We vote them out assuming they don't pass enough laws to keep us from voting or nullifying any voting results they don't like.
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Art Deco
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Yep, the vote still works . And boycotts. And some churches, And all the letter writing, donations, petitions, and back room work that goes with a free society. But it was close.
Art Deco
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post number 387 on page 20 ?by @Alvin1957 above covers religion, edit can't link
politics and religion are not welcome on EBR, even off topic. So ways to adapt to the "new normal weather", anyone?
politics and religion are not welcome on EBR, even off topic. So ways to adapt to the "new normal weather", anyone?
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Catalyzt
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Yes-- straight up disinformation should be reported and removed. Always, every time. As should threats. And if you are threatened or provoked, don't engage or threaten back. Believe me, I know how hard it is. I've taken the bait many times, as many of you know!
Probably, no one is listening-- it doesn't seem likely that people are reading this particular thread and thinking, "Hmm, I don't know, that guy has got a brilliant interpretation of scripture, he cites and selects really compelling evidence, and he's a really clear, linear thinker who argues his points credibly, I think I'll go with that."
But it is possible. Occasionally, folks will latch onto one particular idea and won't be able to get it out of our head, and it could happen.
What's more, just today, the surgeon general called on all Americans, but website moderators in particular, to step up and stop disinformation. Some great points here.
Again, what really helped me was first, when I saw the data from the study in Israel in May demonstrating the safety and efficacy of the vaccine for people with autoimmune disorders, but also that my friends, doctors, and colleagues did not shame me for waiting until the results were in. I'm part of a population that was excluded from the original clinical trials.
The U.S. Surgeon General Is Calling COVID-19 Misinformation An 'Urgent Threat'
The nation's top doctor, Vivek Murthy, says misinformation will keep sowing mistrust and endangering lives unless all Americans do their part to fight it.
www.npr.org
Day six since mRNA vaccine #2, and no significant side effects, no symptoms worse than the usual ones I get most days, except maybe on days two, three, and four.
My second was just a day of low energy followed by a night of sweating then fine the morning after. Much better than the guy,much younger than me,that I read about the other day who was lamenting about not getting vaccinated. He was recovering from a double lung transplant.Yes-- straight up disinformation should be reported and removed. Always, every time. As should threats. And if you are threatened or provoked, don't engage or threaten back. Believe me, I know how hard it is. I've taken the bait many times, as many of you know!
Probably, no one is listening-- it doesn't seem likely that people are reading this particular thread and thinking, "Hmm, I don't know, that guy has got a brilliant interpretation of scripture, he cites and selects really compelling evidence, and he's a really clear, linear thinker who argues his points credibly, I think I'll go with that."
But it is possible. Occasionally, folks will latch onto one particular idea and won't be able to get it out of our head, and it could happen.
What's more, just today, the surgeon general called on all Americans, but website moderators in particular, to step up and stop disinformation. Some great points here.
Again, what really helped me was first, when I saw the data from the study in Israel in May demonstrating the safety and efficacy of the vaccine for people with autoimmune disorders, but also that my friends, doctors, and colleagues did not shame me for waiting until the results were in. I'm part of a population that was excluded from the original clinical trials.
The U.S. Surgeon General Is Calling COVID-19 Misinformation An 'Urgent Threat'
The nation's top doctor, Vivek Murthy, says misinformation will keep sowing mistrust and endangering lives unless all Americans do their part to fight it.
Day six since mRNA vaccine #2, and no significant side effects, no symptoms worse than the usual ones I get most days, except maybe on days two, three, and four.
Art Deco
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Looked it up ... that was @ChezCheese:) . probably thought of you b/c you are both female. Sorry, It's a great word, anyway.Wish I could claim that, but it wasn't me.
Art Deco
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Really sore arm from the 2ed dose. Lasted about a week, less than a strained muscle. But then i am generally healthy.Yes-- straight up disinformation should be reported and removed. Always, every time. As should threats. And if you are threatened or provoked, don't engage or threaten back. Believe me, I know how hard it is. I've taken the bait many times, as many of you know!
