Wave E-bike 499$ (another Storm/Indiegogo)

[stevenast]

George, I have a hard time following what you're saying. How does a real company like Currie get into a conversation about this questionable project?

My post was about the behavior of the person riding the bike in the video. Like someone out to get ebikes banned the way he rides!

 

[stevenast]

multiple choice question:

A. A project out to make a quick buck and run, no concern about the image e-bikes present, just wants to make "sales", show off
B. A startup that cares about the e-bike community, a good citizen, here to stay

Watch the throttle-only carving of the bike path and the people on it and see what you think.

 

[George S.]

He said he was maintaining speed for the video, to prove a point on the time and distance. I accept that. The 'publicity stunt' was a bad idea.

I have no idea what he is planning, but he has answered every question I have asked. What don't you know about the bike? You don't like it. You don't like Aaron. No problem.

Currie is kind of a monopolist. They seem to like high prices. How does that help ebikes? They are responsible citizens? I don't know.

I'm building a bike. I plan to build any bike I own in the future. I can't answer who I like less, or more, between Aaron and Currie/Accel.

If these campaigns get organized they will offer good choices. It's early in the game. When I figured out what Prodeco was going to charge me for another battery, I decided all these guys are in it for what they can get. You think this guy is the 'bad actor'? Really? It's a cheap bike.

 

[stevenast]

George, you make great points.

- The big guys are charging way too much (at the dealer level)
- The "Wave" or whatever ...is cheap, at best
- The publicity stunt was a bad idea

But, I don't see how a temporary run off of bikes, even if they actually get delivered, will be a "good choice" with no support or parts

...and of course the kit makers charge too much also...

 

[pxpaulx]

E bikes are sure taking their time gaining traction in the US. The high cost is prohibitive when most people don't view a bike as a viable primary means of transport.

In Europe, a high end e bike sells because people are willing to, and more likely to have a means to ride a bike for work and daily needs. In north America or spread out infrastructure makes a bike add a means of transport prohibitive.

Thus, there is a need for the cost of e bikes to be relatively inexpensive for the general public to take interest. Hopefully a balance can be struck; if these first attempts at crowd funding fall flat, the e bike industry will likely remain small. If they work, the big players will have to take notice. I hope for the latter, and fear the former.

 

[JRA]

Currie has a long history of selling e bikes here in the US. I had one of their funky rear dropout motor/downtube SLA battery kits set up on a bike in 2000. I got about 2 months of fun out of that kit and it fell apart. The throttle broke, the battery was, well SLA, and the motor/drive was funky at best. It gave me a taste of the possibilities of electric but in those days there just weren't that many options. It was cheap and that is how they rolled trying to sell cheap for years. Think Wal Mart sales. I have no idea who at the company is left from those days but they managed to hang on all these years and over that time the cost of their bikes has risen and they have shed the Wal Mart image.

At this point Currie, having been bought by Accel, has shifted to the more expensive EU brands because that is what Accel has to offer here. They also have more capital to expand their house line of bikes. The price of their bikes are not any more expensive than they are in the EU but the market here is not developed as it is there. It has taken a number of years for the EU market to mature and pxpaulx is right. There is much more incentive there for folks to ride bikes and always has been. Will it catch up here in the states?

Maybe it is a good thing that these inexpensive options are being made available. So that people can get a taste of the e experience on the cheap like I did. I just don't like the CF format as the spring board and don't see that as being sustainable. And hate to think of where all the cheap stuff is ultimately going to end up without aftermarket sales and support.

 

[AaronB]

Maybe it is a good thing that these inexpensive options are being made available. So that people can get a taste of the e experience on the cheap like I did.

That's exactly our mission. There is a huge gap in the ebike market that doesn't allow the average person to afford an electric bike. We've had nothing but positive feedback from our demo days this weekend. Checkout this quick video I filmed today at our demo day in Hermosa Beach...

 

[Ann M.]

