Lectric XP and steep hills

[Oktane]

I received my two bikes and build quality is nice. I live in a very hilly area and moderate hills are handled without difficulty using PAS 3-4.

On some steep hills (I don’t know the percentage grade) even at PAS5 it’s a workout which will result in leg burn.

Compared to the 750W RadPower Mini, the Lectric XP does require more effort. I know for the price difference (1/2) and 500W @ 20A vs. 750W @ 28A this is expected.

I’m hoping Lectric or an aftermarket will allow a controller upgrade for more current and power, since my hills are steep and for my 10 mile round-trip I don’t need the range.

 

[Snokid]

Amazon.com : NBpower 36V/48V 750W 25A Brushless DC Motor Controller Ebike Controller +KT-LCD8H Color Display One Set，Used for 750W-1000W Ebike Kit. : Sports & Outdoors

Amazon.com : NBpower 36V/48V 750W 25A Brushless DC Motor Controller Ebike Controller +KT-LCD8H Color Display One Set，Used for 750W-1000W Ebike Kit. : Sports & Outdoors

www.amazon.com

there you go.

 

[Oktane]

I appreciate you posting that. Has this been tried before on Lectric bikes?

 

[Snokid]

someone else is in the process of changing to that don't remember his screen name. They are doing it because the got a locked controller bike. Lectric doesn't matter other than warranty. 500 watt hub motor brake cut offs all the same stuff on these style ebikes. Pretty simple change if you are the least bit handy.

 

[Bxg]

I’m hoping Lectric or an aftermarket will allow a controller upgrade for more current and power, since my hills are steep and for my 10 mile round-trip I don’t need the range.

You'd have to change the hub motor too.

 

[Snokid]

shouldn't need to change the hub motor, I don't remember where I saw it but it's 750 downrated to 500watts. Even if it wasn't unless it's getting hot it would be just fine. People overdrive hub motors all the time. watch some of andy Kirby's video's 5000watt motor overdriven to something like 12kw.

 

[Bxg]

It's 500w continuous 800w peak. which means he's already climbing the hills at 800w and the motor is not keeping up. I believe He needs a motor with more torque. You can overdrive a motor on the flats and get more speed, but hills are different.

 

[Doomsday]

Keep in mind seat height adjustments. I think there are only 2 lectric xp videos out there that have proper seat height. 99% of the folks seem to be riding with the seat way lower than it should be. This will result in extreme leg burn as you will have to work much harder on those steep hills because your legs are not getting the proper extension it needs for full power. Just something to think about. It might not be needed on flat ground but proper seat height is a must for not killing your legs in a hurry when on hills.

 

[Oktane]

Those are great suggestions. I know I keep my seat a little lower than ideal because I feel I can get off the bike easier in a hurry if needed. On the steep hills I am hitting the 20A current limit. I wonder if a higher voltage battery might allow more power to the motor. Would be nice to know the maximum voltage input allowable to the current controller.

As I mentioned, I did not have this issue with the RadPower Mini, which I've rented before and used in the same spots, so the Lectric XP is slightly inferior in the power department.

 

[Snokid]

unless you have changed p14 (18amp) the bike will deliver 864 watts given 48v, or 936 watts if you use 52v.
I don't have a rad but if it's drawing 28 amps then it's1344 & 1456 for 48v and 52v on a 750 watt motor.
So what's the difference between a 500 & 750 watt motor? First I already know bofang offers 2 different 750 watt motors 1 is larger. but 1 is the same size as the 500 watt motor. Winding size would be the only thing they can change.

What happens if you give a 500watt motor 2000 watts of power? Nothing unless you give that power something to do. What I mean if you lift the back tire off the ground and feed the motor with 2000watts of power the wheel will just spin nothing bad will happen. but now clamp the tire so it can't spin and give it 500watts of power it will overheat and burn up.

If you are going to mass produce bikes that all sizes of people will ride then you limit the current to a conservative amount of current. ie. 18amps.
I you want to increase power then you need to do some testing of your own, but you will need a controller that will allow that....bring the current up a little then ride record temps rinse and repeat...

Still might end up replacing the hub motor but you don't know without testing. you might be 100lbs and I might be 300lbs big difference on the heat.

It's 500w continuous 800w peak. which means he's already climbing the hills at 800w and the motor is not keeping up. I believe He needs a motor with more torque. You can overdrive a motor on the flats and get more speed, but hills are different.

 

[Snokid]

forgot to add...
on these style motor voltage is what determines motor rpm... so if your main goal is faster then you still need a new controller but you also will need a higher voltage battery.
it's not this simple but these controllers are basically voltage regulators...
volts=speed current=torque

 

[Browneye]

I don't wish to hijack this thread, but perhaps someone could answer a related question on amps and watts, still new at all this.

