Electric Car thread

Rexlion said:
Meanwhile, this weekend many eastern states' residents were asked to not recharge their EVs because it could push the grid into rolling blackouts. "Not that scary," right... ;)
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I know you think you are making some sort of argument, but it is a pretty irrelevant one.
There is an electricity shortage so they ask people to preserve electricity, so what?
That applies to any electrical consumption, not just EVs. In Europe they asked people to reduce their heating habits, they asked some businesses to close certain hours etc.... It does not make heating bad, or these company a problem....
If tomorrow there is a shortage of Oil, they will ask you to limit your ICE car usage, that does not make ICE cars a problem ....
 
Rexlion said:
Meanwhile, this weekend many eastern states' residents were asked to not recharge their EVs because it could push the grid into rolling blackouts. "Not that scary," right... ;)
Click to expand...
I'm on the eastern seaboard and I don't remember being asked this by anyone or any utility. So...who did the asking?? Why am I being left out of the loop....or.... is this just some newspaper fictitious fodder? If so, I could use some of that paper to start the fire in the fireplace. 🔥 If it's internet fodder, it's of even less value.
 
Per WSJ news article today, it has become more expensive in Berlin to charge a Tesla 3 for an equivalent 100 miles €18.46 vs. a Honda Civic for 100 miles €18.31. The Civic is equivalent in the EPA Fuel Guide to the Tesla 3.
 
Sparky731 said:
Per WSJ news article today, it has become more expensive in Berlin to charge a Tesla 3 for an equivalent 100 miles €18.46 vs. a Honda Civic for 100 miles €18.31. The Civic is equivalent in the EPA Fuel Guide to the Tesla 3.
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And last month it was the opposite, and next month who knows...
That is what I like about EVs.
Put solar on your roof, and you no longer have to worry about which crisis is going to inflate which energy prices (regardless of the one you use) :)
All the while enjoying the best driving and ownership car experience...
 
Step by step we're getting closer to having our EVs do more than just transport us down the road.

Australian vineyard owner turns to his Nissan Leaf paired with his new solar panels to provide power to his business.

And this which really has me sitting up and taking notice: Getting North America prepared for individuals to start providing power to their homes via their Nissan Leafs

Nissan has been showcasing their EVs capacity to run V2H (vehicle to house) since the mid 2010s. It's about time they made it available to the those who own Leafs. The company who installed our solar array said they will be more than happy to come out to do the Solar/Leaf/house panel install for my emergency backup.

Right now I'm happy with the Grid doing the job banking my excess power for me, seamlessly transitioning my house throughout the day from solar to grid back to solar as needed, and me having my solar green credits making money for me by being sold on the open market. One big plus regarding the V2H is I'll have a mobile 40kWh battery source that I can drive to any local available open charging station to "fill" should an extreme emergency require it. Can't do that with a solar battery affixed to the house wall.
 
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Over the last 2 years, our electric rates have more than doubled. Yes, gasoline has also gone up but not as much percentage wise. At this rate, in 10 years, EV's will be more expensive to operate than ICE vehicles. 🙄
 
6zfshdb said:
Over the last 2 years, our electric rates have more than doubled. Yes, gasoline has also gone up but not as much percentage wise. At this rate, in 10 years, EV's will be more expensive to operate than ICE vehicles. 🙄
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Let's hope that in 10 years we will have vehicles that can go 1,000 miles on one charge. In the past 4 years the battery capacity has gone from 150 miles/charge to 400 miles/charge. In another 4 years I'll wager the top range will be 800 miles/charge.

I'll also wager that the gas companies will have started including charging stations besides their pumps. Thing is...those charging stations are only useful for people who can't charge from home, or at work, or are going for long trips. Not everyone will need them, like everyone today needs gasoline that is controlled by the major oil corporations. Most of the people I know that have EVs also have solar on their houses. Just a matter of time before residential solar become the defacto "free" electric supply for a good number of households.

We're in the beginning stage of an era of historic transition from fossil fuels to cleaner energy. Not much of the past will be remaining in 20 years from now.

