Show us pictures of your cockpit!

[Stefan Mikes]

I'm certainly no minimalist and being an engineer / gadget freak, my cockpit gets a lot of funny looks on the trail:

View attachment 159808 View attachment 159809

My Riese and Müller Nevo3 GT Vario GX cockpit

View attachment 159886

From left to right, as viewed;

• Enviolo gear change
• Bell (very loud)
• Garmin Outfront Mount with Varia Radar Display Unit and Varia UT800 Front Light
• Bosch Nyon Head Unit
• Supernova Mini 2 Pro Front Light
• Moon Canopus Front Light
• QuadLock Phone Mount
• Bosch Nyon Control Panel

DG…

Your cockpits guys look as if they were brought from a space cruiser! And I thought my Vado 6.0 cockpit was crammed with the things

 

[Stefan Mikes]

@6zfshdb: I have just studied the details of your cockpit.
Silly me! Why did I sell my two extra Wahoo computers?! I could have three on my bars: Navigation, Workout Data, and Summit (Climbing)! How convenient not to tire your finger to swap the data pages!

Only the voltmeter has really surprised me!

 

[DiggyGun]

Your cockpits guys look as if they were brought from a space cruiser! And I thought my Vado 6.0 cockpit was crammed with the things

The only additional items to the original bike are the phone holder, lights and radar.

I really like the radar. It picks up moving objects far earlier than you can see them in a mirror.

You can’t have too many lights in the UK. One to see with and one (flashing) to be seen with.

DG…

 

[Stefan Mikes]

You can’t have too many lights in the UK.

Even if I had a chance to drive my (good) car over a big part of England with an occasional incursion to Scotland many years ago, I have never had enough courage to ride a bicycle there. What makes me scared there are ubiquitous hedges in England. One cannot see what is just behind the next corner!

 

[6zfshdb]

@6zfshdb: I have just studied the details of your cockpit.
Silly me! Why did I sell my two extra Wahoo computers?! I could have three on my bars: Navigation, Workout Data, and Summit (Climbing)! How convenient not to tire your finger to swap the data pages!

Only the voltmeter has really surprised me!

I've never actually used the bike with all the devices attached, the pic was more of a joke.

At my age, I like to minimize the time my eyes are off the trail and my hands off the bars. That's the main reason for the two GPS units since I can view the stats & map at the same time on large, easily readable screens.

Although the battery gauge will display voltage as well as linear capacity, it requires several button presses. The separate voltmeter gives me a hands free view of both at a glance. I'm hoping to replace the two if I can find a single gauge that will display true linear capacity and voltage at the same time.

Due to circulation issues, I use a noseless saddle which makes it difficult to control the bike with my hips. I ride some rough & fairly narrow trails and taking even one hand off the bars can quickly cause problems.

I don't mind the funny looks I get if my gadgets will continue to allow me to ride safely for many years to come.

 

[PCeBiker]

I've never actually used the bike with all the devices attached, the pic was more of a joke.

This was my first post in this thread, and it wasn't a joke.

I wanted to learn how to ride my bike by feel, without looking at the screen.

The only things that I need to see are my volts and my Watts.

At my age, I like to minimize the time my eyes are off the trail and my hands off the bars.

My riding style requires me to minimize the time my eyes are off the road and maximize the time my hands are off the handlebars.

Although the battery gauge will display voltage as well as linear capacity, it requires several button presses. The separate voltmeter gives me a hands free view of both at a glance. I'm hoping to replace the two if I can find a single gauge that will display true linear capacity and voltage at the same time.

If you ever find a single guage that will display true linear capacity and voltage at the same time, could you please @PCeBiker me to let me know?

I have a 48 Volt battery though, so I will need something slightly different.

I notice that your bar graph has 10 segments.
That's more than adequate for me.

My 4 bar graph just doesn't cut it.

Due to circulation issues, I use a noseless saddle which makes it difficult to control the bike with my hips.

I was considering a seat like yours for my lazy ass, but I didn't realize how much I squeeze my nose when I'm riding with no hands.
I know now that I need a nose, as long as my nose isn't squeezing my jewels.

I ride some rough & fairly narrow trails and taking even one hand off the bars can quickly cause problems.

Try riding those trails at about 16 kph with no hands at all.
It works great for me.

I don't mind the funny looks I get if my gadgets will continue to allow me to ride safely for many years to come.

I don't mind the big ass smiles and waves I get when I'm riding down back country roads at 22 kph, no-hands, smoking a cigarette.

I'm out enjoying myself with nothing to prove and no way to prove it.


Don't ever forget Newton's first law of motion,..
GRAVITY SUCKS !!!

It's the common enemy of all of us.
It's always trying to pull us down.

Don't Ever Give Up or Give In !

We'll conquer it together !!!