I'm trying to decide between 36v and 48v 500 watt motors - mid-drive or hub, but primarily hub for a Specialized Roll, but unclear of what the difference in volts makes for speed or power.
I'm also curious about the comment upthread about just two motor sizes for bafang hubs. Their watts rating is based on volts then, for several combinations - 36/350/500 and 48/500/750/1000?
I didn't realize the higher watt motor was actually larger as well, for either hub drive or mid-drive. The 1000watt must be with 52v then and a controller to provide enough amps.

Wifey surely doesn't need or want 28mph, but 15-18 would probly be great, and some help with hills. I was thinking mid-drive, but now moving to the hub concept, they're cheaper and she can just coast along with a throttle - that's her riding style. We're old, she's no speed demon, and my motorcycle days are over. LOL Casual paved path riders here.

 

[BikingFry]

unless you have changed p14 (18amp) the bike will deliver 864 watts given 48v, or 936 watts if you use 52v.
I don't have a rad but if it's drawing 28 amps then it's1344 & 1456 for 48v and 52v on a 750 watt motor.
So what's the difference between a 500 & 750 watt motor? First I already know bofang offers 2 different 750 watt motors 1 is larger. but 1 is the same size as the 500 watt motor. Winding size would be the only thing they can change.

What happens if you give a 500watt motor 2000 watts of power? Nothing unless you give that power something to do. What I mean if you lift the back tire off the ground and feed the motor with 2000watts of power the wheel will just spin nothing bad will happen. but now clamp the tire so it can't spin and give it 500watts of power it will overheat and burn up.

If you are going to mass produce bikes that all sizes of people will ride then you limit the current to a conservative amount of current. ie. 18amps.
I you want to increase power then you need to do some testing of your own, but you will need a controller that will allow that....bring the current up a little then ride record temps rinse and repeat...

Still might end up replacing the hub motor but you don't know without testing. you might be 100lbs and I might be 300lbs big difference on the heat.

You can't apply "2000 watts of power" to a free spinning wheel. Watts equals volts multiplied by amps. That free spinning wheel won't pull the amps to hit 2000 watts. Now if you load that wheel down and allow it to draw 50 amps at 40 volts then it has 2000 watts of power applied to it. The power applied always has to have "something to do". or it won't be applied, just capable of being applied.

 

[Snokid]

very true. was trying to put this in the simplest terms I should of explained that also.

 

[Oktane]

Might be easiest just to add a small front hub motor I’m thinking. Any ideas on a 20” that I could rig up with a small second battery?

 

[harryS]

Depends on your skill set. I think it's easier to try a 25A controller. Will the battery supply 25A?

I've done the 2WD thing on a fatbike. I had a second throttle on the handlebars, a second battery and the controller in a frame bag. I bought a regular rear geared motor and laced it into a fatbike rim. No, it was easier to put in a 25A controller. And in the end, I went back to RWD.

 

[RobK]

shouldn't need to change the hub motor, I don't remember where I saw it but it's 750 downrated to 500watts. Even if it wasn't unless it's getting hot it would be just fine. People overdrive hub motors all the time. watch some of andy Kirby's video's 5000watt motor overdriven to something like 12kw.

I think you are correct. It looks like the motor is capable to do much more. XP controller is limited at 18A max and with full battery at 54.6v it can generate 983watts.
IMO 25A controller will work on flat roads but on long uphill roads you will burn the motor.

 

[tony234]

I put A BBSHD on mine and I have so much power I don't have to even pedal up the steepest inclines if i did not want to! Best part, you can install it with the other motor still intact and use them BOTH!!

 

[Frogtown]

I put A BBSHD on mine and I have so much power I don't have to even pedal up the steepest inclines if i did not want to! Best part, you can install it with the other motor still intact and use them BOTH!!

That is a cool idea! What model did you use? Was it hard to do? Are there any videos I can reference, all I can find are videos of it being installed on a standard bike so i am unsure how they work in tandem. Love to hear how you did it. I ordered an XP and I love hearing about how other people are modding them!

 

[Rogue XP]

I received my two bikes and build quality is nice. I live in a very hilly area and moderate hills are handled without difficulty using PAS 3-4.

On some steep hills (I don’t know the percentage grade) even at PAS5 it’s a workout which will result in leg burn.

Compared to the 750W RadPower Mini, the Lectric XP does require more effort. I know for the price difference (1/2) and 500W @ 20A vs. 750W @ 28A this is expected.

I’m hoping Lectric or an aftermarket will allow a controller upgrade for more current and power since my hills are steep and for my 10-mile round-trip, I don’t need the range.

The problem is the gearing in the XP, I am changing mine to a 11-34T for that same reason. I have read on other forums that it is a night and day difference. You get a lower first gear and a higher 7th gear so you don't get that ghost peddling and can maintain higher speeds easily. The Radrunner already has the 11-34T gearing in it from what I read. Now if this does not work down the road I will do a rework of the bike and get a magic Pie Motor kit for $395 its a 1000 watt fat tire kit, they have all sizes of hubs and wheels.