Honestly, I'm looking forward to what life will be in 7 years from now. It's going to be amazing.
 
1 in 5 Australia homes have PV arrays on their roofs. In conjunction with some mega batteries that's been enough to push energy generation to 100% renewable for large portions of the day in several states. That's also a fair chunk of idle capacity that can be directed towards EV charging. Our PV generates between 25 - 45 kWh per day when the sun is shining, which is bloody well most of the time. A day of that would do our mileage needs for close to a fortnight.

The rise of micro grids and community storage is further strengthening resilience in the energy network to shocks like fire, flood and other extreme climatic events. Not that there's many of those around at the moment 🙄

You folk in shadier climes have your own challenges, but I've never seen capitalism fail to rise to a solution where money and demand are on the table.

The last few years (in particular the last year) has also brought home the danger of over reliance on totalitarian states for goods and resources. It's reassuring to read steps towards nationalising battery and EV manufacture: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-12...rt-lithium-battery-renewable-energy/101793740

I also remain cautiously optimistic. It's not going to be an energy utopia. It's still a marketplace and capital expects return. And there's still massive, unresolved equity issues for lower income motorists, renters and home owners. But I see hope for a more diversified, resilient, cleaner network. And that's without even mentioning the climatic impact of fossil fuels.
 
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In perfect EV utopia (or autopia)... everyone will have solar and batteries (or EVs will act as batteries using V2G).

Neighborhoods will become self sufficient and there will not be any loss of electricity even if the grid goes down (at least in the sunny areas of the world).

By then... nuclear fusion will be perfected and we will all have cars that run on trash (time machines are too far fetched :) ).
 
From electricdrive.com posted Dec 2, 2022

In the last few days, reports in various media outlets have circulated which, at least in their headlines, somewhat luridly suggested that Switzerland was planning driving bans for electric cars. It turns out the truth behind the “news” is not quite that wild.

The basis for the reports is the ‘Ordinance on Restrictions and Prohibitions on the Use of Electric Energy’. So far, this is only a draft the Swiss Federal Council is currently writing to prepare for the possibility of an electricity shortage, as are other countries – as an emergency response.

The draft ordinance regulates “restrictions and prohibitions on the use of electrical energy in order to secure the country’s electricity supply”. It outlines four possible escalation levels within which the use of bans would at best be staggered in the event of a crisis. E-mobility is only mentioned in escalation level 3 as one of many possible measures. There it says: “The private use of electric cars is only permitted for absolutely necessary journeys (e.g. exercising one’s profession, shopping, visiting the doctor, attending religious events, attending court appointments).”

So: Should there really be a power shortage in Switzerland, according to the draft, partial driving bans for electric cars could be considered as one of numerous upstream measures.

"Could" is the operative word. It's a hand wiggle gesture to invoke the "maybe, maybe not" scenario meant to cover all the bases in fleshing out what can be mitigated in government disaster planning. In this draft the only scenario where an EV driving would be banned is for "larking" Ie - driving around just for the hell of it with no purpose except for fun. And in a disaster are the police going to have the time or manpower to chase down those joyriding electric cars or set up roadblocks to ensure frivolous EV drivers stay off the road? Think about it. Throw into the mix what if your car is run off solar? That presents a whole different set of options.

Doubt this "idea" would ever become a reality.

The draft is just tossing stuff at a wall and seeing what sticks. An "unnecessary use of an EV" ban won't. It will actually cause more mayhem in more ways than one.
 
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Readytoride said:
From electricdrive.com posted Dec 2, 2022

In the last few days, reports in various media outlets have circulated which, at least in their headlines, somewhat luridly suggested that Switzerland was planning driving bans for electric cars. It turns out the truth behind the “news” is not quite that wild.

The basis for the reports is the ‘Ordinance on Restrictions and Prohibitions on the Use of Electric Energy’. So far, this is only a draft the Swiss Federal Council is currently writing to prepare for the possibility of an electricity shortage, as are other countries – as an emergency response.

