my 27.5" x 2.75'er machine - sigh.
Maybe April deliver - if I get lucky - just in time for the Halibut.
-
Chin up and stiff upper lip !

Fn'F

 

[Fast n' Furious]

Crickets, crickets, crickets..... Sad I guess no one is manning the helm.
On this website I had some questions on another manufacturer's section on a new bike they are coming out with and the actual owner answered that same day. So I asked a few more questions and those were answered as well. Why is this so hard for some companies to do. Once a reputation is damaged it's hard to rebuild.

This brand has lost me as a customer or supporter unfortunately.
To get support you gotta provide support to your customers, I learned that my first day in my high school business class back in 1975. I guess nowadays there are different priorities for companies to follow.
In trying times only the strong survive.

Hi there homeboy ... No telling.
I can think of a lot of reasons.

F&F did you mean to post this in another thread?

It was a reply about the raging hunt for G510 gaskets. They're available now and bottlenecks are backing up.

 

[Merle Nelson]

Ahh, thank you. Now I understand.

 

[greeno]

Dude put the bottle down... Having the common decency to answer someone's specific question or respond to a request on their OWN website and getting ZERO answers, good or bad that is the question of the day, week, month, year.

And IMO Covid, shipping, China, Germany (really Germany) have absolutely NOTHING to do with lack of communication from this particular company. Years past when I had my own company I'm pretty sure on page 1 of my business plan was to take care of my customers. Your past customers is what influences your future ones, again IMO.

 

[Zachdds]

Support tickets being ignored does not speak well for customer support or warranty coverage.

Answering questions about orders when the delivery time get pushed by months is common decency. It is not like these guys are putting down a small payment to hold their spots in line. No they are purchasing a whole
Bike that is quite possibly still in the raw materials stage somewhere in China. In line but getting pushed to the back every time Luna or biktrix or any other bigger player orders a whole container.

Is it Pushkar’s fault? Other then blowing through self imposed timeframes probably not, but the buck stops with him. Do you expect the customer to call the manufacturer in China to find out when he realistically get his bike? Should he just not care when he is going to get a bike that he has already plopped down thousands for? If the timeframe is “I don’t know” should the buyer know that before buying the bike?

Pushkar is a nice guy, watts wagon is rolling out some sweet bikes, but I do not understand why it is ok to not follow up with customers both before and after their bike is delivered.

 

[Fast n' Furious]

Crickets, crickets, crickets..... Sad I guess no one is manning the helm.
On this website I had some questions on another manufacturer's section on a new bike they are coming out with and the actual owner answered that same day. So I asked a few more questions and those were answered as well. Why is this so hard for some companies to do. Once a reputation is damaged it's hard to rebuild.

This brand has lost me as a customer or supporter unfortunately.
To get support you gotta provide support to your customers, I learned that my first day in my high school business class back in 1975. I guess nowadays there are different priorities for companies to follow.
In trying times only the strong survive.

I think all will agree I'm no apologist. Having said that, as a fully invested Buyer, here's my take.
A few months back, I had Amit answer my chat request - by text - while he was preparing to go out, at 9:00pm (EST) on a Friday night, to celebrate with friends.
I believe the site was 'upgraded' - because of inconsiderate - intentionally or otherwise - prospective customers (like me), in San Diego, rudely not considering time zones - the chat feature has changed and now submits a ticket.
I've no idea what I was thinking. This is a family operation, small shop with minimal staff and I'm asking ignorant questions after 5pm.
22 inquiries, twice a day that take 10 minutes each to read, manage and reply is a full workday's period - if I worked non-stop, but for lunch.
I'm not Mother Theresa's generosity level at forgiving sins, but Have Mercy!
-
My last ticket was answered in 2 days, I'll be submitting another shortly regarding my 'granting permission to use other parts' - even go with the lower wattage X1 - to get this party started. I'm confident.
Never mind, we don't hear the myriad non-problems, only anxious expectation's failing, pain of learning and insecurities over such a substantial investment was a (boo, hoo) mistake.
Even those seem problems go 'poof' when the owner is back in the saddle and those that do speak up, cite high praise.
WW may not be focusing on 'prospective' new customers, because as you say, you require a lot of answers before even choosing what you want, so you don't really even know the brand.
These machines (esp. the Titaniums) being virtually unique, there are no other manufacturers to contact
Another business axiom is 'you have to try harder when you're second place', but in this case, no matter how they portray themselves, there is no second place after WW.
This is a small shop, family owned. Considering their small output, 'add-ons' - like 'call-center routing' - would raise the price/ management/ employees ... an expansion in not-so-hot business climes - with additional expenses and commitments ... when the present ones looming are overwhelming.
It does look like (let me take this opportunity to blame Hydra Black buyers - and start a riot. lol) 'expanding' is a part of the problem .
Don't take it personal, but two answers in a day sound's kind of desperate.
We're clamoring to order and ready to compromise.
This company has integrity - forget about them providing the keys to the city. It's a special club that worships Ultimate performance.
I think we'll start getting answers soon.

