How do Rock Razor tires work on paved road?

[Mark Mark]

I'm planning to buy a best equipped bike. Now I'm targeting at Superdelite GT rohloff HS with The Fox Float. I'll ride it on paved roads most of time, but may go off road occasionally. I read some posts saying that super Moto-X tires are very bad off road. My question is: if I upgrade to GX option, how well or bad the Rock Razor tires behave on paved roads? Thanks for your help!!

 

[Lumos]

I have the Superdelite Rohloff HS with the Fox Float and the GX option and I was surprised how well they roll on paved roads. Mind you I am coming from Schwalbe's Hans Dampf and Magic Mary not from road tyres. The Rock Razors are OK off road and seem a reasonable compromise. I did manage to puncture one within the first month so you would certainly need to think carefully about a puncture prevention strategy as the rear wheel is close to impossible to remove in the field. The problem is the rear suspension that requires a spring tensioner to keep the belt tensioned as the distance changes with the suspension flexing. When you try and remove the belt you are fighting the tensioner.

 

[Squaxor]

@Lumos I've not tried to take off teh back wheel yet. Could you explain the process, as I can't find any info online? I'm about to do a 400 km ride and it would be prudent to know how to change a puncture before I set off.

 

[Mark Mark]

I have the Superdelite Rohloff HS with the Fox Float and the GX option and I was surprised how well they roll on paved roads. Mind you I am coming from Schwalbe's Hans Dampf and Magic Mary not from road tyres. The Rock Razors are OK off road and seem a reasonable compromise. I did manage to puncture one within the first month so you would certainly need to think carefully about a puncture prevention strategy as the rear wheel is close to impossible to remove in the field. The problem is the rear suspension that requires a spring tensioner to keep the belt tensioned as the distance changes with the suspension flexing. When you try and remove the belt you are fighting the tensioner.

Thank you very much, Lumos! Puncture protection is a big issue for the off road tires. I really need to think about it seriously. Thanks again for your valuable information!

 

[Jay Kay]

I have the 2020 Delite GX with Fox and ride 80% offroad. The Rock Razors are a reasonable hybrid, but er more towards off road use. I use Tannus tyre armour and run my Rock Razors at 20 psi, and dont notice drag on sealed roads (beauty of a motor!) and they do great in dry dirt, not as good when it gets too mucky. I dont ride fast, havent been on a road bike, and don’t spend much time on roads. The Moto X (on my wife’s Homage until we swopped them for Rock Razors which she loves) are good on sealed roads/paths, just passable on gravel and hopeless in mud.

 

[Mark Mark]

I have the 2020 Delite GX with Fox and ride 80% offroad. The Rock Razors are a reasonable hybrid, but er more towards off road use. I use Tannus tyre armour and run my Rock Razors at 20 psi, and dont notice drag on sealed roads (beauty of a motor!) and they do great in dry dirt, not as good when it gets too mucky. I dont ride fast, havent been on a road bike, and don’t spend much time on roads. The Moto X (on my wife’s Homage until we swopped them for Rock Razors which she loves) are good on sealed roads/paths, just passable on gravel and hopeless in mud.

Thank you very much Jay! Your information is very helpful. I don’t think I’ll ride fast either. The reason I plan to buy HS is that I’m afraid I may regret in case I need go fast occasionally. I have that function as back up. I watched video by Chris about Tennus. How have you put them in? In a shop by a technician? I’m very glad to know you run the Rock Razors at 20 psi, and dont notice drag on sealed road, which makes me feel good to upgrade to GX options.
Thanks again!!

 

[webcurl]

The R&M Rock Razors use Schwalbe's TravelStar compound which is a Triple compound that the non-R&M Rock Razors don't, not sure if this is still the case.
TravelStar will last longer and is probably better over all.

 

[Lumos]

@Lumos I've not tried to take off teh back wheel yet. Could you explain the process, as I can't find any info online? I'm about to do a 400 km ride and it would be prudent to know how to change a puncture before I set off.