Currie Tech used to offer a line of inexpensive SLA & Li powered bikes that were primarily marketed through big box stores. Big mistake since those places don't offer service and those bikes needed as much or more maintenance as the more expensive ebikes. For us IBDs the Ezip line was a nice inexpensive way to introduce people to ebikes or provide transportation to those who couldn't or didn't want to drive. When Accell purchased Currie Tech they saw a lot of revenue being lost due to the ironclad contracts written by Walmart, etc. so they chose to discontinue the Ezip line across the board and not offer an intro bike to its IBDs. Some of you folks who focus on Currie as real expensive should do a side by side price comparison to equivalent products by Pedego and others and you will see that Currie falls in the middle--more than Prodeco Tech but less than Pedego and so on. If you lump the Haibike into a price comparison with any of these crowdfunded bikes, then that's not realistic since its a totally different creature. I agree with @JRA that there's a big gap for intro ebikes but it doesn't really work to just ship parts to people. Our experience has been that the people buying the least expensive bikes are generally the least knowledgeable about fixing them on their own and have needed the support of trained technicians and bike mechanics to provide regular service. It certainly keeps me busy. And for all of these crowd funded ebike folks: you have to have gears, this single speed stuff doesn't work where there's hills; even a smaller hub motor could be viable in many cases if there were gears to compliment the power.

 

[Matthew Kreger]

I want to get an e-bike that I think will have the size, power and range to haul my 6'2" 300# butt around a few miles. I am not really sure how much I'll use it, so I don't want to spend thousands of dollars and have it collecting dust until I finally get rid of it at a huge loss in a few years. I actually went as far as buying a cheap crank-forward bike intending to buy a kit to power it, but then I don't really want to take on that project and deal with all the unique issues to solve on a one-off DIY. Now for less than I probably would have spent on the kit I am taking a chance and am in for a Wave. No, I don't like the CF model, and no I don't expect it to compare to a high-end commercial e-bike. But I think it will be at least as good and probably much better than one I built myself, and the more successful the campaign the larger the community of people to share info and experiences with if/when there are problems. So far I've paid for the bike, shipping, upgraded battery and charger, and puncture resistant tires and I'm in for $793. The campaign is at $369K and if they get to $450K there is another "stretch goal" to add a 6-speed cassette for another $35. No way I could touch these specs for $800 doing a self build. And honestly I don't really care if these guys are trying to build a sustainable e-bike company or are just organizing a massive group purchase. In fact, organizing a group buy and starting a company are such very different things, I imagine they aren't. It seems clear to pre-purchase inventory, build a network of dealer relationships, provide a support organization, etc. etc., would just drive the prices up to what everyone else charges for e-bikes. And whether they're gouging or not, I doubt anyone is making millions in the US e-bike biz. Assuming I get what's been described and shown I will be happy. And if I turn into a hardcore enthusiast my next bike may be a custom mid-motor job with auto-shifting nuvinci and belt drive, or a Stromer ST2, or maybe a higher-end group buy on KickStarter. Who knows? I'm just glad to have what I consider a more reasonable place to start.

 

[J.R.]

And for all of these crowd funded ebike folks: you have to have gears, this single speed stuff doesn't work where there's hills; even a smaller hub motor could be viable in many cases if there were gears to compliment the power.

Matthew, Ann said it well with the above statement. Gears are even more important when you are just getting back into shape. Just look into this issue well, I hope the Wave has vertical dropouts to add the freewheel and hanger required for gears. Most single speed bike frames have horizontal dropouts for chain tension, if the funding level is reached are they changing the frame to accommodate a freewheel? If that funding level is not reached, do you get a frame with horizontal dropouts? If so it will be difficult for you to add gears after the fact.

Good luck to all wavers, ride that wave...

 

[Matthew Kreger]

Matthew, Ann said it well with the above statement. Gears are even more important when you are just getting back into shape. Just look into this issue well, I hope the Wave has vertical dropouts to add the freewheel and hanger required for gears. Most single speed bike frames have horizontal dropouts for chain tension, if the funding level is reached are they changing the frame to accommodate a freewheel? If that funding level is not reached, do you get a frame with horizontal dropouts? If so it will be difficult for you to add gears after the fact.