 

[Stefan Mikes]

I've never actually used the bike with all the devices attached, the pic was more of a joke.

I admit I posted your photos to the limited circle of my FB friends with these comments:
"We e-bikers love gadgets but some of us seem to have overdone it!"
A friend answered: "That e-bike is worthy to be shown off in Warsaw Villa Nova!" (the most expensive neighbourhood of Warsaw, Wilanów)

"I really regret I sold my two extra Wahoo devices as I could have the Map, Workout Data and Summit Segments at a glance!"
To the latter, the friend replied: "Your bars are too short for that!"

While the cockpit of my Vado SL is really minimalist nowadays, the one of my big Vado is far behind yours even it it has the primary display and a Wahoo side by side!

Regarding the voltmeter, my e-bikes have a very accurate battery charge % display, and all e-bike data are reported to the smartphone. Just saying.

 

[PCeBiker]

I would like to thank @6zfshdb for inspiring me to buy something,..

I didn't ride today, but I smoked a Vado, drank half a quart of Vodka, and found myself buying something from the Amazon rain forest @!!

Now I've got all kinds of stuff to install on my handlebars,..

Volts Amps & Time.

That's everything anyone needs to know.

 

[6zfshdb]

I would like to thank @6zfshdb for inspiring me to buy something,..

I didn't ride today, but I smoked a Vado, drank half a quart of Vodka, and found myself buying something from the Amazon rain forest @!!


View attachment 159980View attachment 159981View attachment 159982


Now I've got all kinds of stuff to install on my handlebars,..

View attachment 159983

Volts Amps & Time.

That's everything anyone needs to know.

The handy thing about this gauge is, it lets you set the capacity of the battery. That means you can use it to accurately determine the state of charge on almost any battery. You can also make adjustments as the battery ages and begins to lose some of it's original capacity. I have yet to see a gauge on any bike that is this flexible.

Keep in mind, the face of the gauge is water resistant but the housing is not. It is designed as a panel mount. I use this waterproof ABS plastic project box for protection from the elements:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0BGMTKKG9/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&th=1

The cable from the shunt to the gauge is extremely difficult to cut & splice and the box is large enough to coil the slack.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

What is wrong with your e-bikes guys?

Main battery and Range Extender battery charge % on a Wahoo (it is even not an e-bike display!) I can see all these parameters in the Workout Data screen at a glance. I can use the same Wahoo for either of my e-bikes.

I can see the same data (and more) in an app.

Who needs a voltmeter on their e-bike?!

 

[6zfshdb]

What is wrong with your e-bikes guys?

View attachment 159998
Main battery and Range Extender battery charge % on a Wahoo (it is even not an e-bike display!) I can see all these parameters in the Workout Data screen at a glance. I can use the same Wahoo for either of my e-bikes.

View attachment 160001
I can see the same data (and more) in an app.

Who needs a voltmeter on their e-bike?!

I question the accuracy of that gauge Stefan. How does it know the true capacity of the battery as it ages. how does it know if you only partially charged it? Will it work with a future replacement battery which may use a different chemistry?

The gauge shown above uses a shunt to measure the actual watt hours consumed. The capacity is programmable for any battery and state of charge at the start of a ride. I suspect the percentage reading on your gauge is based on an extrapolation of the battery voltage which is NOT linear.

I'll admit the voltmeter may seem redundant but it comes in handy when swapping partially charged batteries. The percent reading becomes inaccurate when that occurs.

 

[PCeBiker]

The gauge shown above uses a shunt to measure the actual watt hours consumed. The capacity is programmable for any battery and state of charge at the start of a ride.

Oh Cool !!
I didn't realize that it measured total Watt hours consumed. That's perfect! I thought it was just current Watts being used.

I assume that it comes with instructions on how to set it up ?

 

[mschwett]

q

I question the accuracy of that gauge Stefan. How does it know the true capacity of the battery as it ages. how does it know if you only partially charged it? Will it work with a future replacement battery which may use a different chemistry?

The gauge shown above uses a shunt to measure the actual watt hours consumed. The capacity is programmable for any battery and state of charge at the start of a ride. I suspect the percentage reading on your gauge is based on an extrapolation of the battery voltage which is NOT linear.

I'll admit the voltmeter may seem redundant but it comes in handy when swapping partially charged batteries. The percent reading becomes inaccurate when that occurs.

of course it’s not linear - but it is predictable, with variations due to temperature and load that can be taken into account if those who designed the system knew what they were doing… combine this with calibrated coulomb counters and the days of a lithium ion battery SOC readout dropping like a rock when you hit the shelf are long over. all the modern, reputable e-bikes i’ve ridden have very accurate SOC readouts. it’s a problem that has been solved for a decade without any macgyvering!

these cost about $2.50 in quantity. safe bet something equivalent is included in every decent fully integrated e-bike system.

