Mission Control App - Turbo Vado Solution Now Available

[rochrunner]

I can only tell you now that the "Turbo Vado/Como Tune" reports the Health of my first battery as 97% and the of second one as 100%. Meaning the first battery can store 585 Wh and the other 604. Unluckily, the degraded Health might result from the weakest cell(s) in the whole battery. We have to live with that.

The author of the BLEvo app indicated to me that the reduced health is just a matter of aging and might actually be a calculation of the number of recharge cycles vs the rated number for the specified battery life (that is, you have 97% of the "maximum" recharge cycles remaining). Does your 585Wh battery have more recharges than the 604?

 

[Kam1936]

I can only tell you now that the "Turbo Vado/Como Tune" reports the Health of my first battery as 97% and the of second one as 100%. Meaning the first battery can store 585 Wh and the other 604. Unluckily, the degraded Health might result from the weakest cell(s) in the whole battery. We have to live with that.

I can only guess you cannot de-restrict the bike because Specialized seem to have protected that parameter well in the Vado but no-one knows before an experiment is done.

Based on the math that is correct. But has anyone measured the actual capacity of their battery? As far as I know, BLEvo is the app that shows this stat. Specialized called it 600 and 604 in different places. I'm not sure what the true battery capacity to rider is. Some suggest at 100% and 100% battery health 574 battery capacity is available until discharged completely.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

For sure somebody did but not for the Vado I think

 

[Stefan Mikes]

The author of the BLEvo app indicated to me that the reduced health is just a matter of aging and might actually be a calculation of the number of recharge cycles vs the rated number for the specified battery life (that is, you have 97% of the "maximum" recharge cycles remaining). Does your 585Wh battery have more recharges than the 604?

It is old in the first instance. Cannot determine the number of recharges without the TCD-W.

 

[Kam1936]

For sure somebody did but not for the Vado I think

There it is then. All of us have been hoodwinked and taken advantage of. Sending bike back to lbs.

 

[rochrunner]

Also just because an app shows something doesn't mean it's correct/accurate. It's not clear to me what values are read directly from the bike vs which are calculated or estimated based on other data.

 

[Kam1936]

Also just because an app shows something doesn't mean it's correct/accurate. It's not clear to me what values are read directly from the bike vs which are calculated or estimated based on other data.

I agree. But I'm kind of leaning towards the app readings as others have reported true value available to rider is 95%. (574 or 573)

 

[Kam1936]

I agree. But I'm kind of leaning towards the app readings as others have reported true value available to rider is 95%. (574 or 573)

600 x .98 = 588
604 × .98 = 591.92
Based on the math without any other evidence, I believe my battery is 604 not 600. I also believe BLEvo is accurately reading 98 % capacity 592 (at 100 % battery health) available for the ride. The last 2 % being unavailable to protect the battery. I'm thinking 5 % unavailable is not accurate. Numbers don't match up. Matches up perfectly × .98 with 604 battery. It makes sense that the bike will shut down when 592 is depleted.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Oh well. The battery is 604 Wh nominal. There are two types of Li-Ion cells commonly used in e-bikes: the older 18650 (65 x 18 mm) and the newer 21700 (70 x 21mm). The 21700 was first released in 2015 with the special focus on using it in e-bikes. It is used in newer Tesla cars as well. The 21700 cell has the nominal voltage of 3.7 V; to achieve 36 V nominal, you use 10 cells in series. The 604 Wh battery of the Vado has the charge of 16.8 Ah. I believe 4 rows of cells are connected in parallel, giving the single cell nominal charge of 4200 mAh. So it is the 10s4p battery layout.

Note some Vado models have had the 460 Wh battery (3.0) and some have got 500 Wh batteries (4.0). Since the external size of the battery is the same in all bike models, it means less capable (and less expensive) cells were used in the less expensive models of the Vado: 3200 mAh cells in the 3.0 and 3470 mAh in the 4.0.

The way the battery charge is calculated and reported is rather obscure. The 604 Wh is the nominal value but actual batteries differ in the capacity because the cells are unfortunately not identical. It is hard to draw conclusions. Only a test of a battery in a discharging apparatus as used by custom battery makers would be a proof.

I have noticed that the pedal assistance in my Vado drops down significantly at 5% battery left. The support is greatly reduced to keep the lights and the display operating; I think the pedalling is still assisted at very low level, so I can ride for 1-2 km more to find a safe place at which I can swap the batteries. Switching the support to OFF makes the bike feel even heavier. I have never gone down to less than 4% though so I cannot tell what happens at the 2% of battery left.

