Watt Wagons Critical Product Availability Status

[Ebiker33]

Sure when a blurry pic of an aluminum alloy bicycle, sanded and painted to hide the flaws.
Quality titanium welds have a larger bead and look like a roll of dimes, not little sanded down lumps.
View attachment 124331
Like this titanium BMX frame.

Nice welds, but those aren't being done by humans, they are too uniform.
A robot did that

 

[JRA]

Nice welds, but those aren't being done by humans, they are too uniform.
A robot did that

I would say not, there are plenty of welders out there that have the ability to lay down a stack weld like that or better.

 

[Lexicon]

Has anyone happened to have spoken with anyone at WW within the last day? I emailed them (politely) over 24h ago about something urgent that they have a week at most to resolve. I haven't heard back from 'em yet.

 

[Dunerider]

Has anyone happened to have spoken with anyone at WW within the last day? I emailed them (politely) over 24h ago about something urgent that they have a week at most to resolve. I haven't heard back from 'em yet.

I talked to someone at the beginning of the week.

 

[Fast n' Furious]

I would say not, there are plenty of welders out there that have the ability to lay down a stack weld like that or better.
View attachment 126740View attachment 126741

Well that's certainly some nice work. 'Jeweler quality'. Second pic is photo-shopped sanded and bead blasted nicely.
Might even be the best he ever did !!!
No way there are plenty of welders that can do that.
"I would say [concur "there are] not" plenty of welders out there that have the ability to lay down a stack weld [bead] like that or better."
Most I've known are total prima donnas. The really good ones are in other high-paying, but less rote-work jobs where their focus is more valuable and the lesser don't want to weld ti. It's a pain/ there's no real demand. You make more money welding broken gates. Big construction can't use you. It's all done off-site.
Take Bechtel, all their big titanium stuff is done 'in factory' settings, completely controlled.
That's where it's getting automated. Billion dollar companies, not bicycle makers. lol. They have 'seven digit' Government subsidies to produce Nuclear Power-plant parts.
So, Hey, I know. It's so damn good it looks automated, but that's the work of a patient man, no robot.
I seriously doubt there's enough money in creating titanium bicycle frames - that don't sell - to attract investors.
Automated, Orbital ti welders cost millions.
Googling this guy, and his creations you are posting leads to images right up there with 'rat fink' cars by Big Daddy Ed Roth.
1980's Batmobikes - but on a BMX budget.
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More sarcasm: Hey? I thought automated orbital welders only weld on flat planes?
Be interesting developing one that can move around a bicycle frame, or a system where the frame moves and keeps within the 50 parameters required for a good weld - in an inert atmosphere.
If there was a market, that would be a fabulous idea. Scale of economy strikes.
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Lets see. Frame made in USA. Cost: 20 x China made - and they don't need or use robots. They are NOT ahead of the West. They copy us.
Materials cost: 4 x China 'fabricated cost' - maybe and coming from China anyhow - but they charge 1 x if we employ them to do fabrication.
China, labor costs for highly skilled titanium welder: $15 - $30hr
USA, labor costs for above: Your first male child and a note on your home.
End of opinion section.
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No idea what pic you're referring to anyhow, you could (again) be way off base and out of context from (selectively) not reading the (glaringly) accompanying text (again) to prove some way out point (again).
Or it could just be me and I'm overlooking some seminal MASTER FLAW that negates all logic going forward.
I always reserve the right to change my mind and recommend cultivating that mindset.
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I'm saying it would take a dedicated artist to do this work and they would starve ...
... unless they had capital and the wisdom to see where 'titanium' is going, a long view of ramifications, the fortune they could make if the stockpiled the right tubes and did it as a cottage industry. That takes vison, a plan and indomitable focus.
This won't happen from some hipsters clownfund.
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I like leaders that can do.
Mr. Jones is (CURRENTLY) importing his titanium frames.
I don't see sanding and bead-blasting hiding the warts.

One can tell by the direction of the lines on the tubes.
Nothing to hide.
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If WTF-ever is effecting me getting my ti bike from WattWagons goes into the fall, I'm dumping the project, proceeding with my rear hub - and this time, using a Jones SWB Titanium frame or whatever else comes up that's even better - project, moving forward.
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So, anticipating that, I need an 'ACTIVE USA TITANIUM FRAME MANUFACTURER'.
I'm almost settled on Jones SWB model - more my size too. Just my trepidations about spinning drop-outs.
I'm installing a 100 - 120nm rear-hub motor.

JUST THE FRAME. I must have suspension in front, but recoil at upscaling weight of any kind.
The only need for more than three gear is 'overall range' - that won't work with a cassette.
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I hear: IGH's are all made by cave people from the iron age. 'Boink, bong, clang' on the stone anvil.
It's so difficult to cad-cam, then make parts out of epoxy/ nylon/ alloys that have no need to weigh 4 x as much.
Go ahead, be a defeatist Ludite, tell me 'you do it'. You give me their budget, I'll spend all profits (until stupid is gone) on R&D to come into the 21st century of composite material manufacturing - and stop pushing 'whale oil' cures.
We will dominate. Own the patents.
Lose (much) weight, gain best strength for specific requirements and dump the granite 'stone axe' mentality - fix that damn shifter too, K'nay.
Anything that's 'housing' and required to be rigid should be CF with metal inserts. All this 1980's knowledge, makes me feel ancient.
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So, it's the IGH; Battery and Hub Drive (w/ controller, etc) that're adding all the weight making the bike feel like the Bismarck - even if you're 'the Master of The Universe' at the best of all possible frame outcomes.
It's gonna be hard to build this machine - even using 21700's - to the 50lb spec I've chosen, and so few options.
But I'm going stir crazy.

