eBike for the Big Man?
- Thread starter Gigantor
- Start date
stevenast
Well-Known Member
Another obvious suggestion, if you get a chance to ride that bike in the right frame size just lock out the forks for your test ride, or at least part of it.
Wake is great -- and very helpful. He's fond of the Aventura which I will ride next when I get the chance.
I didn't really talk with him about the conversion route yet, but I will.
Oh - and yes, I don't want to buy a moped. I expect and want to pedal myself. In fact, in general, I'd rather the bike only have pedal assist and not a throttle, and fully expect that I'll need to put out effort.
Any preference out there for hill climbing between the mid-drive and the rear-hub?
JRA
Well-Known Member
Don't discount a throttle, especially with a hub motor as it is easier to tune your pedal pressure to motor assistance I find. The important thing is to have the gearing that will work together with the motor so that you can pedal with resistance throughout the motors range of power. That is why single speeds are not that prevalent in the e bike marketplace. The biggest benefit to a throttle is in taking off from a stop as it will launch you much better and make crossing busy intersections safer and starting from a standstill in general.
The best hill climber I have used here in OR was a 16" 1000w 48v direct drive hub motor mounted in a BOB trailer. With pedaling there was no hill that it would not launch over. 1000w is legal in OR btw but with a 20mph top speed. The setup I had topped out at 20 but it got there in a hurry! I was getting 40 miles out of a 12ah (9.5ah BMS cut off) with it also averaging close to 20mph when I was living in Astoria. Good times.
I like mid drive these days because it is more like riding a bike when not needing the power, yet under power it feels fluid also. The parasitic drag of a direct drive always bugged me. But in the end you are doing the right thing testing different models and that is the best way to decide what is going to work best for your needs.
The best hill climber I have used here in OR was a 16" 1000w 48v direct drive hub motor mounted in a BOB trailer. With pedaling there was no hill that it would not launch over. 1000w is legal in OR btw but with a 20mph top speed. The setup I had topped out at 20 but it got there in a hurry! I was getting 40 miles out of a 12ah (9.5ah BMS cut off) with it also averaging close to 20mph when I was living in Astoria. Good times.
I like mid drive these days because it is more like riding a bike when not needing the power, yet under power it feels fluid also. The parasitic drag of a direct drive always bugged me. But in the end you are doing the right thing testing different models and that is the best way to decide what is going to work best for your needs.
Mike Smith
Active Member
0.6gup
I agree with Brambor's opinion of the Bionx system and if you feel that you are mechanically capable a DIY project could be fun. Otherwise get an experienced dealer to install it for you for $150-250 from what I've found and you will have a shop to service and maintain the bike for you. Bionx is very reliable and offers good products and warranty from what I've tested and their dealers swear by them. Lots of options to consider. I have spent about 3 months doing research before I pulled the trigger, and it was driving my wife crazy....so it was worth the time, lol.
I agree with Brambor's opinion of the Bionx system and if you feel that you are mechanically capable a DIY project could be fun. Otherwise get an experienced dealer to install it for you for $150-250 from what I've found and you will have a shop to service and maintain the bike for you. Bionx is very reliable and offers good products and warranty from what I've tested and their dealers swear by them. Lots of options to consider. I have spent about 3 months doing research before I pulled the trigger, and it was driving my wife crazy....so it was worth the time, lol.
Mike Smith
Active Member
I will have my Diamondback Trace EXC next week and will give you an update on the ride power etc. Nice thing is that it's available at REI and a Performance Bike stores for local sales and support. Forget about the cargo bikes people are suggesting unless you like the style. I think
that they are fugly as heck unless your selling vegetables or something...and then still fugly. Sorry for my foul language.
that they are fugly as heck unless your selling vegetables or something...and then still fugly. Sorry for my foul language.