Probably, no one is listening-- it doesn't seem likely that people are reading this particular thread and thinking, "Hmm, I don't know, that guy has got a brilliant interpretation of scripture, he cites and selects really compelling evidence, and he's a really clear, linear thinker who argues his points credibly, I think I'll go with that."
But it is possible. Occasionally, folks will latch onto one particular idea and won't be able to get it out of our head, and it could happen.
What's more, just today, the surgeon general called on all Americans, but website moderators in particular, to step up and stop disinformation. Some great points here.
Again, what really helped me was first, when I saw the data from the study in Israel in May demonstrating the safety and efficacy of the vaccine for people with autoimmune disorders, but also that my friends, doctors, and colleagues did not shame me for waiting until the results were in. I'm part of a population that was excluded from the original clinical trials.
The U.S. Surgeon General Is Calling COVID-19 Misinformation An 'Urgent Threat'
The nation's top doctor, Vivek Murthy, says misinformation will keep sowing mistrust and endangering lives unless all Americans do their part to fight it.
Day six since mRNA vaccine #2, and no significant side effects, no symptoms worse than the usual ones I get most days, except maybe on days two, three, and four.
Catalyzt
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What I was worried about were symptoms I've had previously from my medical condition-- inflammation of the lining of my heart, two massive blood clots-- that can, in some rare cases, be caused by the vaccine.
I was also worried about fast heartbeat, which I'd experienced with the Shingles vaccine-- that lasted 18 months, and really pissed me off, ruined a vacation.
Yes, I had the sore arm too, could still feel it today a little bit swimming half a mile in the pool, but it's mostly gone.
PedalUma
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I had Covid twice. About 10-days after the second shot I again had some of the weird symptoms such as clotting issues and inexplicable bloody noses. But that just shows that my immune system was activated. Or in this situation perhaps over activated. Nothing that clocking up some epic rides can't solve.
Articles of faith are important to 'True Believers.' The the more outrageous the Articles are the better for creating a sense of belonging for the in group and in differentiating from 'Un-believers. Random examples: 1) Go to a Hindu temple and ask about cosmology. You will get a Hindu cosmological answer. If you take the time to look this up it is pretty interesting. 2) Go to a Catholic church and ask if wine is transformed into blood and bread into flesh. You will get a Catholic answer. The word Hocus-pocus comes from "Hoc est corpus," Latin for This is the body. It is like this with all groups of True Believers around the world and throughout time. There cannot be a comforting Us without an alien Them. Dictators know this and exploit it. The Orwellian world was perpetually at war. To be part of the group you had to believe outrageous things. Non-believers were punished. Even team sports fanatics get a sense of belonging from a 'them.' Being 'persecuted' for outrageous thinking reinforces the belief and sense of belonging.
A bullshitter is someone who can convince someone else that they can determine the gender of bovine excrement, cow verses bull. They are not Believers they are Tricksters. And not nearly as dangerous as believers.
Articles of faith are important to 'True Believers.' The the more outrageous the Articles are the better for creating a sense of belonging for the in group and in differentiating from 'Un-believers. Random examples: 1) Go to a Hindu temple and ask about cosmology. You will get a Hindu cosmological answer. If you take the time to look this up it is pretty interesting. 2) Go to a Catholic church and ask if wine is transformed into blood and bread into flesh. You will get a Catholic answer. The word Hocus-pocus comes from "Hoc est corpus," Latin for This is the body. It is like this with all groups of True Believers around the world and throughout time. There cannot be a comforting Us without an alien Them. Dictators know this and exploit it. The Orwellian world was perpetually at war. To be part of the group you had to believe outrageous things. Non-believers were punished. Even team sports fanatics get a sense of belonging from a 'them.' Being 'persecuted' for outrageous thinking reinforces the belief and sense of belonging.
A bullshitter is someone who can convince someone else that they can determine the gender of bovine excrement, cow verses bull. They are not Believers they are Tricksters. And not nearly as dangerous as believers.
Mr. Coffee
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So now that credible data is in, is it okay to shame people who claim the vaccines make them infertile? Asking for a friend.
Mulezen
Well-Known Member
As you might have already heard this from me, I apologize. The very short book by the longshoreman philosopher, even just the first chapter will startle you with the attributes of the mobocracy led by Trump.
