Bafang Ultra "Smooth" tune by Mike at Frey

[ProphetZarquon]

This has nothing to do with your question, but-
Just a thought. I'm not REAL sure the CANBUS based programming used on 2021 and newer motor is going to look anything like the UART based stuff. They may have a whole new way of approaching things using "lessons learned" messing with the UART motors. I'm not saying that's going to happen or not, more along the lines of wishful thinking/best guess. It would sure be nice if we had the same control over what we're looking to do, while using a MUCH simpler/clearer format. More "dummy proof" if you will....

Unfortunately, we're stuck in "wait and see" mode. -Al

Agreed. It would be great if the new CANBus signalled controllers reached the same (or greater) level of programmability as the UART controllers.

People buying motors direct from Bafang have already reported getting these CANBus motors; while the Frey AM1000 we just received still has a UART programmable controller.

 

[Taylor57]

Agreed. It would be great if the new CANBus signalled controllers reached the same (or greater) level of programmability as the UART controllers.

People buying motors direct from Bafang have already reported getting these CANBus motors; while the Frey AM1000 we just received still has a UART programmable controller.

I'm guessing my 2021 Frey CC has a UART?

 

[ProphetZarquon]

I'm guessing my 2021 Frey CC has a UART?

Possibly? Does the display connect with a round connector near the handlebars, or is it a "house shaped" / "squarish D shaped" connector?
The UART controllers have been using round plugs; the CANBus controllers seem to all have squarish plugs.

 

[Taylor57]

Possibly? Does the display connect with a round connector near the handlebars, or is it a "house shaped" / "squarish D shaped" connector?
The UART controllers have been using round plugs; the CANBus controllers seem to all have squarish plugs.

Round

 

[AHicks]

Round

Round is UART. You're good to go with any progaming you'd like to try/change!

 

[Taylor57]

Round is UART. You're good to go with any progaming you'd like to try/change!

The only thing I want to change is make the throttle effective from a dead stop without having to pedal. I have the programming cable, just no laptop...

 

[ProphetZarquon]

The only thing I want to change is make the throttle effective from a dead stop without having to pedal. I have the programming cable, just no laptop...

!?! Hmmmm... The throttle? Works from dead stop on mine. There is no such setting in the Bafang Config Tool / Frey Config Tool.

If you mean pedal assist from dead stop, that won't happen either unless you trick the speed sensor: The pedals must go around before pedal assist will kick in.

I've heard others complain of no-throttle-from-0, & while it's clearly a misguided "safety" setting required by some regions, it may be in the controller firmware, inaccessible to these apps.

I asked about it when ordering the AM1000 with a throttle added: I specified that we needed throttle from 0 & that's what we received.

 

[AHicks]

!?! Hmmmm... The throttle? Works from dead stop on mine. There is no such setting in the Bafang Config Tool / Frey Config Tool.

If you mean pedal assist from dead stop, that won't happen either unless you trick the speed sensor: The pedals must go around before pedal assist will kick in.

I've heard others complain of no-throttle-from-0, & while it's clearly a misguided "safety" setting required by some regions, it may be in the controller firmware, inaccessible to these apps.

I asked about it when ordering the AM1000 with a throttle added: I specified that we needed throttle from 0 & that's what we received.

On the bold, however well intentioned, that turned out to be a mess. Some are OK with it, others not so much. I don't have it all in front of me, but I'd be surprised if this were not able to be changed. I KNOW the PAS sensor sensitivity can be changed to get the power to the motor with just a fraction of a turn of the crank, actually to the point false starts are an issue when the pedal is bumped, so you need to be careful what you wish for. As far as the throttle from 0, I don't know which setting specifically might do that. I would have to sit down and compare the existing program on the bike to something like the "smooth" settings to find the specific parameter.

WORST case, pretty sure Frey would be willing to send an entire .bin file that could be installed, allowing for throttle from stopped. As they are able to supply bikes either way, this would pretty much HAVE to be within their ability to program - which is done just like you or I would do it.....