Shea N Encinitas
Active Member
Regarding the Diamondback Trace EXC, nice that it comes with hydraulic brakes & a 48 volt battery for $2,500. It is basically an Izip Dash with an important upgrade. Sorry to say that I don't think it will support our big friend as good as a Haibike which has a much stiffer frame and large headset bearing. If the largest frame (55 cm) does not fit you then you can probably swap out the stem to put a little more reach in the handlebars and perhaps get an extra long seatpost (BodyFloat of course if we are talking about the 29'r). While I don't regret my path to an ideal bike (Dash, then Haibike) I could have saved a lot of money by getting the correct bike first (which was not available at the time anyway). If the last hill home proves too steep (doubt it) you can also put a granny gear (large gear nearest the hub) on the rear cassette. You have not specified how far you plan on going but I'd estimate 18 miles in tour mode (27 at my average size), even with a few hills and the 20mph limit of the stock bike. -S
J.R.
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- Piedmont Highlands
@Shea N Encinitas your path wasn't that long to the correct bike for you! I thoroughly enjoyed all your posts from the bikes you tested. Anyone shopping should check out your post history for the reviews!
Shea N Encinitas
Active Member
Thanks J.R. - I don't think many people bother with searching forums, that is why I sometimes repeat myself, not something I do often in person. Funny backstory, my Pop expressed an interest in an e-bike conversion (recumbent) so I turned him onto this and a few other sites. Shortly afterwards, seeing my numerous post, he suggested I ask members what else to do with my free time! Kinda dickish right, so your validation is especially rewarding in that context. -S
Gigantor-
I am 6'5" and about 280 and know how you feel. I have been e bike commuting to work off and on for about 10 months. My commute is about 18 miles round trip. I live in the hills near Pasadena, CA and pass the Rose Bowl on my way to work. I say that to give you an idea of the topography on my commute. After some great input from Court and others on this board and my own research I bought a Pedego City Commuter with the 48w battery. It has worked great for me. It isn't flashy. It's big and solid. And like all e bikes, it's really fun to ride. It's been a great first e bike to get into this bike commuting world. I have no problem tackling some of the more challenging parts on my commute home.
I will admit I have my eye on one the Haibikes for my next one, but that will be in due time. Good luck.
Matthew Kreger
Member
I'm in the same boat and after being all over the place between expensive commercial bikes that weren't quite what I wanted and the daunting project of doing a one-off self build I decided to start big in specs and small in price and went with the Wave on Indiegogo. 48V 15Ah w/ 750W rear hub motor should do you pretty well for a start. You can get in for under $800 and then at least you'll have a frame of reference if you want something more/different later. It's got fenders, lights, bell and a rack. You may not need to spend another dime on your commuter if you're happy with it.
Yes, I like to think we are quite knowledgeable on high-performance ebike kits.
In fact, we sell what I consider to be the highest-power Fat Bike kit on the market, complete with a 60A Sine Wave Controller. We also sell these same motors in faster winding speeds laced in Aircraft-Grade Aluminum Moped Rims for the ultimate in High-performance road kits. Here is a video of our race bike (MXUS 3000W 3T Motor) at Pacific Raceways last April:
JRA
Well-Known Member
Getting across intersections and crossing roads using e launch extends my life. It is just easier to pin it and take off, as it narrows your window of opportunity substantially and you can start in a pretty high gear and get pedaling right away. Averaged out in battery wh it has little effect unless you stop and start constantly. But then you probably aren't going very far either?
I find the best way to extend battery life is to have the correct gearing to be able to set your cadence so that it is slightly on top of the motors output. With some of the better Pedelec systems available you can achieve this but cheap PAS stuff you can't. Throttles are cheaper yet but if you know how to operate one effectively you can get pretty low wh/mile readings. A cruise control button is useful out on the open road though so that your hand doesn't get tired!