The True Believer
The True Believer: Thoughts on the Nature of Mass Movements is a non-fiction book authored by American philosopher Eric Hoffer. Published in 1951, it depicts a variety of arguments in terms of applied world history and social psychology to explain why mass movements arise to challenge the status quo. Hoffer discusses the sense of individual identity and the holding to particular ideals that can lead to fanaticism among both leaders and followers.[1]
Hoffer initially attempts to explain the motives of the various types of personalities that give rise to mass movements in the first place and why certain efforts succeed while many others fail. He goes on to articulate a cyclical view of history such that why and how said movements start, progress and end is explored. Whether intended to be cultural, ideological, religious, or whatever else, Hoffer argues that mass movements are broadly interchangeable even when their stated goals or values differ dramatically. This makes sense, in the author's view, given the frequent similarities between them in terms of the psychological influences on its adherents. Thus, many will often flip from one movement to another, Hoffer asserts, and the often shared motivations for participation entail practical effects. Since, whether radical or reactionary, the movements tend to attract the same sort of people in his view, the author describes them as fundamentally using the same tactics including possessing the rhetorical tools. As examples, he often refers to the purported political enemies of communismand fascism as well as the religions of Christianity and Islam.[citation needed]
The first and best-known of Hoffer's books, The True Believer has been published in twenty-three editions between 1951 and 2002. He later touched upon similar themes in other works.[citation needed] Prominent leaders and social commentators who have remarked publicly about their interest in the book include American President Dwight D. Eisenhower as well as American Secretary of State and First LadyHillary R. Clinton.
The True Believer
 Cover of the first edition | |
| Author | Eric Hoffer |
|---|---|
| Country | United States |
| Language | English |
| Subjects | Fanaticism Social psychology Personal identity |
| Publisher | Harper & Brothers |
| Publication date | 1951 |
| Pages | 176 |
| ISBN | 0060505915 |
| OCLC | 422140753 |
| Dewey Decimal | 303.48/4 21 |
| LC Class | HM716 .H63 2002 |
Hoffer initially attempts to explain the motives of the various types of personalities that give rise to mass movements in the first place and why certain efforts succeed while many others fail. He goes on to articulate a cyclical view of history such that why and how said movements start, progress and end is explored. Whether intended to be cultural, ideological, religious, or whatever else, Hoffer argues that mass movements are broadly interchangeable even when their stated goals or values differ dramatically. This makes sense, in the author's view, given the frequent similarities between them in terms of the psychological influences on its adherents. Thus, many will often flip from one movement to another, Hoffer asserts, and the often shared motivations for participation entail practical effects. Since, whether radical or reactionary, the movements tend to attract the same sort of people in his view, the author describes them as fundamentally using the same tactics including possessing the rhetorical tools. As examples, he often refers to the purported political enemies of communismand fascism as well as the religions of Christianity and Islam.[citation needed]
The first and best-known of Hoffer's books, The True Believer has been published in twenty-three editions between 1951 and 2002. He later touched upon similar themes in other works.[citation needed] Prominent leaders and social commentators who have remarked publicly about their interest in the book include American President Dwight D. Eisenhower as well as American Secretary of State and First LadyHillary R. Clinton.
PedalUma
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Thank you @Mulezen. Good stuff.
If you are bored by ideas do not read the following!
I am looking at the three dimensional VALS model on my desk. It has three sides a top and a bottom. It is used as a simplified model for understanding things such as consumer behaviors, personality types, and motivations. The three sides are Do, Idea and Got. The bottom like Maslow are the Survivors, homeless. The top are Self-Actualizers, Musk. As one has greater access of resources, money, education, critical thinking skills.. one moves from the bottom to the top along a side, but everyone is mixed. The Do side starts with Makers at the bottom and Experiencers at the top. The Idea side has Believers at the bottom and Thinkers at the top. The Got side has Strivers at the bottom and Achievers at the top. The people around the bottom need to be told what to do, believe, and what to aspire to own. Makers need to follow the directions on a box for example. Strivers need to be told what logos to have on their shoes. Believers tend to be comfort oriented, overweight, childish and like groups. They are oxytocin motivated. Comfort food, plush couch, lap dog. They love being in a mob and harboring self-righteous indignation. I stay away from Believers and am attracted to Experiencers and Thinkers. An Achiever will ask you about your trophies and are boring to be around. An Experiencer will ask you about your self-adventures. A thinker will want to talk about philosophy and judge you by the originality and depth of your thoughts and quality of inner life.
