2023 Trek Domane+

Hello guys, thanks for this complete overview of the new Trek Domane+ SLR 6. For a few years I have used an Orbea Gain D50 ebike (almost 9000KM) and despite being a first generation technology I must say that the satisfactions I have had have paid the cost of that eBike. I have decided to make a leap to third generation technologies and from what is offered as new for 2023 the Domane+ SLR family attracts my attention.
I am used to the characteristics of my Orbea Gain:
-15Kg total weight
-Motor in the rear hub
-Considerable drag when there is no assistance
-Unnatural sensation when the assistance operates
-Assistance control algorithm based on cadence sensor
-Repair complication in case of flat rear tire
.. others more.
I would like to know if anyone on this forum who now rides a 2023 Domane+ SLR and has ridden a first generation ebike can make an objective comparison with proven results.
 
Creo owner who finally got to ride a Trek Domane +. My take:

It felt like a road bike!. The bike itself felt much more balanced, not as bottom heavy and more nimble. The lack of motor noise also helped. The only time I really heard it was on quiet climbing and it was barely perceptible. I’m not sure somebody climbing along with me would detect it. What I noticed most is accelerating out of a stop on a slight incline. This was always a challenge on the Creo, and I would regularly have problems cranking before clipping in my other foot, which I could get around with by boosting the power. Not necessary on the Domane.
Power button controls – in terms of hardware, not much to distinguish it from the Creo. What was lacking is a powered on non-assist setting to cycle through. I frequently ride with motor off but still have ebike metrics, power, etc displayed on my Garmin. The only way to get Zero Assist is to reach down and power off. So if you like to know rider power, the only way to obtain it is by keeping the motor on. And this indirectly adds to battery consumption, as I'm less likely to ride with 0 assist when none is actually needed.
Speaking of power however, the power calculation algorithm is totally worthless. I was never able to push this past 200W.
As an example I rode to the Trek store on my Creo at Eco (15/30), went up a small climb in 1:41 @ 269W. Did the same climb on the Domane at an assist level of 25% with peak limit of 72W in 1:48 @ 145W….effort felt very similar.
Advantage Q factor. I didn’t feel as if I was riding a horse. I don’t have knee pain but regularly have problems clipping in on the Creo due to wider pedal placement. The wider Q on the Creo feels awkward and pedal stroke feels inefficient.
2X drivetrain. The Domane was equipped with a 105 di2 setup. Great setup and much more economical entry point for electronic shifting. The only thing missing that Ultegra provides are the di2 buttons which allow you to cycle through pages on Garmin Edge. However, shifting was so much smoother, lacking the jolt associated with large jumps in cog size.
Battery life which is the elephant in the room. I have my Creo set at Eco (15/30) and Sport (30/50) which provides me with 250 miles and 75 miles of range respectively. I have never been on a ride where I was battery challenged on the Creo. I started the Domane at Eco and did some calculations, noting a drop of 1% every 0.7 miles or so. It felt as if this level of assist was slightly more than the Creo. Towards the end of the ride, I decided to download the Trek app, paired the bike and reset the assist levels. The software does not allow you to set the assist level below 25%, but I was able to set peak power to 72W which is identical to my Creo in Eco mode. That is the assist level that I did the timed climb in noted above so not that far off. I did not ride long enough to get an accurate feel of battery consumption at this setting, but the Trek app estimated about 140 miles of range with these settings, certainly less than the Creo’s 250 miles.
MY TAKE
Domane + Advantages:

ROAD BIKE FEEL – I know its just 3-5 lbs lighter than the Creo, but weight reduction felt greater
QUIET MOTOR
2X Drivetrain
Narrower Q
Conventional hub sizing simplifies wheel replacement and upgrading

Disadvantages

Power buttons do not allow you to cycle through OFF while keeping motor on. Seems like a not too difficult firmware fix. This would also help battery life for those that frequently ride without assist.
If you expect reliable power numbers from the Domane, get another piece of hardware.

Unknowns
Battery life – on the surface, doesn’t seem as good as the Creo although my initial settings were not comparable. I should probably take it out again with peak Eco power set to 72W as with the Creo. Looking for feedback from other dual users.
TQ motor reliability?
I’m going to hang onto my Creo until I get some answers to the Unknowns.
 
Hi Antonio, Welcome to the thread! :)

I ride a Specialized Creo SL, but have a project one Domane+ SLR 9 in the wings - I hope to have it in my hands in a few weeks, so stay tuned! I'll certainly post here when I get some time on it.

I haven't ridden the Gain, but I have ridden other hub motor ebikes, and a mid-drive is a very different animal than having that motor in the wheel.

