2020 -Top 10 Ebikes With The Bafang G510 Ultra

[Ebiker33]

There is a reason some of the top bikes are using this motor, pure power 160 NM equal 118 foot lbs. of torque, the Bosch is a very good motor but at only 75nm of torque that is only 55 foot pounds of torque, and really it's designed for the European market not the North American market. If you want to climb grade with weight you are going to be limited at some point. The bikes that are changing to the Gates Drive system have done so because aggressive riders that push this motor to it's limits are busting chains like crazy, one customer busting 5 within a year. Basically if the motor is tuned to 1600 watts plus, your chains life will be greatly reduced, if you are pushing it. The bikes that are using chains seem to be using KMC Ebike specific ones. As well Bafang knows this motor is good but it needs further software tuning, I was just watching a video from their factory, where they specifically had riders going out testing different software configurations to improve that aspect.

The list is by price highest to lowest, it's up to each person to discover what the best value is for them, links provided.

#1 Watt Wagon-Cross Tour $7299.00
Of note Titanium frame fully loaded and always improving, fat tire style, they also make a commuter but I wanted to pick just one from each brand.
Watt Wagon Cross Tour

#2 EXCESS From Germany $6965.00
Of note they are a one model only type company, carbon fiber frame with the upgraded G510 Excess controller which I included in the price, that controller is suppose to really improve the tuning.
EXCESS

#3 LUNA Cycle-Apollo $5550.00
Of note Carbon fiber frame with probably the very best battery of all these Ebikes 52V 21Amp/hrs with upgraded cells, batteries is their specialty, so this should be of no surprise, also they have also tuned their G510 to higher specifications.
LUNA Apollo

#4 FLX - Blade 2 $5269.00
Of note 2020 model has changed the frame and drive train, looks very good, I took the fully loaded price, as that is what I would buy.
FLX BLADE 2

#5 Biktrix Juggernaut Ultra 1000 $4229.00
Of note I put the upgrades in, they have had more time with this motor as they were one of the first to get it to market, getting more economical now for price under $5K
BIKTRIX Juggernaut Ultra

#6 FREY- EX PRO $4010.00
Of note this bike has duel 48 volt 14 amp/hr batteries one inside the tube and one outside, the ultimate long distance runner.
FREY EX PRO

#7 M2S Bikes All Terrain Ultra FS - $3499.00
The only reason it beat out the one below is because it has 29 reviews average 5/5 stars which I felt was worth capturing the 7th spot.
MS2 ULTRA FS

#8 Volton- A-Trail EMTB -$3499.00
Used the upgraded motor package to get to this.
VOLTON A TRAIL EMTB

#9 Rize - RX - $2799.00
Just changed from Sparks and re-branded to Rize, a very thrifty price for what you actually get.
Rize RX

#10 BPM F-1000 - $2395.00
This is the most economical of the bunch.
BPM F-1000

I know there are more out there, but I think this is a good list with high to low prices.
Edited in a #10 as per the posts below, top 10 sounds better anyways.

 

[TomD]

Frey CC is another model worth mentioning. Probably a more comfortable commuter than any of the above. $3K + shipping (which is expensive unless you get in on the group buy which is still $300 vs. $800+ otherwise).

Best Value off road Electric Mountain Bike | Frey Ebike

Frey electric bikes are known for superior performance and reliable quality, and for long range ebike and big power ebike. It is a famous brand & manufacturer of the best off road electric bike for adults. We produce affordable electric bikes and accept OEM. USA/Europe warehouses for fast delivery.

www.frey.bike

If you want to go even cheapert than the Rize here is another option (not that I recommend it, sometimes you get what you pay for)

2020 FAT-HD New review

Eunorau Fat-HD electric bike review: 1000 watt mid-drive goes the distance The Eunorau Fat-HD electric bike is an incredibly powerful mid-drive with fat tires, front suspension and a hefty battery to help it power through the mud, snow, sand and pretty much anything else you can throw at it...

electricbikereview.com

At first I thought it was a BBSHD but seems to be an Ultra judging by the 160nm torque spec and torque sensing. 2,159.10 shipped with EUNORAU promo code.

 

[Ravi Kempaiah]

@troehrkasse and @Angela M.
Is it possible to move this thread to Bafang sub-forum so readers can find this?

@Ebiker33:
Excellent compilation!
Specific topics can get buried under general discussion but if it is also tagged under Bafang forum, interested readers can access this info much more easily and actually make use of this.

