Cannabis, how is it legalized?

[duggie]

Cannabis? Well, this subject interests me. I live in the UK and it is banned, so it is all black market deals, but it is crap, it is weed and i don't trust it at all, I believe it is contaminated with legal highs, of at the least just what is called skunk, a horrible 'high of high strength wipe you out'. That really is all there is in the UK these days. In the '80s it was only just hash resin, no weed at all, but even this resin was mucked around with, you'd find bits of polythene in it. You never really knew. UNLESS you went to Ansterdam where it was legal. Cafe shops. They had a menu. It was great, good stuff you could rely on. We used to go to a camping site called Camping Zeburrg and everyone was well stoned, real Cheech and Chong. That said, I have never been a big smoker, BUT, that said, at that time in my earlier life it did have some interesting perspectives which I am grateful of.

These days? well I don't bother. There isn't the good stuff around and, well, 'I learnt' from it, which was good, but now I know that, it only would offer me a change from lager.

BUT....if it was legalized here in the UK I would buy some and try it, knowing it would be more likely to be sound stuff, just mild, not mind-blowing. Make a change from lager.

But, I hear about ganga being legalized more and more. I suppose it is really to guarantee the quality, for health reasons. So what is it like in say the US in a state with has legalized it. Is it a shop and/or a 'cafe'? Is there a menu? Do you have choice of hash and weed and different strengths? And how it it going down in society?

Here in the UK it is legal to have seeds but not to grow them, though you can buy hydroponic set ups for folks to break the law to grow their own.

So, what is the score in a state which has legalized dope, can you buy it cash? How, a shop? Anonymous? Is it better stuff? Is it better in terms of the larger society? Do more people smoke? What's the score?Is it backstreet or open mall?

 

[JRA]

You can't swing a dead cat in Oregon without hitting a dispensary. On the way to the grocery today I saw a sign out at a dispensary by the road that advertised $49 oz's...... Medical marijuana, basically a couple hundred $/yr fee and a phone consult with a doc to tell them that you have a bad back etc., has been legal here for years and recreational for the last 4/5 I think. Bottom line is states, still a federal offence re; you can get busted using on federal land, figured out that there was mucho dinero to be made taxing it as well as the fact that it really isn't as dangerous a drug as they always let on. In fact you don't hear anything at all about stoners getting into trouble, not anywhere nearly as much as drunks anyway.

There are many legal grows now but also still some off the book operations. Now that there is a steady market for it a real effort has been made to make as many strains as possible available and some can be soft and some can be very strong. Also the edible market has blown up and all manner of those are available not just brownies anymore.

Not sure how many states there are now that have adopted legal marijuana but it seems like every November there are at least a few that do. There are more states that have medical laws than recreational laws at least.

Oh and CBD production is also very popular and growing hemp was all the rage a few years ago. That market has been taken over by large crop farmers though that can use their existing land/machinery to grow acres at a time. Small growers that tried it mostly went back to THC varieties.

 

[tomjasz]

Cannabis? Well, this subject interests me. I live in the UK and it is banned, so it is all black market deals, but it is crap, it is weed and i don't trust it at all, I believe it is contaminated with legal highs, of at the least just what is called skunk, a horrible 'high of high strength wipe you out'. That really is all there is in the UK these days. In the '80s it was only just hash resin, no weed at all, but even this resin was mucked around with, you'd find bits of polythene in it. You never really knew. UNLESS you went to Ansterdam where it was legal. Cafe shops. They had a menu. It was great, good stuff you could rely on. We used to go to a camping site called Camping Zeburrg and everyone was well stoned, real Cheech and Chong. That said, I have never been a big smoker, BUT, that said, at that time in my earlier life it did have some interesting perspectives which I am grateful of.

These days? well I don't bother. There isn't the good stuff around and, well, 'I learnt' from it, which was good, but now I know that, it only would offer me a change from lager.

BUT....if it was legalized here in the UK I would buy some and try it, knowing it would be more likely to be sound stuff, just mild, not mind-blowing. Make a change from lager.

But, I hear about ganga being legalized more and more. I suppose it is really to guarantee the quality, for health reasons. So what is it like in say the US in a state with has legalized it. Is it a shop and/or a 'cafe'? Is there a menu? Do you have choice of hash and weed and different strengths? And how it it going down in society?

Here in the UK it is legal to have seeds but not to grow them, though you can buy hydroponic set ups for folks to break the law to grow their own.

So, what is the score in a state which has legalized dope, can you buy it cash? How, a shop? Anonymous? Is it better stuff? Is it better in terms of the larger society? Do more people smoke? What's the score?Is it backstreet or open mall?