Speaking from my many miles on the Creo, the biggest difference is that power flows through the gears with your effort. One has to learn to use a lower gear and get accustomed to a spin that the motor likes (roughly 90 rpm) to get the most out of it. I will say it has made me a MUCH stronger cyclist, despite doing a fair bit of the work for me.

Stay tuned! :)
 
A quick heads up to Jlubeck (and others):
The TQ system does include a null/off state with the display active but no motor assist. Whereas a simple press of the left handlebar button drops High to Medium and Medium to Eco, the deactivation of the motor from Eco requires that the button be held down for 4-5 seconds. In my experience battery consumption in the null state is negligible.
The handlebar buttons do not turn the entire system on and off. That is done by the top bar button at the base of the display, and need only be done at the start and end of a ride.
 
rdv said:
A quick heads up to Jlubeck (and others):
The TQ system does include a null/off state with the display active but no motor assist. Whereas a simple press of the left handlebar button drops High to Medium and Medium to Eco, the deactivation of the motor from Eco requires that the button be held down for 4-5 seconds. In my experience battery consumption in the null state is negligible.
The handlebar buttons do not turn the entire system on and off. That is done by the top bar button at the base of the display, and need only be done at the start and end of a ride.
Click to expand...
Thanks….this was the first Domane + received at the Trek store and they were not familiar with the operation, motor tuning, etc.
 
rdv said:
A quick heads up to Jlubeck (and others):
The TQ system does include a null/off state with the display active but no motor assist. Whereas a simple press of the left handlebar button drops High to Medium and Medium to Eco, the deactivation of the motor from Eco requires that the button be held down for 4-5 seconds. In my experience battery consumption in the null state is negligible.
The handlebar buttons do not turn the entire system on and off. That is done by the top bar button at the base of the display, and need only be done at the start and end of a ride.
Click to expand...
Valuable comment! Does this mean that we can continue to see the personal power record while the engine is off?
 
jlubeck said:
Creo owner who finally got to ride a Trek Domane +. My take:

It felt like a road bike!. The bike itself felt much more balanced, not as bottom heavy and more nimble. The lack of motor noise also helped. The only time I really heard it was on quiet climbing and it was barely perceptible. I’m not sure somebody climbing along with me would detect it. What I noticed most is accelerating out of a stop on a slight incline. This was always a challenge on the Creo, and I would regularly have problems cranking before clipping in my other foot, which I could get around with by boosting the power. Not necessary on the Domane.
Power button controls – in terms of hardware, not much to distinguish it from the Creo. What was lacking is a powered on non-assist setting to cycle through. I frequently ride with motor off but still have ebike metrics, power, etc displayed on my Garmin. The only way to get Zero Assist is to reach down and power off. So if you like to know rider power, the only way to obtain it is by keeping the motor on. And this indirectly adds to battery consumption, as I'm less likely to ride with 0 assist when none is actually needed.
Speaking of power however, the power calculation algorithm is totally worthless. I was never able to push this past 200W.
As an example I rode to the Trek store on my Creo at Eco (15/30), went up a small climb in 1:41 @ 269W. Did the same climb on the Domane at an assist level of 25% with peak limit of 72W in 1:48 @ 145W….effort felt very similar.
Advantage Q factor. I didn’t feel as if I was riding a horse. I don’t have knee pain but regularly have problems clipping in on the Creo due to wider pedal placement. The wider Q on the Creo feels awkward and pedal stroke feels inefficient.
2X drivetrain. The Domane was equipped with a 105 di2 setup. Great setup and much more economical entry point for electronic shifting. The only thing missing that Ultegra provides are the di2 buttons which allow you to cycle through pages on Garmin Edge. However, shifting was so much smoother, lacking the jolt associated with large jumps in cog size.
Battery life which is the elephant in the room. I have my Creo set at Eco (15/30) and Sport (30/50) which provides me with 250 miles and 75 miles of range respectively. I have never been on a ride where I was battery challenged on the Creo. I started the Domane at Eco and did some calculations, noting a drop of 1% every 0.7 miles or so. It felt as if this level of assist was slightly more than the Creo. Towards the end of the ride, I decided to download the Trek app, paired the bike and reset the assist levels. The software does not allow you to set the assist level below 25%, but I was able to set peak power to 72W which is identical to my Creo in Eco mode. That is the assist level that I did the timed climb in noted above so not that far off. I did not ride long enough to get an accurate feel of battery consumption at this setting, but the Trek app estimated about 140 miles of range with these settings, certainly less than the Creo’s 250 miles.
MY TAKE
Domane + Advantages:

ROAD BIKE FEEL – I know its just 3-5 lbs lighter than the Creo, but weight reduction felt greater
QUIET MOTOR
2X Drivetrain
Narrower Q
Conventional hub sizing simplifies wheel replacement and upgrading

Disadvantages

Power buttons do not allow you to cycle through OFF while keeping motor on. Seems like a not too difficult firmware fix. This would also help battery life for those that frequently ride without assist.
If you expect reliable power numbers from the Domane, get another piece of hardware.

