Electric Bike Lights

[windmill]

While I understand you think my info is outdated, its not. What is the difference between our thinking is how bright, the light focus and beam. Generally these lights are great for simple riding. Down a dark street or path these lights with an output of 1200 lumins or less is reasonable. On a dark trail or fire road you may find quickly these light are not enough dependant on how fast your going and the terain your incountering. Many of these lights pattern is focused with a small pattern. The average power these lights sees is not that much. I think Bosch and Yamaha are using 7.6 volts to produce the light. While my seca 2000 is 2000 lumins, likely on high beam. It pretty much overkill on a bike path, even on low beam. I tend to face it more downward because of that fact, when I ride the bike path with my wife. I have connected these wired lights on several models of ebikes. I know how difficult they are to install and the weak points of the installation. The motorcycle reference doesn't mean that much. One because most motorcycles on the road don't use LED bulbs. Also the beam is much wider on a motorcycle. So like I said, its a difference in point of view based on what you would be using the light for.

If one desires maximum output, the Supernova M99 has an output of 1100 lumens on lowbeam, 1600 lumens on high beam, and its a true engineered, controlled headlight that will maximize the effectiveness of those lumens while being usable on public roads and paths without its compromising aim or the safety of others. Certainly the Seca is brighter, and fabulous for its intended use, but it isn't a controlled headlight, its an uncontrolled off road floodlight. It's important to make the distinction clear, as you point out one wouldn't want to have inadequate light off road, but likewise shouldn't misuse one that would be negligent to use on public roads.

As a daily commuter averaging 150 miles a week on busy roads during rush hour , often in the dark and rain, lighting is very important to me, therefore I have put a lot of thought and research into my choices. I use a Busch & Muller IQ-X E headlight wired to the light circuit which needed nothing more than crimping on 2 connectors to plug into the light circuit. At 48v 7w 150 lux, Its approximately 500-600 lumen equivalent, the beam is wider than a typical 2 lane road. Its all that's needed for better than 95% of my rural , suburban, and urban riding. When I need a little more light, I have a Specialized Flux Expert which is also a true controlled headlight that can be aimed correctly without compromise. It has a 2 level 400-800 lumen low beam, and a 2 level 600-1200 highbeam which is excellent in off road conditions.

 

[Lost]

While I understand you think my info is outdated, its not. What is the difference between our thinking is how bright, the light focus and beam. Generally these lights are great for simple riding. Down a dark street or path these lights with an output of 1200 lumins or less is reasonable. On a dark trail or fire road you may find quickly these light are not enough dependant on how fast your going and the terain your incountering. Many of these lights pattern is focused with a small pattern. The average power these lights sees is not that much. I think Bosch and Yamaha are using 7.6 volts to produce the light. While my seca 2000 is 2000 lumins, likely on high beam. It pretty much overkill on a bike path, even on low beam. I tend to face it more downward because of that fact, when I ride the bike path with my wife. I have connected these wired lights on several models of ebikes. I know how difficult they are to install and the weak points of the installation. The motorcycle reference doesn't mean that much. One because most motorcycles on the road don't use LED bulbs. Also the beam is much wider on a motorcycle. So like I said, its a difference in point of view based on what you would be using the light for.

I have an $11 ebay light that I swear lights up as nice a car headlight. Runs off 48 volts, and is bright. Over kill by a large margin on a bike path. 11 watt LED, four 3 watt emitters. It is marketed as a 20 watt light, but that is bogus.

 

[Disraili Gammons]

Yes I think your right. I'm not trying to blind any way but I do see a lot of bikes around here with overly bright lights in drivers eyes. But when I'm just want to be seen rather then actually seeing something. I think my bright light facing down is ok. I bought it to ride with friends at dusk. I have heard plenty of people trying to use these lights off-road and complain of the lack of lighting. But I think your pretty much right but I still think some beams are a bit to small.

 

[windmill]

Yes I think your right. I'm not trying to blind any way but I do see a lot of bikes around here with overly bright lights in drivers eyes. But when I'm just want to be seen rather then actually seeing something. I think my bright light facing down is ok. I bought it to ride with friends at dusk. I have heard plenty of people trying to use these lights off-road and complain of the lack of lighting. But I think your pretty much right but I still think some beams are a bit to small.

I can understand them not liking roadworthy lights off road, its the wrong tool for the job, and a sure way to get clotheslined by a tree branch.
I can't use lights I can't aim properly because I have many long steep hills to contend with. If I aim a light low, it creates a bright pool of light up close which kills my ability to see as far as I need to when doing 30 mph down a mile long hill.

 

[fxr3]

Only the sun can provide enough light for scenarios mentioned above. The only problem with m99 is the 10,000.00 bike attached to it.

 

[RoadWrinkle]

You're experience's are a bit outdated, some of today's E-bike lights that run off the bikes battery are extremely bright, and compare favorably with motorcycle lights.

Inexpensive, sturdy, rechargeable, detached battery, very bright!!! Many Cree lights from China work great at a great price. Plus you will not get this lumen level with an integrated light. You are better off with a light that has its own rechargeable battery...no wiring changes, no main battery drain.