 

[Taylor57]

On the bold, however well intentioned, that turned out to be a mess. Some are OK with it, others not so much. I don't have it all in front of me, but I'd be surprised if this were not able to be changed. I KNOW the PAS sensor sensitivity can be changed to get the power to the motor with just a fraction of a turn of the crank, actually to the point false starts are an issue when the pedal is bumped, so you need to be careful what you wish for. As far as the throttle from 0, I don't know which setting specifically might do that. I would have to sit down and compare the existing program on the bike to something like the "smooth" settings to find the specific parameter.

WORST case, pretty sure Frey would be willing to send an entire .bin file that could be installed, allowing for throttle from stopped. As they are able to supply bikes either way, this would pretty much HAVE to be within their ability to program - which is done just like you or I would do it.....

When I ordered my CC, I specifically requested that I wanted throttle from a dead stop. My rep acknowledged that and away we went. Now I have a bike that weights a 1000 pounds with a throttle that only works after I turn the pedals. For me, having the throttle at start up on a bike this heavy is a safety feature and is the main reason right now why CC is parked in my guest room and my ESPIN Sport gets the reps...

 

[AHicks]

When I ordered my CC, I specifically requested that I wanted throttle from a dead stop. My rep acknowledged that and away we went. Now I have a bike that weights a 1000 pounds with a throttle that only works after I turn the pedals. For me, having the throttle at start up on a bike this heavy is a safety feature and is the main reason right now why CC is parked in my guest room and my ESPIN Sport gets the reps...

You have discussed this with Frey? What are they suggesting?

 

[Taylor57]

You have discussed this with Frey? What are they suggesting?

I have not. I probably should send them an email. Good idea

 

[tinasdude]

I requested throttle from 0 as well and it was agreed upon. I did not receive it. I am older and not very computer Savy. Doubt i could upgrade the controller even with instructions. i will be getting the Watt Wagon controller. I really need the throttle from zero to get me moving, particularly on hills.

 

[JRA]

I requested throttle from 0 as well and it was agreed upon. I did not receive it. I am older and not very computer Savy. Doubt i could upgrade the controller even with instructions. i will be getting the Watt Wagon controller. I really need the throttle from zero to get me moving, particularly on hills.

If you think the Watt Wagons controller will be any less harder to configure you might be surprised as I understand it? Pretty much the reason for their and other hot rod controllers is to multiply overall power and while they do have programming parameters the same can be said for the UART stock controller on the M620.

Jon A was nice enough to share his recipe for success based on the Frey config and it is posted on here and a member used it and said it worked great. However if you are not computer savvy, or self prophesed to not be, or like me IOS only with no access to a Windows computer you can find yourself SOOL to make ANY changes other than what is available through the display.

There has to be a simple way to make the throttle to react from 0, as well as dial in the amount it will provide which is important, with the cable. Mine came too sensitive actually from 0 and you have to be careful or it will buck and I want to tame it some, as it is I wouldn't allow anyone a test ride for fear of their safety.

One of the main reasons I have an M620 is it is one of the very few integrated mid motors, the other is the M500/600, available that has a torque PAS and a throttle that can act independently of each other and has programmable ability to tune them to each riders needs. As long as you have a Windows computer and a cable.

At least I have the cable.....and may have a line on a Windows laptop that won't show up until the 27th via a friend who is also a Mac person but happens to have one.

In the meantime I am still riding the bike as is and enjoying getting to ride in general on a new type bike with FS that really does the job smoothing out the logging road gravel and adding confidence in the rough roots we have here on our single track trails. Traction is way better than anything I have had in the past also. And well, the power on tap.........more than I need for sure. But still gets the legs burning if that is your jam, you just are going much faster than normal and in the spirit of the season "Laughing All The Way".

 

[TomD]

If you think the Watt Wagons controller will be any less harder to configure you might be surprised as I understand it? Pretty much the reason for their and other hot rod controllers is to multiply overall power and while they do have programming parameters the same can be said for the UART stock controller on the M620.