Interesting. It’s UK companies that broker seed sales to USA customers by way of Holland.

 

[dodgeman]

I have mixed emotions about it here in Illinois where it is legal. I don’t use it and don’t intend to but it does free law enforcement from having to mess with it. They sell it out of a store front and they appear to do a good business, they even have billboards. The places they grow it are tightly regulated by the state, mainly for security, they look like a prison in terms of the fencing. As far a checking what is in the product, I don’t know if that happens or not.

 

[Gordon71]

Legal in my state but I've never bought any. I ordered seeds from Amsterdam a few years ago and just grow my own. As far as how it will affect you simply depends on how much you use at any one time. It's just like other legal recreational drugs like alcohol in that respect. One or two drinks will give you a pleasant high. Drink the whole bottle and you'll get sick and it can kill you. At least marijuana can't kill you.

 

[Gionnirocket]

I recently started caring for an elderly family member who suffers from the onset of dementia and medical cannabis has been a godsend.
So much more effective and with none of the disturbing side effects of Quetiapine and then Xanax which was initially prescribed by her primary care physician and neurologist.
A 20:1 CBD to THC tincture has no "getting hi" affect at all and has returned her joyful personality as well as greatly improving her quality of life. It's not a cure all but it has reduced the frequency of episodes and the intensity and anxiety is more than cut in half.
And most importantly as Gordon71 stated, it can't kill you... as Quetiapine and other narcotics have the potential to.

Yonkers Dispensary

Yonkers Dispensary TBD

etainhealth.com

 

[ChezCheese:)]

When the Japanese started eyeing China in the 1930's, one thing they did was to flood the place with cheap opium. As food became scarce, people turned to opium - - it was so cheap and available. In a few years, the Japanese military figured the population was weakened enough to sap their will/ability to resist invasion.

Now think about how ubiquitous marijuana and meth have become here in the US. Think about how we have an "epidemic" of obesity, how young people must now face climate change and economic injustice that we didn't have to deal with. They need every bit of real mojo, gumption, perseverance, creativity and mental acuity they can muster just to compete in this world. But if they've got cheap and too strong dope, they can't compete. They have trouble getting the courage to get up off the sofa.

So if you want to know how legalization is going here, IMO, it is not a good thing. High rate of drug-induced psychosis. Kids effing up their brains permanently. Many necessary jobs unfilled because people can't pass a drug screen. And try to get some customer service out of people who couldn't think their way out of a breadbox. "It's all too hard. Have another toke, dude."

 

[tomjasz]

Severe spinal stenosis requires some sort of medication to calm some of the pain. In Minnesota, I have a State cannabis Rx, but since I doctor in WI I have to drug test for any really effective pain medications. And being illegal in WI I would be denied RX pain meds if I use my legal MN Rx. FUCKED UP!

 

[Gionnirocket]

All those issues with the current generation started way before the legalization of cannabis.
It's their sense of entitlement, poor parenting and not having enough sense to put down the phone for 5 seconds that is putting the latest generation behind the eight ball.

 

[RandallS]

Severe spinal stenosis requires some sort of medication to calm some of the pain. In Minnesota, I have a State cannabis Rx, but since I doctor in WI I have to drug test for any really effective pain medications. And being illegal in WI I would be denied RX pain meds if I use my legal MN Rx. FUCKED UP!

Severe spinal stenosis requires some sort of medication to calm some of the pain. In Minnesota, I have a State cannabis Rx, but since I doctor in WI I have to drug test for any really effective pain medications. And being illegal in WI I would be denied RX pain meds if I use my legal MN Rx. FUCKED UP!

It's legal not too far from you...a little north. CBD is often an effective alternative/adjunct for pharmaceuticals.
I for one am an advocate - it helps to keep my arthritis to a manageable level.

Unfortunately crossing the border is probably out of the question.

 

[Cowlitz]

How was it legalized? In my State of Warshington, it was voted on. Our state allows us to have referendums (I'm doing this without looking it up) if one gathers enough valid signatures on what they want to make a law or legalize, it goes on the state ballot and everybody can vote on it. That's what happened with marijuana.

Is it a good thing? Well, it was pretty common before being legalized and now we tax the crap out of it and it makes money for the state and county governments. It is good to make it available for sick people. I sometimes use a cream to help with an achy knee. I don't like smelling it wafting out of car windows as they drive by, but I put it in the same context as folks texting while driving. I do not like the smell of the ripening crop. We get that when the wind blows from the north. You make the judgement on whether it is good or not.