Unknowns
Battery life – on the surface, doesn’t seem as good as the Creo although my initial settings were not comparable. I should probably take it out again with peak Eco power set to 72W as with the Creo. Looking for feedback from other dual users.
TQ motor reliability?
I’m going to hang onto my Creo until I get some answers to the Unknowns.
Click to expand...
Very interesting comments. A lot to test and learn from this new ecosystem.
 
AntonioAlfaro said:
Valuable comment! Does this mean that we can continue to see the personal power record while the engine is off?
Click to expand...
Yes, the display reports the rider power input and the motor's, showing "0" when not assisting. They don't seem averaged and tend to vary quickly. I cannot vouch for their accuracy [other than at zero :) ]
 
rdv said:
Yes, the display reports the rider power input and the motor's, showing "0" when not assisting. They don't seem averaged and tend to vary quickly. I cannot vouch for their accuracy [other than at zero :) ]
Click to expand...
See my comments above re:power. Way off. I have been riding with power meters for the past 10 years and this one is not even close. I rely extensively on the Creo power readings to track my effort….the numbers feel a little inflated but at least they’re consistent. Perhaps there was something amiss with the factory calibration on the unit I rode. If not, I’d need a set of Rally pedals for accurate measurement.
 
jlubeck said:
See my comments above re:power. Way off. I have been riding with power meters for the past 10 years and this one is not even close. I rely extensively on the Creo power readings to track my effort….the numbers feel a little inflated but at least they’re consistent. Perhaps there was something amiss with the factory calibration on the unit I rode. If not, I’d need a set of Rally pedals for accurate measurement.
Click to expand...

that's a huge bummer! definitely would need power pedals.
 
jlubeck said:
See my comments above re:power. Way off. I have been riding with power meters for the past 10 years and this one is not even close. I rely extensively on the Creo power readings to track my effort….the numbers feel a little inflated but at least they’re consistent. Perhaps there was something amiss with the factory calibration on the unit I rode. If not, I’d need a set of Rally pedals for accurate measurement.
Click to expand...
This could be a question for the TQ or TREK support center. It would not make sense that such advanced TQ technology relies on inaccurate power measurements.
 
JLubeck thanks for taking the time to share detailed impressions of the bike. I too, am a Creo owner and have been eyeing the Doman+

After reading your comments I'm thinking I'll hold onto the Creo for a while and not make the jump until I hear more owner experiences.

I find I ride my Aethos more these days anyway.
 
Every new paradigm raises reasonable doubts, but it doesn't mean it's bad.
We have to encourage all those who already drive a 2023 Domane+ SLR6 to share their experiences, doubts, lessons learned. We all want to learn.
 
jlubeck said:
See my comments above re:power. Way off. I have been riding with power meters for the past 10 years and this one is not even close. I rely extensively on the Creo power readings to track my effort….the numbers feel a little inflated but at least they’re consistent. Perhaps there was something amiss with the factory calibration on the unit I rode. If not, I’d need a set of Rally pedals for accurate measurement.
Click to expand...
I agree with your analysis of the deficiencies in the power meter readings, off by 25-40% especially bad in the less than 200 watt range, seems to improve slightly with higher power. I have seen the same comments under the Trek Fuel EXe forums where riders have used pedal PM’s to compare. My LBS has contacted TQ in USA as well asTrek but have yet to receive a reply. Hoping for a software fix soon.
 
EdBell said:
I agree with your analysis of the deficiencies in the power meter readings, off by 25-40% especially bad in the less than 200 watt range, seems to improve slightly with higher power. I have seen the same comments under the Trek Fuel EXe forums where riders have used pedal PM’s to compare. My LBS has contacted TQ in USA as well asTrek but have yet to receive a reply. Hoping for a software fix soon.
Click to expand...
It would be reassuring to know they've acknowledged it and are working on a fix. A $500 - $1K addon is something I'd like to avoid at an $8500 purchase point.
 
jlubeck said:
It would be reassuring to know they've acknowledged it and are working on a fix. A $500 - $1K addon is something I'd like to avoid at an $8500 purchase point.
Click to expand...
I have just sent an email to the TQ HPR50 support center inviting them to look at this forum and make the corresponding comments. I hope we have an answer.
 