The reason I went with the Watt Wagons (innotrace) controller was for the other benefits - efficiency and smoothness some of which are a result of controller design that can't necessarily be achieved with the stock controller. I think the issue for tinasdude might be whether they can actually upgrade / program (may have CANBUS motor). Also, if programming is a challenge, not sure pulling out the motor to upgrade would be any less of a challenge.

 

[AHicks]

I requested throttle from 0 as well and it was agreed upon. I did not receive it. I am older and not very computer Savy. Doubt i could upgrade the controller even with instructions. i will be getting the Watt Wagon controller. I really need the throttle from zero to get me moving, particularly on hills.

Maybe if you let your location be known, somebody nearby could be a real hero and lend you a hand?

Before that though, maybe a question. Has anyone successfully enabled the "start from 0" on an M620 that was received disabled? Not sure I've read about anyone doing this - yet. I'm 99% sure it can be done, but would feel much better if somebody (or sombodies) reported they had done it successfully. -Al

 

[AHicks]

Jon A was nice enough to share his recipe for success based on the Frey config and it is posted on here and a member used it and said it worked great. However if you are not computer savvy, or self prophesed to not be, or like me IOS only with no access to a Windows computer you can find yourself SOOL to make ANY changes other than what is available through the display.

Actually there are several that have tried it now (myself included), and happy to report most are really happy with it. It really wakes the bike up when it comes to low speed control. One fellow did report he was not happy with it, but unfortunately I don't remember the specifics regarding what he wasn't happy with. -Al

 

[tinasdude]

Maybe if you let your location be known, somebody nearby could be a real hero and lend you a hand?

Before that though, maybe a question. Has anyone successfully enabled the "start from 0" on an M620 that was received disabled? Not sure I've read about anyone doing this - yet. I'm 99% sure it can be done, but would feel much better if somebody (or sombodies) reported they had done it successfully. -Al

Another Frey owner has changed throttle from Zero. Involved getting a file from Frey for the process. Mine is UART and can be done, but pia to do. Beyond me. I even have the cable from Frey to do it. They sent it because they knew I wanted throttle from 0. Watt Wagon for the win

 

[AHicks]

Another Frey owner has changed throttle from Zero. Involved getting a file from Frey for the process. Mine is UART and can be done, but pia to do. Beyond me. I even have the cable from Frey to do it. They sent it because they knew I wanted throttle from 0. Watt Wagon for the win

So the question remains where do you live? Maybe we can arrange to have somebody to take care of this for you?

 

[JRA]

Actually there are several that have tried it now (myself included), and happy to report most are really happy with it. It really wakes the bike up when it comes to low speed control. One fellow did report he was not happy with it, but unfortunately I don't remember the specifics regarding what he wasn't happy with. -Al

It sounds like a better starting point than what's on mine now so that is a good thing. My low speed control is out of at the moment. And it is a feature that I often require on the trails I ride.

I wouldn't call the way it is now safe for beginner use and in that regard WTF is Luna doing sending them out that rough? I thought they had some "special sauce" or the like?

Going to look into at least putting a cut-out on the rear brake lever to keep runout under control but hoping that can go away after flashing. There is a way to do it it is just getting it done....https://ebikes.ca/shop/electric-bicycle-parts/ebrakes/tripwire-pull-3pinhigo.html probably still not a bad idea in general....

 

[TomD]

Another Frey owner has changed throttle from Zero. Involved getting a file from Frey for the process. Mine is UART and can be done, but pia to do. Beyond me. I even have the cable from Frey to do it. They sent it because they knew I wanted throttle from 0. Watt Wagon for the win

It really isn't that hard to program a UART motor. Way easier than pulling out your motor and sending it to Watt Wagons and reinstalling your motor. Trust me, I've done it twice, don't look forward to doing it again, lol. The win is you get a better controller, but not sure throttle jockeys benefit as much.

If you're afraid of PCs you could try this app instead, assuming you have an android phone. Just need a USB to OTG adapter which you can find cheap on amazon if you don't have one. While it isn't fully compatible with the ultra yet (doesn't have the torque sensing screens), it should allow you to program throttle from standstill.