Some real comfortable bar grips? My ergon grips are a pain in the ...... wrist !

That would give me pause as well. I got mine from the ebay seller and the clamping ring is alloy, all quality build as far as I can tell.
 
Important to really check out all angles of grips, and sweep of the handle bars. Manufacturers such as SQLabs & Ergon make grips and bars to accommodate various sweep angles. 50K on an e fat bike is a long time in the saddle, particularly if its snowy, icy and rough. Would put anyone's comfort to the test.
 
Proper grip alignment and rotation with the bars and rider is essential for ergonomic comfort.

1586709825341.png
 
Alaskan said:
I don't get it.
Click to expand...
If you've never bought a piece of kit directly from China and found it to be every bit as good as a brand name, you may be spending more then you need to. I bought a tail light from a shop. It put laser lines on the roadway. I paid around $25. I ordered one from Aliexpress. It wasn't the typical knock off and was absolutely identical. Knock offs typically have some goo ups in packaging or text. There's no difference in comfort. Just price.
 
Thomas Jaszewski said:
If you've never bought a piece of kit directly from China and found it to be every bit as good as a brand name, you may be spending more then you need to. I bought a tail light from a shop. It put laser lines on the roadway. I paid around $25. I ordered one from Aliexpress. It wasn't the typical knock off and was absolutely identical. Knock offs typically have some goo ups in packaging or text. There's no difference in comfort. Just price.
Click to expand...
The problem is that its a crap shoot.

You don't know if you are getting the same quality item, a flawed second, a total reject or a cheap, flimsy knockoff till it arrives. So you saved a few bucks, waited three weeks to a month for it to arrive and then found it is a just what you paid for, a cheap POS. Case in point last year I purchased a "brand new in original packaging " Shimano XTR/Dura-Ace CN-HG901 11-Speed Chain. When I finally got around to opening up the box to replace my chain, I measured it only to find that it was almost 1.25% too long, a total waste of money.


I for one am done filling boxes in my shop with cheap, disappointing junk. It still happens from time to time but far less since i stopped risking my money by buying direct out of China
 
Thomas Jaszewski said:
If you've never bought a piece of kit directly from China and found it to be every bit as good as a brand name, you may be spending more then you need to.
Click to expand...

OTOH, if you have bought many knock-offs, you've probably contributed to copyright & patent infringement from these Chinese manufacturers. I know about this from the power woodworking tool business towards the end of the last century. As a business, unless you have your own personnel at the factory round the clock (which you need to do for quality control purposes), the Chinese factories may make batches of your product to be sold under other brand names. Those off-brand components may include ones rejected by the brand name QA representative, or they may just be a midnight run with cost-saving substitutions and changes made. These practices vary from manufacturer to manufacturer, and also depend on whether it's a Chinese company or a foreign company that's contracting with them.

Even if ethical (say the manufacturer actually created or owns the design), many Chinese factories will build at varying quality levels. From their point of view, this is a service they provide. As the "brand," you get to tell them the quality you're willing to accept, and they price accordingly. The stationary woodworking tools we bought in the 1990s under different brand names had noticeable quality differences - some that affected accuracy, some that affected convenience, and some that just affected "niceness." Like a bandsaw where the doors to the wheels had turned edges or not. Didn't affect accuracy but someone cut their hand on the non-turned edge door.

As a consumer, you may feel that these cheaper units have sufficient quality and/or that the brand name is charging too much for the quality bump. But, what you don't know is whether what you're buying is simply a unit at a different price/quality point or a unit that would be prosecutable under copyright/patent infringement law in the US.

I haven't done any comparisons of bicycle components myself. There are many off-brand items like stems or handlebars or seatposts to be had, and just looking at Amazon you can often see the same item (sometimes even the same photo!) from different companies at different prices. As long as they're not copying patented designs, that's fair game. Where it gets bad is when your Shimano thing-a-ma-bob isn't actually Shimano. For something like brakes, for instance, that would be really scary.
 
smorgasbord said:
you've probably contributed to copyright & patent infringement
Click to expand...
Sorta like shopping at Walmart...?
Patent infringement happens here too. But some companies solve the infringement suits by buying out the patent holder.ie. Electra and Trek.
Alaskan said:
You don't know if you are getting the same quality item,
Click to expand...
You mean you don't? ;) After buying selling and supporting kit builders for more than half of the last decade, I know the vendors and what's available. I can buy a set of brakes levers from Grin or buy the same brand for half their price. Selling kit components we learned early on which suppliers are fair (fairer?) trade.

And brand names sold here doesn't always help. I had the pleasure of buying the now scarce Ergon pedals at an inflated price, only to have them fail and be discontinued.

Every one of us, even those on the high ground, supports China and their eBike sellers.
 
Alaskan said:
The problem is that its a crap shoot.
Click to expand...
Crapshoot the second-best odds in the casino. Again, only if you buy blindly. Several other active fellows who kit build can share experiences and companies. Some can afford a $7000 bike, others ride with just as big of a smile on a converted bike for $1100 $1500.
 
Here is one example of the "same" wheel truing stand unit being sold under multiple brand names at different price points at Amazon:

GoPlus $42.99

WEELOLOE $34.99

Ejoyous $45.59

Lixada $59.99

Estink $44.19 (love the name!)

Click on the links and look at the pictures. Where's the $25 difference coming from?