The draft ordinance regulates “restrictions and prohibitions on the use of electrical energy in order to secure the country’s electricity supply”. It outlines four possible escalation levels within which the use of bans would at best be staggered in the event of a crisis. E-mobility is only mentioned in escalation level 3 as one of many possible measures. There it says: “The private use of electric cars is only permitted for absolutely necessary journeys (e.g. exercising one’s profession, shopping, visiting the doctor, attending religious events, attending court appointments).”

So: Should there really be a power shortage in Switzerland, according to the draft, partial driving bans for electric cars could be considered as one of numerous upstream measures.

"Could" is the operative word. It's a hand wiggle gesture to invoke the "maybe, maybe not" scenario meant to cover all the bases in fleshing out what can be mitigated in government disaster planning. And in a disaster are the police going to have the time or manpower to chase down the electric cars or set up roadblocks to ensure EVs stay off the road? Thunk about it. Doubt it. What if your car is run off solar? That presents a whole different set of options.

The draft is just tossing stuff at a wall and seeing what sticks. An EV ban won't. It will actually cause more mayhem in more ways than one.
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Thank you for that.
Refreshing to see information as opposed to Spinning from the narrow minded individuals only looking to support their personal unfounded Bias :)
 
scrambler said:
I know you think you are making some sort of argument, but it is a pretty irrelevant one.
There is an electricity shortage so they ask people to preserve electricity, so what?
That applies to any electrical consumption, not just EVs. In Europe they asked people to reduce their heating habits, they asked some businesses to close certain hours etc.... It does not make heating bad, or these company a problem....
If tomorrow there is a shortage of Oil, they will ask you to limit your ICE car usage, that does not make ICE cars a problem ....
Click to expand...
Not so irrelevant. Remember the cold snap in TX last winter and the blackouts there? The electric utility couldn't keep up. This recent storm caused similar problems in more than one locale. One I recall specifically was in Tennessee, where residents were angry about losing power while the Titans' stadium stayed fully powered for their game. I don't recall exactly where some of the other electric shortages were, but it was on the nightly news. Besides that, doesn't everyone recall the shortfalls in California during the last couple of years that were in the news? Or are people's memories really that short?? 😛

Meanwhile, when was the last time we had a gas shortage? 1974? 😂 So, yes, electric shortages are extremely relevant, because they're happening multiple times per year in this country. And my reason for posting the original comment was in response to the claim that full EV usage by everyone would only raise the amount of electricity needed by 20-some percent. Well, whoopee, because the utilities aren't set to handle that much increase in demand! Add another 20% draw to the grid nationwide, and a flea landing on a power line might be enough to shut down the whole country! 🤣 (Ok, that last bit was hyperbole.)
 
@Rexlion so what's your takeaway?

There's no backing the ox cart up. The shift is underway, and as usual infrastructure is playing catch up. If we waited until everything was in place before making the transition we'd be waiting forever - by virtue of our short election cycles and shareholder returns policy and industry is almost by design reactive.

Ironically I see EVs playing a big part in solving the issues you bring up. Give them a few years and we'll see decentralised 'cloud' microgrids in the form of cars feeding back to the network. They'll charge when generation is high and demand low, and feed when the opposite is true. Trials are already underway.

As I've said here multiple times, the transition won't be seamless. They never are. Having said that, there's the potential for massive, positive disruption to a number of sectors as a result of the shift. I'm not jumping in yet, but I'm enjoying having a front seat to the change.
 
The way the car companies are jumping into the EV market makes me think they are counting on or know of better batteries coming
soon. There has to be something on the horizon for them to be investing so heavily in the EV market.. What we now have in battery performance leaves a lot to be desired. Things like weight to energy, extreme weather performance, fire hazard etc.
 
kevinmccune said:
I can think of a couple of reasons were the weight can be an asset.
Click to expand...
That is true for a tractor or fork lift but not when it comes to the weight and volume of your fuel in an automobile etc.
A gallon of gasoline is 6 pounds and will propel a small Honda motorcycle 125 miles and work when it is 30 degrees below zero.
When a battery that weighs 6 pounds is available that will propel my electric bike 125 miles EV's will then revolutionize the world.
 
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