 

[fooferdoggie]

I doubt most people need that much torque. My energy levels are low because of my wacky body but my Bosch has enough torque to get me good speed. Most hills with weight on the back and I am doing 15. Only when I get past 14 degree grade is it lacking. Having a efficient motor that does not need a huge battery is great.

 

[TomD]

Same motor.

fooferdoggie, you're correct that most probably don't need that much torque. I have no problem pedaling up hills with assist from my Bafang BBS01 in low gear ( I'm guessing it has less torque the latest generation of euro spec motors). That said it's nice to have raw power when you need it. I went with an Ultra because it's the only Bafang motor with torque sensing that you can program. Not to mention I could get a bike with twice the power for roughly half the price.

 

[Ebiker33]

I doubt most people need that much torque. My energy levels are low because of my wacky body but my Bosch has enough torque to get me good speed. Most hills with weight on the back and I am doing 15. Only when I get past 14 degree grade is it lacking. Having a efficient motor that does not need a huge battery is great.

If you live in the middle of North America or have flat areas in Europe you would be correct, but if I am tooling around Whistler, BC, I don't just want it, I need it. Take for example the Biktrix bike it is 68 lbs without a rider, put a 200 lb. man on there with a backpack or panniers it's easy to go up to 275 lbs. total, add in 4" fat wheels and steep grade you are going to need it, or what's the point of an electric bike within that application. Otherwise I might as well just get a straight carbon fiber bike like this that weighs only 30lbs.
Trek Mountian Bike

The Superdelite GT rohloff is an elite bike, one of the best, but it lacks torque compared to everything I have posted, I don't care about speed or unlocking the speed, I want to climb steep grades at the legal limit I am allowed, and if I can use a throttle only at 20 MPH, it passes the grade/torque test for me.

My Sondors is a great bike but it really struggles up 12% grade on straight throttle, I am at only 5 Mph, peddling hard in the easiest gear gets me to about 12 Mph. On the flats it's great and goes as fast as I need it to(20mph) with ease and gets up to speed fast.
But then again it is a hub drive, 75nm on a mid-drive is going to be a stronger hill climber than a 75nm hub drive.

Here is the most difficult bike/Ebike climb in the world by ranking,13.5% slope, I will never do this, but that is what the most powerful and expensive Ebikes should be able to do, to help people complete their life bucket lists without making them give up, because their cardio isn't their.
Observatorio del Teide - La Caleta (del Espigón) (MTB)

Your right most people won't need it, but if we live near mountains and you plan on tackling those roads then you will, I plan to with my next bike, but I am going to do some tire and rim upgrades first see how much that helps.

 

[fooferdoggie]

I go up and down hills even day upto 14 degree grade. I weight 190 but my bike is only 52 pounds because it does not have a huge motor and a huge battery on it. I carry groceries and such all the time. most hills are not that steep so they are not a big deal. my first e bike had a 500 watt mid drive and I only went maybe 1 to 2 mph faster at most but I didn't really get any exercise I just spun on it and it sucked up the batteries. with a little more effort I get twice the range on my Bosch bike with a mid drive you don't need such a big motor.

 

[Ebiker33]

I go up and down hills even day upto 14 degree grade. I weight 190 but my bike is only 52 pounds because it does not have a huge motor and a huge battery on it. I carry groceries and such all the time. most hills are not that steep so they are not a big deal. my first e bike had a 500 watt mid drive and I only went maybe 1 to 2 mph faster at most but I didn't really get any exercise I just spun on it and it sucked up the batteries. with a little more effort I get twice the range on my Bosch bike with a mid drive you don't need such a big motor.

What brand of bike do you have ?

 

[fooferdoggie]

bulls with a Bosch 2019 speed mid drive. I use mostly full assist or one level down because I don't have al to of energy. but if I was normal I would be screaming on the bike.

 

[Ebiker33]

bulls with a Bosch 2019 speed mid drive. I use mostly full assist or one level down because I don't have al to of energy. but if I was normal I would be screaming on the bike.

I was actually looking at the BULLS Sentinel, here is a bike fully vetted by the LAPD bike division, must be good, not sure what type of hills there is in LA, Hollywood maybe
BULLS Sentinel

 

[TomD]

Compare to the FLX Blade. It weighed in at 58.8 lbs in EBR's 2018 review. Add a few pounds for rack and you are ~10 pounds more than the Bulls. Not sure an extra 10 pounds is going to decrease range that much everything else being equal. I would think tire or motor drag has a bigger impact on range than weight. The latest Brose motors tout zero drag so if range is more important go with a Brose? I'll take the $$$ savings over the weight and range savings.

