Will the popularity of tuning kill eBikes?

iskjone

iskjone

Active Member
Riding a tuned e-bike is not a trivial offence and has serious legal consequences. Further, most motor manufacturers can detect the use of a tuning device and will not repair the motor under warranty if it was modified.

More importantly doesn't it seem likely that all the incredible progress over the years of gaining legal status to ride our eBikes on public trails is being eroded by a handful of adolescent adults? I can see public opinion turning against the ebike community because safety is being aggressively ignored. A big focus on this forum is that it's a personnel freedom to spite one's own face and ignore common sense. EBR is about advocating illegal "fixes" then helping the eBike community.


My opinion is EBR, you suck.
 
While I agree with your premise, I strongly disagree with your opinion of EBR! Yes, there those here who are "outlaws" in some respects but the majority of us are law respecting older adults who are genuinely concerned about ebike laws and the future of our sport. Spend more time here reading the various posts and over time, I think you will soften your rather harsh assessment of this forum.
 
I know many here, including EBR founder, have concerns that ebikes outside the law will have a detrimental effect on access. I've met and spoken to many here and you are characterizing EBR wrongly.

Locally we've been in a struggle to keep/get access to trails and MUP's. During this fight, and I hate to characterize as a fight, the local parks department has allowed for a person to obtain a permit to ride if there is a medical need. I won't go into all that, or how misguided the county is. We did have a problem that directly relates to ebikes outside the law.

In Pennsylvania class 3 ebikes are illegal. One can agree or disagree with that law, but the simple fact is they are not legal. During a recent public meeting, where many ebikers spoke to the access issue, a couple who had obtained the permits to ride, stated they both had class 3 speed pedelecs. After the meeting the Parks Director said they had signed the permit application stating their bikes conformed to the state limit of class 1 and 2. The Director stated if they couldn't be honest on the permit application, how could they be trusted to ride legally and respectfully on the county trail system? That was the only negative in an otherwise positive, successful meeting. It was a big deal to the director. It was clear she felt it was fraud. The riders hurt their own credibility, hopefully not our cause.
 
It's not the power that is the problem. It's rude riders, whether electrified or not. Having a powerful bike is a great safety feature in traffic. I rode a Trek the other day and was amazed at how weak it was. Not good when you have to get going in a hurry.
 
iskjone said:
More importantly doesn't it seem likely that all the incredible progress over the years of gaining legal status to ride our eBikes on public trails is being eroded by a handful of adolescent adults? I can see public opinion turning against the ebike community because safety is being aggressively ignored... EBR is about advocating illegal "fixes" then helping the eBike community.


My opinion is EBR, you suck.
Click to expand...

I've never seen @Court or anyone else involved with EBR advocating breaking local laws. More than once I've heard them say to double check local laws.

The forum itself is a public space where people are having discussions on the subject, and I'd rather that discussion be available than not. Sharing information about the technology in ebikes, and their limits, be available.

Like @TForan said, it's about rude riders, electrified or not. Here in Toronto, I see acoustic speed junkies going twice as fast as the mixed use trail 20kph limit all the time. Not so much ebikes.

Also, I suspect that different municipalities will be cracking down on e-scooters before ebikes, given public sentiment towards them. :)
 
I don't follow the tuning threads, but always thought there weren't many of them. EBR does not suck. The forum consists mainly of responsible riders who ride store bought bikes and wouldn't touch the electronics.

In the USA, you don't have to risk voiding a warranty to go fast. You can easily build or buy a bike that is outside the class limits. However, it's going to be the reckless rider on any kind of ebike that sets the bad example which galvanizes the safety people.

Still, I haven't heard about cases where a reckless rider took out a family walking on the MUP. Bike fatalities are cyclists getting run over by vehicles. The most dangerous part of my daily bike path ride are crossing a T-interection with traffic where two 45 mph roads meet. Right-tune-on-red is the bane of anyone in a crosswalk
 
My expectation is that the EBR moderator would provide some Forum guidance much like this policy from another eBike Forum


We'll have some guidelines that we're refining. Something like this:

· Ebike forum is for generating a positive experience, no drama or trolls.
· This section is for discussion of ebike, ebike specific accessories, stories or what’s new in the OEM.
· Let’s talk about legal only trails. Any talk about illegal riding can be deleted at moderators discretion
· Any post about derestricting/modifying software will be deleted.
· OEM bike discussion and technologies is the key target (Specialized, Giant, YT, Trek, Focus, Pivot, etc…). Add-on motors, limit discussions to under 1000 watt varieties
· Threads started to purposefully incite other users will be deleted.
· If you cannot tell a difference between a motorcycle and class 1 or 2 ebike, please don’t post.

My Opinion is EBR, you suck!
 
The fact that this thread is still up and can be commented on is proof that EBR doesn't suck. In a forum less devoted to honest discussion of important ebike topics, this would have been taken off the forum or locked down by now.

There is a point to be made -- which has been made many times here -- that the search of greater and greater power in ebikes will have a negative effect on ebikes as a whole. It may be true; so far, there's been no widespread problem with this kind of experimentation.

There's a lot to be said for experimentation, too.
 