The process for removing the rear wheel for me was as follows:
1. hoist bike up with tractor so that I could have the wheel at optimum working height (Note the John Deere is not included with the bike)
2. undo quick release and unplug Rohloff control wire
3. try and remove rear wheel
4. realise that the belt tension is holding it too tightly to ever budge
5. Use torx 40 to loosen the four bolts holding the wheel tensioner
6. Use a long 3mm Allen key to turn the internal screw that moves the rear wheel backwards and forwards against the tensioner, I took as much tension out as possible
7. Try and remove the rear wheel
8. wheel now snagging on the mudguard so I let all the air out of the rear wheel
9. Try and remove wheel
10 remove QR spindle and snubber wheel to give me more space to remove belt
11 Yank stuff around until I could get the belt off
12 Fit tannus tyre guard and resolve never to attempt any of this in the field
13 Curse the internet for allowing me ever to have found out about Riese and Muller
14 Eventually get the tyre back on with the Tannus installed
15 Struggle manfully to get the wheel back on, fighting the tensioner for every millimetre
16 Tighten up wheel with quick release
17 Use 3mm Allen key through tiny hole to tighten up belt
18 use Gates iPhone app to ensure tension approximately right (about 48Hz)
19 Tighten up T40 torx bolts
20 realise that when I tightened the torx it moved the wheel enough to cause the brakes to bind
21 release torx and add more tension to the left hand side tensioner (sorry, did I not mention that there is one on each side)
22 tighten torx
23 reattach Rohloff control wire
24 Went on Amazon and ordered all the devices I could that help instal stubborn tyres.

One of the most extraordinary features about the Superdelite is how a puncture could leave you completely stranded. The R&M bike manual tells you to consult Rohloff for wheel removal, Rohloff E14 manual tells you to consult Gates manual and the Gates manual tells you to consult the bike manual. Now most of my punctures I can find without removing the wheel but it rules out going tubeless as you could not fit a tube in the field if needed.

The YouTube videos that I have found are all with hardtails, that makes it easy to release tension and disassemble. The front tensioner makes this whole thing very tricky as there is not enough travel in the rear adjuster to release the front tensioner fully.

If people here have discovered a trick that I have missed then I will be delighted to learn it. I did think about disassembling the front tensioner but that spring looks pretty strong and getting it back on may be another saga.

 

[Deleted member 18083]

One of the most extraordinary features about the Superdelite is how a puncture could leave you completely stranded.

Well written, Lumos.

With just a few variations (mainly relating to Torx bolts), you've described my own experiences with removing and refitting a rear wheel on my R&M Homage with E-14 and Gates belt.

As I already knew the difficulty, I chose to push my Homage for 5 km/1 hour when its rear Rock Razor punctured last year.

Back to the thread topic: I found the Rock Razors acceptable on paved roads and bike paths. I no longer use them because I regard them as far too flimsy.

David

 

[Mark Mark]

The process for removing the rear wheel for me was as follows:
1. hoist bike up with tractor so that I could have the wheel at optimum working height (Note the John Deere is not included with the bike)
2. undo quick release and unplug Rohloff control wire
3. try and remove rear wheel
4. realise that the belt tension is holding it too tightly to ever budge
5. Use torx 40 to loosen the four bolts holding the wheel tensioner
6. Use a long 3mm Allen key to turn the internal screw that moves the rear wheel backwards and forwards against the tensioner, I took as much tension out as possible
7. Try and remove the rear wheel
8. wheel now snagging on the mudguard so I let all the air out of the rear wheel
9. Try and remove wheel
10 remove QR spindle and snubber wheel to give me more space to remove belt
11 Yank stuff around until I could get the belt off
12 Fit tannus tyre guard and resolve never to attempt any of this in the field
13 Curse the internet for allowing me ever to have found out about Riese and Muller
14 Eventually get the tyre back on with the Tannus installed
15 Struggle manfully to get the wheel back on, fighting the tensioner for every millimetre
16 Tighten up wheel with quick release
17 Use 3mm Allen key through tiny hole to tighten up belt
18 use Gates iPhone app to ensure tension approximately right (about 48Hz)
19 Tighten up T40 torx bolts
20 realise that when I tightened the torx it moved the wheel enough to cause the brakes to bind
21 release torx and add more tension to the left hand side tensioner (sorry, did I not mention that there is one on each side)
22 tighten torx
23 reattach Rohloff control wire
24 Went on Amazon and ordered all the devices I could that help instal stubborn tyres.

One of the most extraordinary features about the Superdelite is how a puncture could leave you completely stranded. The R&M bike manual tells you to consult Rohloff for wheel removal, Rohloff E14 manual tells you to consult Gates manual and the Gates manual tells you to consult the bike manual. Now most of my punctures I can find without removing the wheel but it rules out going tubeless as you could not fit a tube in the field if needed.

The YouTube videos that I have found are all with hardtails, that makes it easy to release tension and disassemble. The front tensioner makes this whole thing very tricky as there is not enough travel in the rear adjuster to release the front tensioner fully.

If people here have discovered a trick that I have missed then I will be delighted to learn it. I did think about disassembling the front tensioner but that spring looks pretty strong and getting it back on may be another saga.