East Village FnF

 

[blueskyca]

FYI - chatting on the WW website will usually get you an instant response from a human, although you may not like the answer. I didn't like the answer I got...

 

[Fast n' Furious]

Dude put the bottle down... Having the common decency to answer someone's specific question or respond to a request on their OWN website and getting ZERO answers, good or bad that is the question of the day, week, month, year.

And IMO Covid, shipping, China, Germany (really Germany) have absolutely NOTHING to do with lack of communication from this particular company. Years past when I had my own company I'm pretty sure on page 1 of my business plan was to take care of my customers. Your past customers is what influences your future ones, again IMO.

I'm'a be cool n' try and sound nice.
I'm sure you're correct - having no skin in the game, except an entitled attitude - but Sir? : A twice-a-day 'I don't know what I want', 'please tell me why I cant have a rocket motor', 'tell me a story, tell me a story', 'help me, help me, help me' pest is not a "customer".
WW's not my psychiatrist to tell me how to make up my mind. I'm distressed at paying for 'bottle' feeding lazy, demanding answers at will.
They have paying customers with minds made up to babysit, so forgive my lack of sensitivity to your angst,
Who comments vitriol on 'availability status' without an order in place?
How is a "well known member", unaware of WW's panache, just now suddenly asking questions?
Why do you care what's available, if you don't know what you want?
I just say I, and the people I respect on these forums trust Pushkar. Perplexed? Yes. Confident it will work out? Certainly.
Clamoring in the 'owner crowd' asking questions, screaming "get 'em" (wearing a "LUNA" T-shirt), seems just plain wrong somehow and adds nothing but chaos.
I don't care if you can't understand, don't like or refuse to recognize there are extenuating circumstances; don't believe me; don't know the IGH's come from Germany and Norway.
This affects invested owners, so that's what I'm speaking to.
I do thank you for your perspective.
On with the topic

 

[Fast n' Furious]

Cut loose Already I went with Biktrix dealer from Canada. They can deliver 5 working order ebikes out of the box.

The Capro? That was you from the start.
lol
Fn'F

 

[Zachdds]

we had a whole sub forum that felt the same way you do. That was 2 years ago. We were confident it was going to work out. It didn’t.

When things would go quiet, the bad news was right around the corner.

In the end the customer is right. If he needs to ask 10 questions before buying a 10k bike then that is what he needs. It isn’t like you can go to your local bike shop and sit on one and take it for a spin. No you are buying a bike that cost more then my first car based on some pictures from a small bike shop that has literally no idea as to when you will get your bike (that you have already paid full price for) and has recently left a group of 20 people without a bike and slowly getting refunded 1k at a time.

 

[greeno]

Fn'F better pump the brakes amigo before you come at me. Perfect name by the way. Couple things I wanna clear up.
The "Chat feature when you inquire about a subject does as you state generate a "Work ticket" and says that they will get back to you.
But what do you do when they DON'T get back to you or answer your question?

Entitled attitude? I know your not referring to me or we have an issue we can discuss offline if you choose.
I stumbled onto WW a little over a year ago and even purchased a DS frame he was currently stocking ( doesn't stock anymore ) and we actually talked on the phone and I agreed to purchase an Ultra motor with the X1 upgrade. Just starting up his company and 100% supportive on his efforts. Said he was shipping that weekend..... Didn't ship for 2 more weeks, but I digress. So after building up my bike a buddy wants the same frame and motor combo to do the same so he places his order as I did. Delays in getting his order to. Hmm common thread?
As far as "suddenly asking questions" I have asked a total of (2) to WW on their website. I had to ask the same question 2x and then I did get a response from Amet saying that I would be better going directly to the frame manufacturer (Exess) in Germany's website as they don't carry that brand anymore. Great follow up service.

Last post on this subject so listen up Fn'F.
My only comments about Mr. P or WW is concerning their lack of communication to their customers. Period. Delays in shipping, lack of parts has nothing to do with being straight up with the people that have gave you their hard earned cash.
Luna is a perfect example of how not to deal with customers and I was sad to see WW fall into this category. The boys up north have no com skills as far as service is concerned. Even went up there a number of times for warranty issues or whatnot and got the same blank stare. Growing a successful business is a process of smart decisions. ignoring your cleints isn't on that list.
Now Im done.