 

[TS25]

Also just because an app shows something doesn't mean it's correct/accurate. It's not clear to me what values are read directly from the bike vs which are calculated or estimated based on other data.

That's the point. It's just a number that should be seen as relative.

Some new batteries showed 95% right at the start. Doesn't matter.
What matters is if this number is the same in lets say 4 months time or is declining.

 

[TS25]

I have noticed that the pedal assistance in my Vado drops down significantly at 5% battery left. The support is greatly reduced to keep the lights and the display operating; I think the pedalling is still assisted at very low level, so I can ride for 1-2 km more to find a safe place at which I can swap the batteries. Switching the support to OFF makes the bike feel even heavier. I have never gone down to less than 4% though so I cannot tell what happens at the 2% of battery left.

Most hints for an extended battery life guide you to riding between 20 -80% left. And to recharge to app. 80% only and add the extra 20% the morning you're riding if necessary. Down to 5% or less is not healthy for the battery in the long term.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Life is too short, TS

 

[TS25]

I bet you're right.
So you're coming along for an uphill run on the jump?

 

[rochrunner]

Wait a minute... What is that shifter on the left side? You have a triple crank? Must not be your Vado.

 

[Kam1936]

Oh well. The battery is 604 Wh nominal. There are two types of Li-Ion cells commonly used in e-bikes: the older 18650 (65 x 18 mm) and the newer 21700 (70 x 21mm). The 21700 was first released in 2015 with the special focus on using it in e-bikes. It is used in newer Tesla cars as well. The 21700 cell has the nominal voltage of 3.7 V; to achieve 36 V nominal, you use 10 cells in series. The 604 Wh battery of the Vado has the charge of 16.8 Ah. I believe 4 rows of cells are connected in parallel, giving the single cell nominal charge of 4200 mAh. So it is the 10s4p battery layout.

Note some Vado models have had the 460 Wh battery (3.0) and some have got 500 Wh batteries (4.0). Since the external size of the battery is the same in all bike models, it means less capable (and less expensive) cells were used in the less expensive models of the Vado: 3200 mAh cells in the 3.0 and 3470 mAh in the 4.0.

The way the battery charge is calculated and reported is rather obscure. The 604 Wh is the nominal value but actual batteries differ in the capacity because the cells are unfortunately not identical. It is hard to draw conclusions. Only a test of a battery in a discharging apparatus as used by custom battery makers would be a proof.

I have noticed that the pedal assistance in my Vado drops down significantly at 5% battery left. The support is greatly reduced to keep the lights and the display operating; I think the pedalling is still assisted at very low level, so I can ride for 1-2 km more to find a safe place at which I can swap the batteries. Switching the support to OFF makes the bike feel even heavier. I have never gone down to less than 4% though so I cannot tell what happens at the 2% of battery left.

"cannot tell what happens at the 2% of battery left." ☝ I don't want to find out. Lowest percentage I've dropped to is 9% remaining after 62 miles.
Li-ion batteries will shut off my computer and phone between 2 and 4 percent remaining. On my computer which is practically new, it shutdowns at 2%. My phone shuts down at 4% probably because it's older. According to: https://electricbikereview.com/specialized/turbo-vado-5-0/
The battery is 604.8. Multiply that by 98% is 592.704. My point was to show that BLEvo was probably reading accurately the battery's percentage at 98% rather than at 100% because the last 2% is protected from consumption.
Based on the numbers and what others have said, I think it makes sense. After 15 charges my battery health is shows 100% in Mission Control and BLEvo.

 

[Kam1936]

That's the point. It's just a number that should be seen as relative.

Some new batteries showed 95% right at the start. Doesn't matter.
What matters is if this number is the same in lets say 4 months time or is declining.

These new batteries showed health 95% from the beginning? Or they would only go to 95% charge? How many charges before the health of the battery starts to decline?

 

[TS25]

They showed it from the beginning.
Specialized answered don't bother, we can't explain, and it's a "relative number/information" but don't take it too serious.

 

[Kam1936]

They showed it from the beginning.
Specialized answered don't bother, we can't explain, and it's a "relative number/information" but don't take it too serious.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Wait a minute... What is that shifter on the left side? You have a triple crank? Must not be your Vado.

That's my Lovelec Diadem. I rotate both bikes, so each of them is ridden on another day. I invested a lot in that bike and it pays me off with comfortable long rides. Today's was 50 miles

 

[Stefan Mikes]

I bet you're right.
So you're coming along for an uphill run on the jump?

Willingen as in "the Venus of Willingen"? Oh, wait. She was from Willendorf