Super handy man

 

[webcurl]

Wow, the hard tail SuperCharger is much easier. No need to touch T40 bolts or 3mm tension bolts at all, wheel comes off in 10 seconds or less, back on in same time and tension stays the same

 

[Mark Mark]

Well written, Lumos.

With just a few variations (mainly relating to Torx bolts), you've described my own experiences with removing and refitting a rear wheel on my R&M Homage with E-14 and Gates belt.

As I already knew the difficulty, I chose to push my Homage for 5 km/1 hour when its rear Rock Razor punctured last year.

Back to the thread topic: I found the Rock Razors acceptable on paved roads and bike paths. I no longer use them because I regard them as far too flimsy.

David

Thank you very much for your input, David! I’ve read many posts of yours and learned a lot. Thanks for your other informative posts, too! What tires are you using now for your Homage? What punctured your stock Razor last year? Off road?

 

[Jay Kay]

Thank you very much Jay! Your information is very helpful. I don’t think I’ll ride fast either. The reason I plan to buy HS is that I’m afraid I may regret in case I need go fast occasionally. I have that function as back up. I watched video by Chris about Tennus. How have you put them in? In a shop by a technician? I’m very glad to know you run the Rock Razors at 20 psi, and dont notice drag on sealed road, which makes me feel good to upgrade to GX options.
Thanks again!!

Its definitely the Tannus tyre armour that allows me to run at 20psi - without the inserts they would definitely drag. I had my shop put them in on a service visit - it was the first use of them the mechanic had experienced and apparently he cursed a lot getting the. fitted!

 

[TBR]

I originally used the Rock Razors on my 2020 SuperDelite GX Rohloff. I did have one puncture quite early and have been packing a small emergency kit ever since: 1 can of puncture slime, 1 small air pump and several folded paper towels, all in a sealed 1 liter plastic bag. Never had to use this, but even so I changed over to the road tires since my ride profile is mostly asphalt and the non-asphalt is overwhelmingy benign gravel. The motivation for the change was mainly additional stability in curves at high speeds (40km/h+). The couple of hundred km "true trail" I rode with the road tires I did ok, only in some cases I would have preferred more lateral stability and traction, mainly in looser sand.

 

[SteveBorough]

The process for removing the rear wheel for me was as follows:
1. hoist bike up with tractor so that I could have the wheel at optimum working height (Note the John Deere is not included with the bike)
2. undo quick release and unplug Rohloff control wire
3. try and remove rear wheel
4. realise that the belt tension is holding it too tightly to ever budge
5. Use torx 40 to loosen the four bolts holding the wheel tensioner
6. Use a long 3mm Allen key to turn the internal screw that moves the rear wheel backwards and forwards against the tensioner, I took as much tension out as possible
7. Try and remove the rear wheel
8. wheel now snagging on the mudguard so I let all the air out of the rear wheel
9. Try and remove wheel
10 remove QR spindle and snubber wheel to give me more space to remove belt
11 Yank stuff around until I could get the belt off
12 Fit tannus tyre guard and resolve never to attempt any of this in the field
13 Curse the internet for allowing me ever to have found out about Riese and Muller
14 Eventually get the tyre back on with the Tannus installed
15 Struggle manfully to get the wheel back on, fighting the tensioner for every millimetre
16 Tighten up wheel with quick release
17 Use 3mm Allen key through tiny hole to tighten up belt
18 use Gates iPhone app to ensure tension approximately right (about 48Hz)
19 Tighten up T40 torx bolts
20 realise that when I tightened the torx it moved the wheel enough to cause the brakes to bind
21 release torx and add more tension to the left hand side tensioner (sorry, did I not mention that there is one on each side)
22 tighten torx
23 reattach Rohloff control wire
24 Went on Amazon and ordered all the devices I could that help instal stubborn tyres.

One of the most extraordinary features about the Superdelite is how a puncture could leave you completely stranded. The R&M bike manual tells you to consult Rohloff for wheel removal, Rohloff E14 manual tells you to consult Gates manual and the Gates manual tells you to consult the bike manual. Now most of my punctures I can find without removing the wheel but it rules out going tubeless as you could not fit a tube in the field if needed.

The YouTube videos that I have found are all with hardtails, that makes it easy to release tension and disassemble. The front tensioner makes this whole thing very tricky as there is not enough travel in the rear adjuster to release the front tensioner fully.

If people here have discovered a trick that I have missed then I will be delighted to learn it. I did think about disassembling the front tensioner but that spring looks pretty strong and getting it back on may be another saga.

I find deflating the tire makes all the difference! You get a few centimeters play where you can push the tire toward the motor which provides enough slack to remove the belt with ease.