Even Park Tool has two versions of their truing stand (TS-2.2 and TS-4), where the more expensive one includes a few adapters for things like thru-axles, but most of what you pay for is that it is built in Minnesota instead of overseas, so it's more nicely finished and operates smoother.

And, of course, BikeHand has an even cheaper clone of the TS-2. Doesn't appear to be made in the same factory as the Park Tools.
 
Park site reads, "We're doing more manufacturing in-house than ever and our plans include expanding to do even more ourselves." I like their stuff and have my fair share. Watch for my sell-off of Park and Pedros early this summer. No more scratch builds or custom builds. Life is to short to skip a ride.
 
Oops, I must confess, I have lots of Chinese, and other Asian produced aftermarket products on my bike.
Come to think of it, most of my p.o.s. bulls bike is produced in Asia, with a North American over inflated price tag. I too ordered a China XTR Shimano chain, but it seems to be excellent quality, and I just serviced it today as a matter of fact, it was $11US or so and is holding up extremely well. And it is wrapped around a Sunrace 11-50 tooth cassette, from Taiwan, which has given me a extremely versatile bicycle, and that cassette is excellent, and is as good if not better than the Shimano cassette it replaced.
We don't really have good vendors in Canada, and the prices are so over valued, that it forces us to other options, and you are correct, long shipping times, but that being said, if I ever have a issue with a overseas vendor, I find almost always, they will work with you to solve your problem, unlike local venders who give you
the song and dance, followed by the middle finger.
 
I find the discomfort with straight bar bikes comes from the limited number of hand positions.

To solve this problem, my pedal bikes have bar ends or brahma bars with sponge foam handle bar covers.

My ebike has old-school wide-spaced aerobars like in the picture below.

I haven't made long enough rides to use it yet, but I can rest my arms/hands where terrain is less challenging.

My phone is mounted on the front of the aerobar (with either google maps or rearview camera footage), so that I don't have to look down much to see it.

If it were my wrists then I would take some time away from riding and fully recover.
 

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Thomas Jaszewski said:
If you've never bought a piece of kit directly from China and found it to be every bit as good as a brand name, you may be spending more then you need to. I bought a tail light from a shop. It put laser lines on the roadway. I paid around $25. I ordered one from Aliexpress. It wasn't the typical knock off and was absolutely identical. Knock offs typically have some goo ups in packaging or text. There's no difference in comfort. Just price.
Click to expand...
So true. One of the things Chinese factories will do is take an order for, say, 1000 units, from a client, fulfill that order, but run the factory to make 10 times that number, then sell them direct to consumers via places like Aliexpress or Fasttech.

I first learned about this with e-cigs, as "designer" RDAs with limited runs would sell for $100 or far more, but the factory would stamp out thousands without serial numbers and sell them for a fraction of a price. This is still rampant on Fasttech, and they do e-bike accessories as well.
 
Thomas Jaszewski said:
Crapshoot the second-best odds in the casino. Again, only if you buy blindly. Several other active fellows who kit build can share experiences and companies. Some can afford a $7000 bike, others ride with just as big of a smile on a converted bike for $1100 $1500.
Click to expand...
Thomas, I get that with your professional experience that you have been able to sort out the wheat from the chaff when it comes to sourcing quality bike parts from China. For me, and I suspect many others, who are looking to equip and maintain the bikes they ride, regardless of where those were bought, knowing who can be trusted, half way around the world, is not so easy, especially with all the issues cited above.

Add in my preference for supporting local business, i.e. my neighbors and friends, and saving a few dollars and having to wait weeks for something to arrive, is not enough to offset my desire to support my community and sustain the convenience of being able to go to a store and buy what I need when I need it. Then there is the added benefit that if what I bought locally is flawed, I get a replacement that same day. No calling an 800 number and going on hold for half an hour, no waiting for another month for something to get to me...if the emerchant in Asia is an honest one.
 
antboy said:
So true. One of the things Chinese factories will do is take an order for, say, 1000 units, from a client, fulfill that order, but run the factory to make 10 times that number, then sell them direct to consumers via places like Aliexpress or Fasttech.
Click to expand...

As I said above, but note that these mid-night runs may not be at the same quality. Chinese manufacturing is very flexible, often more manual than automated, and substitutions of lesser materials is possible, exclusion of how parts are finished, as is lowering the "pass bar" for QA.
 
Alaskan said:
Thomas, I get that with your professional experience that you have been able to sort out the wheat from the chaff when it comes to sourcing quality bike parts from China. For me, and I suspect many others, who are looking to equip and maintain the bikes they ride, regardless of where those were bought, knowing who can be trusted, half way around the world, is not so easy, especially with all the issues cited above.

Add in my preference for supporting local business, i.e. my neighbors and friends, and saving a few dollars and having to wait weeks for something to arrive, is not enough to offset my desire to support my community and sustain the convenience of being able to go to a store and buy what I need when I need it. Then there is the added benefit that if what I bought locally is flawed, I get a replacement that same day. No calling an 800 number and going on hold for half an hour, no waiting for another month for something to get to me...if the emerchant in Asia is an honest one.
Click to expand...
Thank you. I too get your point. For many there is no local business. I’d have to drive to Minneapolis or St Paul MN 110 miles.

And only after a dozen phone calls checking stock.

which is one of the reasons I like this forum so much. You and so mNy others share ideas and products.

I hope I bring as much to the plate as you and others.JRA JR Rich Harry, the list is quite long.

thanks for your perspective.
 
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