As mentioned, it is illegal federally so you can get fined if using it in a National Park or Forest. Also, the commercial growing of it is regulated, and because of federal laws, the money made cannot be put in a bank. So, there's a cash problem and robberies have occurred. I now think they are able to launder the cash somehow--I don't know really how they take care of that. The pot farms look like mini-prisons due to security requirements and I wouldn't want one as a neighbor. They seem to hire a lot of people to work but they also have a big turnover of workers. It's probably like most agriculture jobs, hard work for minimum wage.

Our state tests it for various things, one of them being nasty chemicals so there is a bit of quality control. They'll also fine the heck out of producers if they don't have it properly locked up either growing or in storage.

That's all I know.

 

[rayray]

I never thought weed was a horrible drug….kind of like an alcohol alternative. In fact, I have a good friend who uses weed to avoid drinking, as he has a history of alcoholism, and it’s worked for him for over 20 years, including during his career in engineering at a major industrial company. I still believe that, used in moderation, it can be ok for fully developed mentally-stable adults.

On the other hand, I have a 22-year-old nephew who died of a fentanyl overdose last year. Prior to his wandering down that path, he was diagnosed as psychotic, which his doctors (and I) believe was induced by his heavy use of wax, a derivative of marijuana that is extremely high in THC content. I believe this, in part, because I tried it once at a gathering of friends and found the effect to be very extreme…ONE TOKE made me totally catatonic for 30 minutes (unable to move or communicate), and it was another 30 minutes before I felt capable of talking to anyone (similar to the symptoms later exhibited by my nephew during his psychotic period). That was enough to keep me from ever trying it again, but perhaps some find that enjoyable(?). In any event, I can see how a person, especially a young or unstable person, could easily be adversely affected by too-frequent use. And wax is legal here in Washington State.

 

[ChezCheese:)]

THC is fat soluble. That means it is stored in body fat. It accumulates. So people who are regular tokers, they may never be straight.

 

[Gordon71]

The one thing we learned in the USA after the 18th amendment to the constitution was ratified is that recreational drugs are much more dangerous when they are illegal. That's usually less true with pot but it has been sold on the streets laced with various things and the synthetic marijuana that's out there is more dangerous that the real thing.

 

[rayray]

THC is fat soluble. That means it is stored in body fat. It accumulates. So people who are regular tokers, they may never be straight.

It’s not permanently stored, so you don’t actually remain stoned for extended periods. However, resulting psychosis could certainly be permanent.

I really don’t think weed is horrible, but as with alcohol, abuse can cause problems.

 

[Catalyzt]

Cannabis in California is well regulated and inspected. I use oral formulations that are better for inflammation than narcotics and most NSAIDs, though for migraine, it's only about 60% as effective as narcotics.

The difference between oral usage and smoking and vaping, as well as the difference between medical and recreational use absolutely cannot be overstated. They are completely different beasts. My experience is that clients who use up to 5 to 10mg CBD/ 10 mg THC w/ a well-selected blend of terpenes have very few problems and much less intrusive psychoactive effects, and below 6 or 7 mg, (for a user with some tolerance) the psychoactive effects are really subtle, though even 5/5 can have a significant, but non-intrusive psychoactive effect for someone who does not use it regularly

On the other hand, my clients who take one or two tokes of weed, vaped or smoked, more than twice a week always experience some kind of problem or negative impact.

The rapid onset from smoking and vaping is definitely what makes you stupid-- as well as the 200+ other chemicals in smoked marijuana that are sharply reduced in vaped cannabis or almost entirely eliminated in many oral formulations.

Personally, I use about 8-to-10 mg THC/CBD (in other words, 8 to 10 of each) every night and sometimes use 1-2 THC / 20 CBD in the very early morning for severe inflammation and joint stiffness. I have noticed no difference in mental acuity, and I literally work with rocket scientists. It's a congenial, but very high-stress, high-performing environment where you can't survive if you don't think quickly on your feet. I also do not lose my phone or keys as often as most people my age, or when I do, I seem to find them more quickly.

It is true that there is some variability in the dosing that must be factored in. For example, if I take 10/10 at 7:00 PM, I feel totally safe to drive or operate heavy machinery until about 10:30 PM, (though I never do-- see below) and then experience a subtle psychoactive effect for two or three hours before bed. During those two or three hours, I avoid writing notes because it takes too long-- though when I've had to do so, and read them over the next day, there's nothing wrong with them, my mind just wanders more. If I practice guitar during those hours, I get the same benefit w/ muscle memory, but it's hard to remember if I stumble on a good melody-- I have to record it immediately. I also might feel jittery, nervous, or disorganized for 20 to 40 minutes, but it always passes quickly. I do notice that music sounds a bit different, and if I walk the dogs at 11:00, I might notice that the streetlights look a bit different, or something about my perception is subtly different. It I wake up at 3:00 AM to use the bathroom, I might notice a more profound effect, but then I simply go back to sleep. The tinctures, for me, last nearly 12 hours, so I can often sleep through the night!