BQ34Z100-G1 data sheet, product information and support | TI.com

TI’s BQ34Z100-G1 is a Multi-chemistry Impedance Track™ standalone fuel gauge | battery gas gauge. Find parameters, ordering and quality information

www.ti.com

 

[6zfshdb]

Oh Cool !!
I didn't realize that it measured total Watt hours consumed. That's perfect! I thought it was just current Watts being used.

I assume that it comes with instructions on how to set it up ?

Yes, the three gauges I have all came with instructions.

 

[6zfshdb]

q


of course it’s not linear - but it is predictable, with variations due to temperature and load that can be taken into account if those who designed the system knew what they were doing… combine this with calibrated coulomb counters and the days of a lithium ion battery SOC readout dropping like a rock when you hit the shelf are long over. all the modern, reputable e-bikes i’ve ridden have very accurate SOC readouts. it’s a problem that has been solved for a decade without any macgyvering!

these cost about $2.50 in quantity. safe bet something equivalent is included in every decent fully integrated e-bike system.

BQ34Z100-G1 data sheet, product information and support | TI.com

TI’s BQ34Z100-G1 is a Multi-chemistry Impedance Track™ standalone fuel gauge | battery gas gauge. Find parameters, ordering and quality information

www.ti.com

Interesting products. Unfortunately, my bikes are not so equipped and incorporating one into a workable gauge is above my pay grade.

Do you have any experience with their use? Are readings based solely on voltage alone? Once installed in a bike display, can they be easily reprogrammed by the user for battery age, partial charge and battery chemistry?

Given their relatively cheap cost, I'm surprised they aren't used in every e-bike. I would think there would be aftermarket gauge sets which contain these products.

 

[mschwett]

Interesting products. Unfortunately, my bikes are not so equipped and incorporating one into a workable gauge is above my pay grade.

Do you have any experience with their use? Are readings based solely on voltage alone? Once installed in a bike display, can they be easily reprogrammed by the user for battery age, partial charge and battery chemistry?

Given their relatively cheap cost, I'm surprised they aren't used in every e-bike. I would think there would be aftermarket gauge sets which contain these products.

afaik, they (or similar) are used in every major manufacturer e-bike, scooter, etc. otherwise, as you would guess, the SOC readout would be pretty inaccurate. the way they work is not intended to be user programmable, they’re part of a system that includes the relevant battery data in the controller / firmware. haven’t heard of a programmable third party version, i imagine it would require a bit of integration….

similar devices are integrated into every modern smartphone, laptop battery, etc, so there are literally billions of these out there!

 

[Stefan Mikes]

I question the accuracy of that gauge Stefan. How does it know the true capacity of the battery as it ages. how does it know if you only partially charged it? Will it work with a future replacement battery which may use a different chemistry?

The Specialized system knows it all. In the second picture, you can see the actual Wh capacity of the battery (302 Wh while it was 320 Wh when it was brand new). The voltage and amperage are internally measured by the ebike electronics and convert it to the battery % according to the curve calibrated by Specialized engineers. The system knows the actual batteries' charge at any given moment. The battery health is determined by the BMS. The battery and motor temperature are being measured etc.

I can show you the history of up to 51 parameters that can be measured by the e-bike every second of the ride (not all of them are used). And Specialized delivers proprietary batteries so the chemistry won't change for given e-bike model.(If it would, there would be a firmware update).

In the Mission Control app, you can set the battery charge limit at 80%, and the charger will switch off at the proper moment.

The accuracy is as high as you can set Smart Control to instruct the e-bike to provide variable assistance as to achieve a predefined goal of riding a given distance/elevation gain with a predefined battery % remaining at the end of the ride.

Were all these measurements wrong, I would have never been able to complete my 208 or 263 km trips using multiple batteries.

That is the difference between premium e-bike electronics vs cheap stuff you are getting with D2C e-bikes. If you have ever asked yourself what was the difference between an expensive and inexpensive e-bike, that would be one of the reasons.

 

[6zfshdb]

I stand corrected. I was not aware the displays on upscale bikes were so sophisticated.

It sure would save a lot of DIY time if someone would produce an aftermarket display with these parameters for less expensive bikes. I'm aware they exist but the ones I've seen are costly and require a controller replacement with a lot of rewiring.

In the mean time, my $50 DIY gauge suits my needs.

 

[PCeBiker]

I might just use my golf cart Voltmeter for the rest of this season.
Installing the shunt for the new Ammeter will take some time.
I might just do that this winter.

The Volt meter is pretty accurate, and I think that it's just more pleasant and easy to look at,..

 

[Prairie Dog]

I take that back what I said about reducing bar clutter. I plan on adding one of these to get me out of tight spots.