new anti chain drop gear for road bikes cues us, too

[Reid]

https://cyclingtips.com/2018/04/shimano-debuts-ultegra-rx-rear-derailleur-with-a-clutch/

First of all, this isn’t an April Fools joke.

Shimano is bringing mountain bike tech to the road with its new Ultegra RX rear derailleur, featuring the clutch used in most mountain bike derailleurs to prevent chain slap and dropped chains...

...Clutch mechanisms are ubiquitous in mountain bike derailleurs and are a pivotal part of a functional single-chainring drivetrain, usually paired with a 1x-specific narrow-wide chainring. On a normal derailleur, the only thing preventing the pulley cage from bouncing forward is spring tension. With a clutch, the pulley cage resists forward movement but returns to its original position at a normal rate. A clutch allows the derailleur to maintain proper chain tension over rough surfaces. The result is far less chain slap and flop, and thus a decreased likelihood of dropping a chain, chainsuck, or mis-shifts.

I have not had a chain drop since going to a Shimano clutch-type, long cage derailleur and a 10S 11-42 cassette and for extra insurance, a narrow-wide 56 tooth chainring. (While I did not really need 10 speeds, the clutch system is not available in 9 speed. And the wide ratio new cassette is an improvement because even with the larger chainring the first gear is considerably lower than before and the highest gear permits considerably easier cadence at speed than the regular 52 tooth chainring.)

 

[Chris Hammond]

Reid. I had forgotten you went with the 56T front chainring. (With the wider gearing and bigger chainring, what is your final chainlength?) I know you are in Florida and probably don't have many hills, but I am curious what your cadence is like at higher speeds (ie 30-35 mph). I have been thinking about this for a while. My road bike that I am using as my commuter until my CCS arrives has the same top gearing as a stock CCS, (52T chainring/ 11T cassette), rolling on 700C x 25 tires, so the slightly larger 700C x 45 tires will push the final gearing up ever so slightly. On my road bike, I essentially lose the ability to provide meaningful pedal assistance riding downhill at around 37 mph, but obviously before that, my cadence is pretty high (probably 120+ rpm). Any feedback would be appreciated.

 

[Reid]

Reid. I had forgotten you went with the 56T front chainring. (With the wider gearing and bigger chainring, what is your final chainlength?) I know you are in Florida and probably don't have many hills, but I am curious what your cadence is like at higher speeds (ie 30-35 mph). I have been thinking about this for a while. My road bike that I am using as my commuter until my CCS arrives has the same top gearing as a stock CCS, (52T chainring/ 11T cassette), rolling on 700C x 25 tires, so the slightly larger 700C x 45 tires will push the final gearing up ever so slightly. On my road bike, I essentially lose the ability to provide meaningful pedal assistance riding downhill at around 37 mph, but obviously before that, my cadence is pretty high (probably 120+ rpm). Any feedback would be appreciated.

Chain length is 121 or 122 links, could be made longer but not much shorter.

I had to buy two KMC X10.93 half nickel/half black oxide chains and add sufficient links to the 116 links of the one chain. With two quick links (the reusable kind) I am all set for the life of the chain.

There is a really easy to use cadence calculator that will precisely answer your cadence questions.

I chose that 56 tooth chainring linked in my first post because Tora offered 56T as an upgrade option, so we know 56T fits.

The ebay seller also has it in 58T but I passed on that because I was not sure enough that 58T would clear the chainstay. Probably not, or Tora the speed champ would have offered it, betcha. BTW, 58T is not too tall a gear for an ebike going 28mph. Or 37, for that matter!


I hope this helps you, Chris.

 

[Asher]

Shimano made a brilliant groupset... And then proceeded to drown it in obscurity. Metrea, 1X with disc brakes, for athletic urban riding (think in between road and city style bikes). Not sure about for ebikes, but this sounds like a dream for pedal bikes. Something fast but practical for city riding.

Looks like they're worried about competition from SRAMs 1X.

 

[Fildil]

What is the BCD (bolt center diameter) for these chainrings? Thanks.

 

[Nova Haibike]

Shimano made a brilliant groupset... And then proceeded to drown it in obscurity. Metrea, 1X with disc brakes, for athletic urban riding

Metrea is the modern equivalent to Shimano's Sante group of the 80's; a high end group with flashy/slick cosmetics.

Looks like they're worried about competition from SRAMs 1X.

Nah, not the same target consumer at all.