I guess it depends on your bike's wheel size and power. On my A2B with 20 inch tires, acceleration was much better with a throttle than my Stromer with 26 inch tires and essentially the same motor and throttle, 500 watts 750w peak.. I found that pedal assist with the Stromer was the best way to start.
pxpaulx
Well-Known Member
yeah, with a larger tire there is just more rotational mass to get moving - regardless of the weight on the bike, getting a larger tire moving takes a lot more energy; this can even apply to car wheels, so on a bike with less than 1 horsepower it will have an exponential effect. Personally whether I were using throttle or PAS it just feels unnatural to be sitting on a bike without making that first pedaling downstroke!
oops! how much do u weigh? HAPPY VALLEY has a couple you may find difficult. i have given up before even getting started getting really serious... too confusing for a big, oldfart w special needs... no undrestanding olfart salesmen like in mcycle shops.. ebikes world still seems a yuppie deal .. many manufacturers, and so few contributors neglect to mention their on weight; critical.. ... About frame sizes= go figger. I am all over the sizing chart.. l plan to check out recumbents , esp by greenspeed- IGH Anura , and Magnum... good luck.. thx.. hank, 325lbs and droppimg, 6'3", 29 pants inseam, age 70 , arthritis in hand and wrist (too many nails).
Gigantor,
Did you decide on a bike?
I ordered this bike from Lectric Cycles at the end of December:
http://www.lectriccycles.com
I chose the 1000w motor with the 14a 48v battery. I'm a big guy too and I'm hoping the setup will be able to handle my 19 mile(one way) somewhat hilly commute. The bike won't be ready until February but I'll let you know how it turns out.
-Pete
Did you decide on a bike?
I ordered this bike from Lectric Cycles at the end of December:
http://www.lectriccycles.com
I chose the 1000w motor with the 14a 48v battery. I'm a big guy too and I'm hoping the setup will be able to handle my 19 mile(one way) somewhat hilly commute. The bike won't be ready until February but I'll let you know how it turns out.
-Pete
Hey all --
Gigantor here. I received a request for an update - rather than just send it to the conversation, I thought you all might like to hear what I found.
I went with the Radwagon built up in Seattle. 750 watt 48 volt power system, rear hub motor.
You can read below to see how I modified the bike and dealt with repairs that were tough, but the long and short is - in spite of the troubles, I love it. Having ridden over 700 miles this year in all weather, I can say that it makes commuting possible. I have ridden the route on my standard bike for comparison and can attest that the difference is marked -- about 30% faster overall, with a huge difference on hill climbing. I won't go back.
I'm going to talk below about issues, but the bottom line is, the difficulties are outweighed by the benefits.
So -- as I said, I went with the Radwagon. I really couldn't beat the price and figured (correctly) that if I needed more work done to bring the bike "up to spec," I would have the budget left to do so.
The first thing I had to replace was the brakes -- I found, rather too rapidly, that the front and rear disc brakes didn't have the stopping power to slow me down when bombing down the 16% grade from my house. After a couple scary trips, I had a beefier brake overhaul done (for about $500). You'll need to consult with your own mechanic about it as mine had to make some adjustments to the rear set-up to accommodate. But, the good news is -- I can now stop on a dime.
The second adjustment I've had to make is getting a much longer seatpost -- I needed to buy a 450 mm one. Much better, but, still not as tall as I'd like to be honest, but, it's not easy to find posts that are longer, and I worry about the physics involved with the seat post holder and saw a hairline crack in the frame develop, so I am staying with 450. (I "fixed" the crack by using a roll of FiberFix just to be sure. That stuff works great.)
The final adjustment -- and this is a problem I hope to have a handle on now, is the rear spokes. So far, I've broken 8. I've addressed this with Radwagon's tech support and, while responsive, they've stopped sending me replacements for free. After the first 3, I've had to purchase them (which I've done in bulk.)
I have spent a lot of time trying to diagnose the spoke issue and believe that it's caused by a combination of speed, weight and potholes on my route. At speed, that rear hub is really exerting, when I hit a bump or pothole, the tire "freezes" in place for an instant due, undoubtedly, to my bulk, while the hub keeps pushing forward. The spoke head is the weakest point and SNAP.