Sometimes, at 3:00 AM, if I wake up to take a leak, I'll write down an odd idea that entered my head, and usually, it's still clever or amusing the next day. During one particularly difficult week at work during a pandemic surge, when I woke up in the middle of the night, I jotted down the following: "No, I'm not okay, I'm just acting normal-- I know there's a difference, I just can't remember what it is."

There is no 'head rush,' no paranoia, no 'couch lock' or feeling lethargic, no loss of motivation that I can identify, and those are all issues that I had with smoked marijuana. Also no urge to drink, smoke cigarettes, or use other drugs. (I am in recovery, and this whole plan was approved by my sponsor, doctor, and therapist.) I find that my friends who still smoke pot are really boring on the phone and ramble on about stuff and don't tend to get much done, in general. So I find it excruciating to be around people who are 'stoned' in the conventional way, from smoking. No one seems to have noticed that I'm doing that, or any difference in my conversation, etc., and I do ask people-- my friends are therapists, and they wouldn't lie to me.

However: About five or six times a year, a dosing error will occur. I don't know what causes this. Maybe three times a year, I'll have a dose that has almost no effect, and twice or three times a year, I'll be hit with intense psychoactive effects about an hour after dosing. I don't know why this happens. That's why I never work with clients, rarely do paperwork, never drive or ride, etc., after using these substances.

All I can say is, in 2016, I was using narcotics for pain in the evening, but during the day, the weakness and inflammation was so bad I wasn't able to body board. Now I'm using 20% less narcotics and finally, I might have to give up body boarding-- but I got six years of good surfing.

I agree that wax and dabs are bad news, as are high-dose edibles. I'd be fine with limiting the strength of some products. I thought the prescription system worked pretty well, it's a little crazier after complete legalization in CA, but I'm okay with it, not against it. I do believe it's possible for THC to push young adults over the threshold for schizophrenia who might otherwise have been okay if they didn't use at all, or not until their mid 30s. I don't know how to address that problem other than early intervention.

 

[Catalyzt]

All those issues with the current generation started way before the legalization of cannabis.
It's their sense of entitlement, poor parenting and not having enough sense to put down the phone for 5 seconds that is putting the latest generation behind the eight ball.

Poor parenting I have observed. I find that young people are no more entitled than any other group of people-- that entitlement affects young and old, privileged and disenfranchised, and men and women equally.

Young people take social media more seriously than older people, and may have slightly more problems putting down their phone than anyone else does, but I'm not even sure about that. My wife and I both have a terrible time getting off the computer.

Let's also remember that young people were targeted for exploitation by big tech, and are innately more vulnerable because they have poor impulse control due to the normal process of neural development, so yeah-- it makes sense that they fall harder for digital addiction, and it takes more work for them to recover.

And remember that young people are also the demographic that created the idea of digital fasting. I do sometimes get college-age student clients who have quit social media for three months who come to my office to see if they're going crazy. Basically, I tell them, "Hell, no," and they are usually on their way after one to three appointments.

 

[tomjasz]

It's legal not too far from you...a little north. CBD is often an effective alternative/adjunct for pharmaceuticals.
I for one am an advocate - it helps to keep my arthritis to a manageable level.

Unfortunately crossing the border is probably out of the question.

CBD has done nothing for me. I invested hundreds of dollars in pharmaceutical grade here in MN and the only thing that's effective is high THC and CBD.

 

[Gionnirocket]

CBD has done nothing for me. I invested hundreds of dollars in pharmaceutical grade here in MN and the only thing that's effective is high THC and CBD.

I've read that you need at least some THC for the CBD to have an effect... Hence the 1:20 cocktail.
I've seen many other ratios and you'll have to experiment to see what works best for you.

 

[rayray]

CBD has done nothing for me. I invested hundreds of dollars in pharmaceutical grade here in MN and the only thing that's effective is high THC and CBD.

I know people who swear by CBD, but without THC it does nothing for me. CBD is said to moderate THC’s effect though, in that it reduces the potential for paranoia or overthinking life issues, and I think that is true.

I’ve used weed with about 20% THC, via a vaporizer, in the past for pain and it was tremendously helpful. Used it for Shingles and after several surgeries. After knee surgery, I was able to avoid opioids entirely, with the exception of one Oxycodone pill immediately after surgery. I’d call that a win, mainly because weed doesn’t cause constipation!

This vaporizer was autographed by Cheech and Chong in 2019, coincidentally on April 20th no less! Unfortunately, they wouldn’t date it for me.