Fn'F

 

[Fast n' Furious]

I called, no answer, so I sent an e asking 'Where is my bike'?
Just opened an e-mail from WW saying the bikes are in, but (because it's been 8 months) they can't access funds I paid to complete the transaction.
So, they'll return my payment (fees, interest/ new prices/ limitations on me), then I have to order again.
How are they doing that? I've heard people waiting for a long time and WW still holds their money - but can't access it?
Has anyone else here encountered this?
All these Helios orders ? The Hydra buyers that waited ?
They had to have funds returned and start over ?

Fn'F

 

[Deacon Blues]

All these Helios orders ? The Hydra buyers that waited ?
They had to have funds returned and start over ?

Fn'F

I didn't.

 

[KevinT]

I called, no answer, so I sent an e asking 'Where is my bike'?
Just opened an e-mail from WW saying the bikes are in, but (because it's been 8 months) they can't access funds I paid to complete the transaction.
So, they'll return my payment (fees, interest/ new prices/ limitations on me), then I have to order again.
How are they doing that? I've heard people waiting for a long time and WW still holds their money - but can't access it?
Has anyone else here encountered this?
All these Helios orders ? The Hydra buyers that waited ?
They had to have funds returned and start over ?

Fn'F

What email did you use to contact WW? I've tried several asking for status updates and have not received a reply.

 

[Fast n' Furious]

What email did you use to contact WW? I've tried several asking for status updates and have not received a reply.

WOW. MY #$@%en bad. I didn't have my goggles on. This is another company and product I have on order.
I'm not so concerned, it will work out. If it was my bike, I would be disappointed. I thought to myself, 'just get the money back, quit the whole dream and forget it'.
So, WW has not answered my ticket, nor returned my call. I'm thinking there's no movement.
Both Greg's number and the shops go unanswered.

Has anyone tried Amit?

Really sorry Fellah's

FnF

 

[TomD]

I just texted pushkar last night and got a reply, so can confrim he's still alive. When I haven't gotten a reply I've resorted to scheduling a 10 minute 1:1 with them:

https://www.calendly.com/wattwagons

 

[Deacon Blues]

Fn'F, did Pushkar tell you the new UC Pro frames are in?

 

[Fast n' Furious]

No. I deal with Greg or Amit.
I'm watching the China scene and, the beat goes on w/ lockdowns. They just shut Macao down.
This new covid is no joke. I found out. Way worse than the dose that hit me several months back and antivirals don't help either.

 

[Deacon Blues]

No. I deal with Greg or Amit.
I'm watching the China scene and, the beat goes on w/ lockdowns. They just shut Macao down.
This new covid is no joke. I found out. Way worse than the dose that hit me several months back and antivirals don't help either.

So did Greg or Amit tell you the UC Pro frames were in? I asked Pushkar last week and didn't get a response.

 

[Fast n' Furious]

I haven't been updated either - why I'm trying to make contact.

 

[Fast n' Furious]

https://electrek.co/2022/07/12/euro...f-the-exciting-electric-bike-debuts-well-see/
Maybe putting together a display at Eurobike ?
Meanwhile, I found this for you

. You can install a rack. Looks like Ice Fishing to me.
And Rome. You could attach a portable bar, your Ulua stick and a bait bag !
The owner posted it on the WW Facebook page.

 

[WaxedWookie]

Has anyone happened to have spoken with anyone at WW within the last day? I emailed them (politely) over 24h ago about something urgent that they have a week at most to resolve. I haven't heard back from 'em yet.

It seems there's 2 very different tiers of responsiveness people experience with WW - the standard, professional tier that TomD and Acme get (this may be related to them using SMS), and the experience others (including me) get - spending months screaming into the void, using email, chat, help tickets and the forum to get promises that'll be broken 95% of the time.

I hope you're in TomD's bucket.

 

[Fast n' Furious]

To you everything seem like it's 'out to get you', 'there's only us and them', you are 'anointed leader' and those that disagree 'are all on it'.
You. Waiting, deliberately holding up your bike for months (a parrot of never-ending complaints) for a seat available right down the street from you? Somebody points it out, you go: How did you find out where I live?
lol

 

[Fast n' Furious]

Any news?

 

[Lexicon]

The only update I have to the matter from before is that it took them a week to actually respond to me, but at least it got handled.
Side note... Anyone else lucky enough to get their bike still waiting on their wiring harness that was supposed to be "2-3 weeks" out back in the first week of April?

 

[Deacon Blues]

It has been very quiet on this forum. I wonder if Pushkar has any new frames in stock, or if he's still waiting......and waiting......and....