 

[Reid]

What is the BCD (bolt center diameter) for these chainrings? Thanks.

CCS uses the 130mm BCD standard.

 

[Dunbar]

As a 40K+ mile road cyclist I’m struggling to see the utility of this derailleur for riding on pavement. I’ve never had any issues with dropping chains on my road bikes outside of an improperly adjusted front derailleur. Perhaps they are aiming this more towards the gravel/adventure (road) bike niche that emerged in the last few years.

 

[Chris Hammond]

As a 40K+ mile road cyclist I’m struggling to see the utility of this derailleur for riding on pavement. I’ve never had any issues with dropping chains on my road bikes outside of an improperly adjusted front derailleur. Perhaps they are aiming this more towards the gravel/adventure (road) bike niche that emerged in the last few years.

Some road bikes are starting to be available with 1x drivetrains. I watched a video the other day about a road racing team that is planning on using 1X in competition. Chain drops are an inevitable occurence on a 1x drivetrain when you have no front derailler to keep the chain running over the chainring. Thus the solutions to the problem you see proposed here. MTB have been working on this problem for years.

 

[Fildil]

At this point I have removed 6 links from the stock chain. Park Tools has a Youtube video explaining how to determine a good chain length and I used it to shorten my chain. So far (2 rides) and no drops.

 

[Reid]

At this point I have removed 6 links from the stock chain. Park Tools has a Youtube video explaining how to determine a good chain length and I used it to shorten my chain. So far (2 rides) and no drops.

That was my experience, too. But after a couple of weeks, the chain drops began to reoccur with increasing frequency. It is presumed that the spring tension began to fall off; the spring taking a set, weakening.

 

[Captain Slow]

I got another chain drop riding to work yesterday. In 3 months of riding to work I've had more chain drops on this bike than in 30+ years of riding my other bikes. I'm definitely going to replace the rear derailleur.

I never appreciated how a derailleur could affect chain drops.

 

[Trail Cruiser]

I got another chain drop riding to work yesterday. In 3 months of riding to work I've had more chain drops on this bike than in 30+ years of riding my other bikes. I'm definitely going to replace the rear derailleur.

I never appreciated how a derailleur could affect chain drops.

You might be interested on putting a chain guide to prevent it from happening again.

http://kochdoch.info/mountain-bike-...ates-retention-with-new-lightweight-guides-9/

 

[Chris Hammond]

I ran accross this video yesterday on a homemade chain guide. Looks pretty simple. Might be worth a try. While I appreciate the permanence of conversion to a 10S clutch derailleur system, I'm don't feel like the >$150 price tag is worth it.

 

[Chris Hammond]

I got another chain drop riding to work yesterday. In 3 months of riding to work I've had more chain drops on this bike than in 30+ years of riding my other bikes. I'm definitely going to replace the rear derailleur.

I never appreciated how a derailleur could affect chain drops.

Captain, you will need to replace more than just the rear derailleur. Nobody is making a 9 speed clutch derailleur at this point, and the conversion to 10 speed requires all components to be changed (derailleur, cassette, chain, shifter) this is due to different index ratio's on 9 vs 10 speed systems. Thus it will cost at least $150 to do the conversion. A chain guide is less expensive, although, the one Juiced recommends on their website is $70 on Amazon. I'm looking for a more cost effective solution. If I have to pay $70, I'll probably just bike the bullet and convert to 10S.

 

[Fildil]

I am using the Third Eye chainwatch to prevent the chain from dropping inside the chainwheel. I have reshaped the bash guard to make it harder for the chain to drop on the outside. I also bought a better quality chain with just 116 links.

https://www.amazon.com/Third-Eye-Bicycle-Chainwatcher-Universal/dp/B000AO3HO2

 

[DanInStPete]

4 weeks and 400+ miles and not one chain drop. Did Juiced change anything?

For $9 though this looks like a good precaution. Really don’t want to spend $59.99 on the one they recommend unless I have to.

 

[Chris Hammond]

I am using the Third Eye chainwatch to prevent the chain from dropping inside the chainwheel. I have reshaped the bash guard to make it harder for the chain to drop on the outside. I also bought a better quality chain with just 116 links.

https://www.amazon.com/Third-Eye-Bicycle-Chainwatcher-Universal/dp/B000AO3HO2

View attachment 20918

Fildil, Thanks so much for the pic. I had seen that one, but didn't think it would work on a CCS. For $9 I will happily give this a try. Your picture makes this look like a simple effective solution.