Good luck to all wavers, ride that wave...

I agree that this is an issue. But I eventually decided I'd rather have the 750W x 48V assist than the gears if I had to choose. If I lived in San Francisco instead of Baltimore it would probably be a different story. It does mean that if I ride to the limit it's going to be a heavy, long walk up any hills. That said, I encourage you all to jump in and buy a Wave (or 3!) to get them to the $450K.

 

[stevenast]

And hate to think of where all the cheap stuff is ultimately going to end up without aftermarket sales and support

Amen. After it breaks, and sits in the garage long enough, most likely to the dumpster.

I really don't understand gambling like this. Maybe it's just that hope springs eternal. Maybe it's the fad of the fat tire. (Edit correction: 26" x 2.1" tire)

if you just want something to tool around on, get your feet wet, get a used e-bike. You know you're actually going to get what you pay for... and if the shop is good you'll get support too.

Local dealers get trade-ins sometimes; one of the dealers who posts on here has a used model and a demo both priced in the $800's right now on his website, as of today.

I just don't get the desire to gamble when the worst case scenario is you lose all your money, and the best case is you get something cheap, not long lasting, bound for the dumpster.

 

[pxpaulx]

Maybe it's the fad of the fat tire.

Wrong thread, I think you're over exerting yourself!

 

[stevenast]

My "fat tire" error is corrected . Thanks. See post above.

(Edit correction: 26" x 2.1" tire)

 

[Matthew Kreger]

Well I just maxed out my perks with the six-speed cassette, disc brake, and LCD controller. $903 all in. This is now pretty close to exactly the bike I wanted. Big gamble. I hope you're wrong stevenast. If I'm right I'll have the equivalent of a $3500 e-bike for under $1k.

 

[livejamie]

http://hzyonghengcy.en.alibaba.com/...most_popular_48V500W_electric_beach_bike.html

Did everybody ignore this for a reason? Seems to be the exact bike on Alibaba.

 

[J.R.]

Did everybody ignore this for a reason? Seems to be the exact bike on Alibaba.

I expect there wasn't any commentary because it was just a link posted without any commentary whatsoever. If you want to discuss it, give us something to discuss. Are you considering or have you backed the Wave campaign?

 

[livejamie]

I expect there wasn't any commentary because it was just a link posted without any commentary whatsoever. If you want to discuss it, give us something to discuss. Are you considering or have you backed the Wave campaign?

If you click the link, the Wave campaign appears to be re-branding a pre-existing $300 bike from Alibaba. Is that not discussion-worthy to you?

 

[pxpaulx]

It isn't really news here I don't think. If I were interested in a wave, I would rather take a risk with the crowd funding option than personally dealing directly with a Chinese factory through Alibaba. You won't get a volume discount buying a single bike on your own.

 

[livejamie]

It isn't really news here I don't think. If I were interested in a wave, I would rather take a risk with the crowd funding option than personally dealing directly with a Chinese factory through Alibaba. You won't get a volume discount buying a single bike on your own.

I'd agree with you but they are misrepresenting themselves and making it seem like they're "working with multiple manufacturers" to get each part to build a bike that they've "designed and built." When they're mearly rebranding something that already exists in China.

With many, many years of manufacturing and procurement experience we have worked with multiple manufacturing companies overseas to provide high quality parts at a very steep discount, but only if we order in bulk quantities. We made sure not to sacrifice quality in designing and building the Wave eBike. In the process, we successfully developed the world's most affordable eBike ever.

With years of sourcing and procurement experience we have worked with multiple suppliers throughout the world to negotiate the best possible pricing on each part to the Wave eBike which allows us to offer a very, very low-priced eBike without sacrificing quality.

Aaron spent countless hours working with dozens of manufacturers throughout the world to develop an affordable electric bike capable of an amazing top speed and outstanding range. That's how the Wave eBike came about!