Here's my experience with the Domane+ SLR 6. I got the Domane+ because Angina limits my medicated heart rate to 100 bpm, which corresponds to a sustained output to ~100 Watts. I can push to ~150W for up to a minute but have to stop to recover beyond that. That colors my experience.

Pedal response was deceptive. Initially I chose 'fast' for all three assist levels... who wouldn't want a good initial burst? But support dropped off just as fast if I relented on the pedals for a moment, and losing assistance on a 10% climb even briefly is quite unpleasant. So now my Pedal Response is set midway in Eco, and Gradual in Mid and High, making for much smoother transitions.

Battery (no expander) consumption has not been an issue thus far, though the rides have been admittedly flat: 75 miles (45 assisted), 2600' climbing showed 25% remaining at end; 57 miles (39 assisted), 1500', 40% remaining; similar 57 miles (26 assisted), 1600', 65% remaining. On two punchier rides: 25 mile (23 assisted), 1750', 55% remaining; 30 miles (all 30 assisted), 1850', 40% remaining. I find the battery percentage to be a fairly reliable guide but got rid the fluctuating 'miles remaining' metric as practically useless.

I'm still playing around with the assist levels. My limited sustainable 100W of input constrains overall usefulness. I can't tap into the motor's maximum 300W of assistance because 200% max x 100W input = 200W assist. 150W of input is needed to get the full benefit on a steady 10+ climb, and I can't keep that up for more than a minute. My latest setting is Eco 100W / 100%, Mid 200W /200%, High 300W / 200% (to take advantage of the few 150W bursts I can produce on short steep climbs). The best fix for me would be a software tweak to allow 300% of assist, to tap into all of the motor's 300W of output at 100W. I've reached out to Trek and TQ on that... not holding my breath.

To summarize my overall experience with the Domane+ so far: it lets me do things I could do on my own 5+ years ago, with a bit less sense of accomplishment, but with more gusto. Having the most fun in Eco mode, with pedals spinning almost effortlessly, as with a good tailwind on gentle inclines and into headwinds.
 
rdv said:
Here's my experience with the Domane+ SLR 6. I got the Domane+ because Angina limits my medicated heart rate to 100 bpm, which corresponds to a sustained output to ~100 Watts. I can push to ~150W for up to a minute but have to stop to recover beyond that. That colors my experience.

Pedal response was deceptive. Initially I chose 'fast' for all three assist levels... who wouldn't want a good initial burst? But support dropped off just as fast if I relented on the pedals for a moment, and losing assistance on a 10% climb even briefly is quite unpleasant. So now my Pedal Response is set midway in Eco, and Gradual in Mid and High, making for much smoother transitions.

Battery (no expander) consumption has not been an issue thus far, though the rides have been admittedly flat: 75 miles (45 assisted), 2600' climbing showed 25% remaining at end; 57 miles (39 assisted), 1500', 40% remaining; similar 57 miles (26 assisted), 1600', 65% remaining. On two punchier rides: 25 mile (23 assisted), 1750', 55% remaining; 30 miles (all 30 assisted), 1850', 40% remaining. I find the battery percentage to be a fairly reliable guide but got rid the fluctuating 'miles remaining' metric as practically useless.

I'm still playing around with the assist levels. My limited sustainable 100W of input constrains overall usefulness. I can't tap into the motor's maximum 300W of assistance because 200% max x 100W input = 200W assist. 150W of input is needed to get the full benefit on a steady 10+ climb, and I can't keep that up for more than a minute. My latest setting is Eco 100W / 100%, Mid 200W /200%, High 300W / 200% (to take advantage of the few 150W bursts I can produce on short steep climbs). The best fix for me would be a software tweak to allow 300% of assist, to tap into all of the motor's 300W of output at 100W. I've reached out to Trek and TQ on that... not holding my breath.

To summarize my overall experience with the Domane+ so far: it lets me do things I could do on my own 5+ years ago, with a bit less sense of accomplishment, but with more gusto. Having the most fun in Eco mode, with pedals spinning almost effortlessly, as with a good tailwind on gentle inclines and into headwinds.
Click to expand...
Hello rdv,
Thank you for your contributions to this forum. Being TQ and Doname+ SLR a very new ecosystem, all the experiences that are shared will undoubtedly help us to use it in the optimal way, enjoying our tours to the fullest.
As I have commented in the past, I have quite a bit of experience with my Mahle X35+ ecosystem based Ordea Gain D50 eBike, but now I am waiting (hopefully no more than 2 months) for my TQ equipped Domane+ SLR6. I must admit that the way to adjust the assistance levels in TQ is not familiar to me at all. I don't understand what is the methodology to do it. What does that 200% that you mention mean?
Is there any video or explanatory document about this?
Greetings
Antony
 
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