Edit: Believers want an overweight, over-powered, fat bike with a throttle. And marketers will sell it to them by using psychographic modeling.
If you are bored by ideas do not read the following!
I am looking at the three dimensional VALS model on my desk. It has three sides a top and a bottom. It is used as a simplified model for understanding things such as consumer behaviors, personality types, and motivations. The three sides are Do, Idea and Got. The bottom like Maslow are the Survivors, homeless. The top are Self-Actualizers, Musk. As one has greater access of resources, money, education, critical thinking skills.. one moves from the bottom to the top along a side, but everyone is mixed. The Do side starts with Makers at the bottom and Experiencers at the top. The Idea side has Believers at the bottom and Thinkers at the top. The Got side has Strivers at the bottom and Achievers at the top. The people around the bottom need to be told what to do, believe, and what to aspire to own. Makers need to follow the directions on a box for example. Strivers need to be told what logos to have on their shoes. Believers tend to be comfort oriented, overweight, childish and like groups. They are oxytocin motivated. Comfort food, plush couch, lap dog. They love being in a mob and harboring self-righteous indignation. I stay away from Believers and am attracted to Experiencers and Thinkers. An Achiever will ask you about your trophies and are boring to be around. An Experiencer will ask you about your self-adventures. A thinker will want to talk about philosophy and judge you by the originality and depth of your thoughts and quality of inner life.
Edit: Believers want an overweight, over-powered, fat bike with a throttle. And marketers will sell it to them by using psychographic modeling.
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Catalyzt
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Very thoughtful of you to ask, because I am the Self-Appointed Arbiter of All Shaming.
In this situation, I would endorse only the lightest, most playful shaming, unless the person is actually a vegetable-- and it's getting hard to tell.
We have very limited, inconclusive data on the vaccine and plant infertility. Fields may or may not be rendered fallow.
Well, that rules out any discussion of economics as well.
I used to say that the difference between economics and psychology is that psychology knows that it's part science and part humanity, and economics pretends that it's only a science, when actually it is part humanity.
My position on this has hardened since then, however, and I now consider economics to be a religion.
Holy crap! A double-header! Glad to hear you are okay, and good to know, I'm on blood thinners, and I'd been thinking of getting my INR tested at two weeks, a little earlier than usual-- I'm definitely making that a plan.
My 1/2 mile swim this morning resulted in a screaming migraine tonight, so I'm back to bird-watching, shuffleboard, and wellness walks, no e-biking or hard exercise for a few more days. God help my wife, dogs, and anyone who has to put up with me until then.
I'm very curious about differences in symptoms and severity in Chapter 1 vs. Chapter 2, but no pressure to disclose if you don't want to discuss.
Channel surfing this Am and landed on the end of the Smerconish show in time to see his survey question which was basically "Do you agree with Biden that social media disinformation regarding the vaccine is getting people killed." I decided to hang around and see the results. Before he saw the results himself he predicted that there would be 14,000 responses that would break down to about 53% agree and 47% disagree. He was way off. It was 17,000 responses with 86% agree and 14% disagree.
PatriciaK
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I think the majority of folks who were surveyed about why they don't want to be vaccinated - don't remember the exact percentage - cited Facebook as their main source of (mis)information.
PedalUma
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Darwin Awards: Evolutionary Action
Darwin Awards: Vote for the Award Nominees! The Darwin Awards commemorate the (remains of) individuals who contribute to the improvement of our gene pool by removing themselves from it. Enter this portal for stories from the Darwin Awards.
darwinawards.com
PatriciaK
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Yep - 12 people spreading havoc to millions.
Art Deco
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Okay so I am the man from mars here . No FB, no TV, ( few magazines or books by living authors ) Hyper sensitive to Ads etc. Why not discuss why people believe FB over other sources... news sites, or their own lived experiences in cases .
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