 

[Johnny]

First of all good work OP for bringing these bikes up to our attention.

I realize that Bafang Ultra may be their best seller. It seems to have almost everything. Its only downside seems to be the weight, I wish it was less than 10 pounds.

Can people share their experiences on its efficiency(at lower outputs up to 700-800W I expect this drive to be quite efficient), smoothness of operation, noise, pedaling resistance without assist etc. ?

 

[TForan]

I've had my Ultra powered Biktirx since 2017 and love it. I haven't ridden anything that's close to it. I think Roshan's tuning helps a lot too.

 

[ElevenAD]

Frey HT1000 deserves mention as it is the only Ultra equipped bike i have seen priced under $2000

 

[TomD]

It's definitely the cheapest before shipping, but outside group buy shipping is $800 from FREY which makes it $2800. At that point I think the Rize might be more compelling for someone on a budget. I guess it depends on what options and components you want. FREY includes a better front fork. Rize includes rack, mudguards and suspension seatpost.

FWIW, I wouldn't consider the EUNORAU even on a budget. Saw one funny comment about the brakes in the comment section by a reviewer on another EUNORAU bike: "I learned a pretty neat trick to fix ProMax brakes. All you have to do is replace it with another brand, and viola! Instant Fix!"

 

[Silo1231]

How loud is the Ultra on these bikes? I've heard them described to sound like a coffee grinder. Any new e-bike I get will not be super stealth, but I would prefer the motor not to be very loud.

 

[TomD]

I rode a friend's FLX Blade. On flats I couldn't really hear the motor. On the uphill or under load the motor got louder and you could definitely hear it. I asked my friend if he noticed the motor noise and he said what noise, so I think it will vary by individual.

 

[Ravi Kempaiah]

How loud is the Ultra on these bikes? I've heard them described to sound like a coffee grinder. Any new e-bike I get will not be super stealth, but I would prefer the motor not to be very loud.

I spent close to 16hrs on Wattwagon UC pro (within 24 hrs) and the noise was minimal or else it would have driven me nuts.
The road and wind noise drowns out any motor noise. It is audible but not high enough to be an annoyance.

@tomdav,
Thanks for sharing that link of FLX 2.0. Nice to see them use high-quality components like Gates drive and Rohloff hub mated to Bafang ultra.
They say imitation is the best form of flattery and Wattwagons was one of early companies to make use of it.

If Bafang can use more refined torque sensor, this motor will crush the competition. The sensor is a bit raw compared to Brose or Yamaha but several times more powerful for sure.

 

[ElevenAD]

It's definitely the cheapest before shipping, but outside group buy shipping is $800 from FREY which makes it $2800. At that point I think the Rize might be more compelling for someone on a budget. I guess it depends on what options and components you want. FREY includes a better front fork. Rize includes rack, mudguards and suspension seatpost.

FWIW, I wouldn't consider the EUNORAU even on a budget. Saw one funny comment about the brakes in the comment section by a reviewer on another EUNORAU bike: "I learned a pretty neat trick to fix ProMax brakes. All you have to do is replace it with another brand, and viola! Instant Fix!"

With Frey I would only consider buying during US group buy time periods,then shipping is $300, there is a group buy happening now I believe.

 

[Ebiker33]

This discussion made me dig a little deeper into other motors that are more powerful than what the big three manufactures are putting out, but less powerful than the BAFANG G510.
That motor is on the Haibike FLYON which uses a German made 120NM torque motor. The testing video's were very impressive, one rider said "this is really next level power and torque" compared to the big three.
He went up hills he said his previous Ebikes could not ascend no matter how hard you peddled or what gear you were in, and they were good bikes too, just weaker motors. He also did an impromptu race against 2 other riders on name brand Ebikes on smooth asphalt up significant grade.....he left them in the dust and they really tried to keep up, but went out of visual range. However you could hear the motor working, do we really expect it to be silent when it is being pushed to outperform all the other motors, and then it does. But when you are just using it for cruising you don't hear it. I know if I push my car at maximum acceleration, I hear it more than if I just gently increase my speed, these motors are no different. Now if you are going along on flat grade at 20 mph and it's loud that is a different issue, and perhaps even a defect in the design.

You get to pick one right now.
1) Stealth/low noise
2)Ultimate power and torque when and where you need it with some noise.

The German company, here is link and a video.
The company is into some high end robotics as well.
TQ Motor Info

If any dealer that posts here can find out a price on this....because I couldn't find it, I am sure people are curious as to what the price is of this motor is compared to the BAFANG G510.