 

[Fast n' Furious]

Fn'F better pump the brakes amigo before you come at me. Perfect name by the way. Couple things I wanna clear up.
The "Chat feature when you inquire about a subject does as you state generate a "Work ticket" and says that they will get back to you.
But what do you do when they DON'T get back to you or answer your question?

Entitled attitude? I know your not referring to me or we have an issue we can discuss offline if you choose.
I stumbled onto WW a little over a year ago and even purchased a DS frame he was currently stocking ( doesn't stock anymore ) and we actually talked on the phone and I agreed to purchase an Ultra motor with the X1 upgrade. Just starting up his company and 100% supportive on his efforts. Said he ("He" who?) was shipping that weekend..... Didn't ship for 2 more weeks, but I digress. So, after building up my bike, a buddy wants the same frame and motor combo to do the same, so he places his order as I did. Delays in getting his order too. Hmm common thread?
As far as "suddenly asking questions" I have (suddenly) asked a total of (2) to WW on their website. I (was entitled, I wouldn't wait for an answer and) had to ask the same question 2x and then I did get a response from Amet (Amit, politely disabusing me of my misconceptions,) saying that I would be better going directly to the frame manufacturer (Exess) in Germany's website as they don't carry that brand anymore. Great follow up service.

Last post on this subject so listen up Fn'F.
My only comments about Mr. P or WW is concerning their lack of communication to their customers. (This problem seems to be growing. Why only last week, the CEO of Microsoft refused to return my repeated calls. Three days I waited for a response). Period. Delays in shipping, lack of parts has nothing to do with being straight up with the people that have gave you their hard earned cash. tho I haven't given anyone a cent and awaiting nothing have nothing coming, in reality.
Luna is a perfect example of how not to deal with customers (It's just impossible to find good help these days!) and I was sad to see WW fall into this category. The boys up north have no com skills as far as service is concerned (and pampered boys down south don't like it). Even went up there a number of times for warranty issues or whatnot and got the same blank stare (which proves decisions I later regret - as with us all - arise and we getting the same reaction when we ask dumb questions). Growing a successful business is a process of smart decisions (, a lot of blunders, investment, hard work and timing; determination; knowledge; stamina; luck and plans). ignoring your cleints isn't on that list (, just look my successful business and you'll get the comparison ).
Now Im done .

"Pump the brakes before" I "come at you"? Pffffft. "So listen up"? Bwaaaahahahaha !!!! Oh please , "Amigo". Okay. I get it.
Back on topic:
My perspective is I came knowing what I wanted and they make it - or I'd buy the same frame (because I know where to) - taking the time, energy, mistakes and research they did to make one machine I wanted. I'd be in a worse position than I am now if I had gone it alone.
I started with a conclusion, not browsing asea.
I'd place my order again, just as I did , but I'm starving for answers - personal problem/ anxieties.
No, I can't think bad of the crew at WW.
Surest way to destroy a company is short them - even in my mind. I'm staying positive. I support the mission.
The issue now is critical availability status - now. The outlook - now - is NEGATIVE.
The cause of my lack of patience is my degree/ sense of entitlement/ my investment created, but nonetheless I trust I'll get the best they can produce for me in a Titanium G510.
-
WW holds world records. Founded Date Oct 1, 2018, lifelong reputations are at stake here.
A first experience: "A little over a year ago", was during a pandemic and I ordered 45 days ago, an investment with an attitude that 'this may be the last chance'.
A failure to comprehend the magnitude of the trade situation, will not "make it so, Scotty" and when this dust settles, many things will be gone forever. I don't think WW will be one.
No I won't meet you'se in TJ to duel over tequila about 'entitlement'. One is or is not entitled to prompt service.
-
On topic, I'd like to hear more from the Founders.
I know there's some bad news. Anything that can be broken gently?

Thanks,

Fn'F

 

[Fast n' Furious]

we had a whole sub forum that felt the same way you do. That was 2 years ago. We were confident it was going to work out. It didn’t.

When things would go quiet, the bad news was right around the corner.

In the end the customer is right. If he needs to ask 10 questions before buying a 10k bike then that is what he needs. It isn’t like you can go to your local bike shop and sit on one and take it for a spin. No you are buying a bike that cost more then my first car based on some pictures from a small bike shop that has literally no idea as to when you will get your bike (that you have already paid full price for) and has recently left a group of 20 people without a bike and slowly getting refunded 1k at a time.

WW has added a new model to the line-up.