I've learned a lot from replacing them, and looking around for replacements (that are more beefy.) First, it is tough - really tough -- to find replacements that are the right length. Second, "regular" bike mechanics are not good at fixing this problem.
After getting really tired of having to wait up to a week for a local mechanic to fix a spoke, only to have another bust, I've since self-taught myself to replace the spokes, and true the rim ($10 spoke wrench and zipties -- look it up on Youtube. Seriously.)
I've gotten much faster, but it still takes an hour or two to do a good job. But it's been a learning experience.
After more research I've found that the key is to REALLY tighten the spokes on the rear hub. Once I learned that trick, I haven't broken a spoke. Regular mechanics just won't apply as much torque as needed for the rear hub. When I crank on it, they stay in place. No busted spokes in many rides (an unfortunate record.)
I''ll update again in another 700 miles If anyone has direct questions, feel free to start a conversation with me and I'll answer if I can.
- Gigantor
Gigantor here. I received a request for an update - rather than just send it to the conversation, I thought you all might like to hear what I found.
I went with the Radwagon built up in Seattle. 750 watt 48 volt power system, rear hub motor.
You can read below to see how I modified the bike and dealt with repairs that were tough, but the long and short is - in spite of the troubles, I love it. Having ridden over 700 miles this year in all weather, I can say that it makes commuting possible. I have ridden the route on my standard bike for comparison and can attest that the difference is marked -- about 30% faster overall, with a huge difference on hill climbing. I won't go back.
I'm going to talk below about issues, but the bottom line is, the difficulties are outweighed by the benefits.
So -- as I said, I went with the Radwagon. I really couldn't beat the price and figured (correctly) that if I needed more work done to bring the bike "up to spec," I would have the budget left to do so.
The first thing I had to replace was the brakes -- I found, rather too rapidly, that the front and rear disc brakes didn't have the stopping power to slow me down when bombing down the 16% grade from my house. After a couple scary trips, I had a beefier brake overhaul done (for about $500). You'll need to consult with your own mechanic about it as mine had to make some adjustments to the rear set-up to accommodate. But, the good news is -- I can now stop on a dime.
The second adjustment I've had to make is getting a much longer seatpost -- I needed to buy a 450 mm one. Much better, but, still not as tall as I'd like to be honest, but, it's not easy to find posts that are longer, and I worry about the physics involved with the seat post holder and saw a hairline crack in the frame develop, so I am staying with 450. (I "fixed" the crack by using a roll of FiberFix just to be sure. That stuff works great.)
The final adjustment -- and this is a problem I hope to have a handle on now, is the rear spokes. So far, I've broken 8. I've addressed this with Radwagon's tech support and, while responsive, they've stopped sending me replacements for free. After the first 3, I've had to purchase them (which I've done in bulk.)
I have spent a lot of time trying to diagnose the spoke issue and believe that it's caused by a combination of speed, weight and potholes on my route. At speed, that rear hub is really exerting, when I hit a bump or pothole, the tire "freezes" in place for an instant due, undoubtedly, to my bulk, while the hub keeps pushing forward. The spoke head is the weakest point and SNAP.
I've learned a lot from replacing them, and looking around for replacements (that are more beefy.) First, it is tough - really tough -- to find replacements that are the right length. Second, "regular" bike mechanics are not good at fixing this problem.
After getting really tired of having to wait up to a week for a local mechanic to fix a spoke, only to have another bust, I've since self-taught myself to replace the spokes, and true the rim ($10 spoke wrench and zipties -- look it up on Youtube. Seriously.)
I've gotten much faster, but it still takes an hour or two to do a good job. But it's been a learning experience.
After more research I've found that the key is to REALLY tighten the spokes on the rear hub. Once I learned that trick, I haven't broken a spoke. Regular mechanics just won't apply as much torque as needed for the rear hub. When I crank on it, they stay in place. No busted spokes in many rides (an unfortunate record.)
I''ll update again in another 700 miles
If anyone has direct questions, feel free to start a conversation with me and I'll answer if I can.- Gigantor