My opinion is your opinions suck! In a free society please feel free to exercise your freedom to leave if this is what we will be getting from you. Heck, go start a forum of your own about either tuners are ruining the world or how bad this forum is for allowing conversations you don’t approve of, or both topics.

It would be great if those here would ignore this troll completely and he will disappear...
 
Most of your points are general forum behaviours that have existed since the days of BBSes, so I'll skip over those...

iskjone said:
· Let’s talk about legal only trails. Any talk about illegal riding can be deleted at moderators discretion
· Any post about derestricting/modifying software will be deleted.
· OEM bike discussion and technologies is the key target (Specialized, Giant, YT, Trek, Focus, Pivot, etc…). Add-on motors, limit discussions to under 1000 watt varieties
Click to expand...

Why, and where does it end?

If someone has private land, where they can do whatever they want with their e-bikes, they wouldn't be allowed to discuss it according to your rules.

In the same vein, maybe se should ban car discussions where people talk about engines that go faster than posted speed limits (which would ban any car discussion on any forum anywhere).
 
Hi! It looks like you've missed a certain section of the forum entirely: https://electricbikereview.com/forums/forum/rules/. Please pay close attention to the first post, which basically states to be kind. It is ironic that you're not following the first point in the guidelines you've posted: Ebike forum is for generating a positive experience, no drama or trolls.

EBR is a positive community because of its members. Anybody who doesn't wish to abide by that will no longer be accepted as a member. You don't have to agree with others here, or by the way we choose to operate, but you do need to choose your words more carefully and be kind.
 
iskjone said:
Riding a tuned e-bike is not a trivial offence and has serious legal consequences. Further, most motor manufacturers can detect the use of a tuning device and will not repair the motor under warranty if it was modified.

More importantly doesn't it seem likely that all the incredible progress over the years of gaining legal status to ride our eBikes on public trails is being eroded by a handful of adolescent adults? I can see public opinion turning against the ebike community because safety is being aggressively ignored. A big focus on this forum is that it's a personnel freedom to spite one's own face and ignore common sense. EBR is about advocating illegal "fixes" then helping the eBike community.


My opinion is EBR, you suck.
Click to expand...
Angela M. said:
Hi! It looks like you've missed a certain section of the forum entirely: https://electricbikereview.com/forums/forum/rules/. Please pay close attention to the first post, which basically states to be kind. It is ironic that you're not following the first point in the guidelines you've posted: Ebike forum is for generating a positive experience, no drama or trolls.

EBR is a positive community because of its members. Anybody who doesn't wish to abide by that will no longer be accepted as a member. You don't have to agree with others here, or by the way we choose to operate, but you do need to choose your words more carefully and be kind.
Click to expand...
Thank you Angela M.You saved me from jumping in on this thread with a regretful responce.
 
iskjone said:
Riding a tuned e-bike is not a trivial offence and has serious legal consequences. Further, most motor manufacturers can detect the use of a tuning device and will not repair the motor under warranty if it was modified.

More importantly doesn't it seem likely that all the incredible progress over the years of gaining legal status to ride our eBikes on public trails is being eroded by a handful of adolescent adults? I can see public opinion turning against the ebike community because safety is being aggressively ignored. A big focus on this forum is that it's a personnel freedom to spite one's own face and ignore common sense. EBR is about advocating illegal "fixes" then helping the eBike community.


My opinion is EBR, you suck.
Click to expand...


The EU has draconian ebike regulations and are more focused on assist speed limits.

I suggest you and everyone else read the actual US ebike regulation / definition. There is a 20mph assist limit for a throttle but there is no assist speed limit if the rider is pedaling. I know far to many read the People for Bikes recommended state regulations but in reality they are superseded by the federal law. Local and state lawmakers can regulated "USAGE" of ebikes but if they ban an ebike they are in effect banning all bikes.

In the last couple days the national parks were opened to all classes of ebikes mainly because ebikes were never to be considered motor vehicles as some uptight parks felt they were. It's not going to ruin trails and it's not going to make other riders less safe but that's what you'll hear from almost everyone working for insurance companies or DMV.
 
iskjone said:
Riding a tuned e-bike is not a trivial offence and has serious legal consequences. Further, most motor manufacturers can detect the use of a tuning device and will not repair the motor under warranty if it was modified.

More importantly doesn't it seem likely that all the incredible progress over the years of gaining legal status to ride our eBikes on public trails is being eroded by a handful of adolescent adults? I can see public opinion turning against the ebike community because safety is being aggressively ignored. A big focus on this forum is that it's a personnel freedom to spite one's own face and ignore common sense. EBR is about advocating illegal "fixes" then helping the eBike community.

My opinion is EBR, you suck.
Click to expand...

Nonsense... now get off my lawn! ;)
 
Not sure why you would join the forum then berate it....you are free to go join any other forum you feel meets your needs.
 
The irony about condemning tuning is that it is legal and not dangerous... and definitely not irresponsible, so long as the tuning simply raises the assist speed from 20 to 28 mph. I live in Maine and here, as in most states, Class 3 pedelecs are legal on roads. So, if you want to transform your class 1 ebike into a faster class 3 one (and are willing to risk the voiding of your warranty if the dealer finds out), there’s nothing unethical about doing so.

0f course, If you live in a state that forbids the use of class 3 pedelecs, the best option would be to move to a more progressive state.
 
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