(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)

 

[RoadWrinkle]

If thats the case then those lights would draw a higher % of the main battery, and at a much higher price point. Removable dedicated battery means you can also use the light OFF the bike.

 

[Lost]

If thats the case then those lights would draw a higher % of the main battery, and at a much higher price point. Removable dedicated battery means you can also use the light OFF the bike.

An 11 watt load on the main battery is a pretty small impact on a bike battery.

 

[windmill]

View attachment 16051

Inexpensive, sturdy, rechargeable, detached battery, very bright!!! Many Cree lights from China work great at a great price. Plus you will not get this lumen level with an integrated light. You are better off with a light that has its own rechargeable battery...no wiring changes, no main battery drain.

(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)

I don't ride off road, therefore I prefer to only use properly engineered headlights.

In my experience, those tethered flashlights are a poor bargain,, and find lumens to be a poor measure of a lights actual worth. I rather make the minor effort to have my primary lights fully integrated and permanently mounted rather than a jumble stuck on rubberbands and Velcro.

The total draw of my lights is 8.5w at 1.5% of the batteries capacity, or theoretically 3/10 of a mile. Since I ride using PAS rather than the throttle, the actual difference might be 1/10 of a mile, which is about how far I walk to our mailbox and back.

 

[dsvogel]

Headlight for a Brose system?

Has anyone successfully installed a headlight on a Brose system that can be controlled by the "light" button on the computer? I have a Raleigh Redux IE, and installed a Light & Motion NIP 800, but it is always on, the switch on the computer doesn't turn the light off. The Nip also only cycles between light settings, but does not turn off. Even if I power down the bike, the light quickly flashes (at like 3 lumens) every two seconds. If I put the bike on the charger, the headlight comes on and stays on.

The voltage on the power leads from the bike are always 6 Volts, no matter what setting the computer light indicator is set at (on, off, or auto). I expected that maybe the voltage would go to 0 when the light is set to "off" on the computer.

 

[hurricane56]

Does anyone know if the 2016 Bosch Performance Speed motor has a switchable voltage of 6v or 12v on the light port? Or is it only 6v?

Also, @Chris Nolte has you shop done many installs of the supernova M99 Pro? When you do install one of these lights on a customer bike do you crimp the connections or do you modify the wiring harness and solder it? The reason I ask is I attempted an install of the light as per Supernova’s directions but had issues with the light interfering with the drive system. It was causing the Bosch drive to randomly shutdown. What was a bit perplexing was my soldering skills are pretty good, but still had issues with the install. Would like to know your shop procedure for aftermarket light installs.

 

[Sonoboy]

Does anyone know if the 2016 Bosch Performance Speed motor has a switchable voltage of 6v or 12v on the light port? Or is it only 6v?

Also, @Chris Nolte has you shop done many installs of the supernova M99 Pro? When you do install one of these lights on a customer bike do you crimp the connections or do you modify the wiring harness and solder it? The reason I ask is I attempted an install of the light as per Supernova’s directions but had issues with the light interfering with the drive system. It was causing the Bosch drive to randomly shutdown. What was a bit perplexing was my soldering skills are pretty good, but still had issues with the install. Would like to know your shop procedure for aftermarket light installs.

If you refer to the above video, Chris mentions at the 24 minute mark that all lights except the M99 Pro can be controlled from the Bosch Intuvia display. I don’t know if it requires it’s own switch/relay or not; perhaps he can fill us in.

 

[hurricane56]

If you refer to the above video, Chris mentions at the 24 minute mark that all lights except the M99 Pro can be controlled from the Bosch Intuvia display. I don’t know if it requires it’s own switch/relay or not; perhaps he can fill us in.

From what I understand, because I purchased a m99 pro earlier this year, is the light has four wires that interface directly with the Bosch drive at the battery harness. There is no switch or regulator as the input voltage is very wide, like 24-72v. Supernova sure makes a great product, but in the install kit they give you a set of press fit quick splices that don't even match the gauge of wire you're trying to splice. The other question that Supernova can't seem to answer completely is:

1. How does the light interpret the CANBUS signal that they're pulling from the motor assembly? They require you to tap into the green and yellow wire of the motor. I recall last year seeing something on their website that indicated the light output is dictated by the speed reading the light is pulling from the motor.

2. If I don't connect the yellow and green cables and only connect the power to the light, is the light still functioning at the rated 11oolm low beam?

 

[Chris Nolte]

The motor needs to be updated to accommodate 12v’s. The M99pro isn’t switchable by the display as it taps directly into the Bosch battery leads. We’ve done several of these installs but let me ask my techs as I know it was a bit of a PITA compared to standard light installs.

For the light switching, the daytime running light is always on and the standard low beam comes on based on the ambient lighting conditions. The high beam can be activated by the auxiliary button.

Are you getting an error? What trouble are you having with the install? Keep in mind that taping into the Bosch harness is outside the scope of what Bosch would generally deem acceptable. Riese & Muller did this as kind of a pilot and we’ve replicated it a few times, but I don’t think Supernova or Bosch has this down to a science.

 

[hurricane56]

The motor needs to be updated to accommodate 12v’s. The M99pro isn’t switchable by the display as it taps directly into the Bosch battery leads. We’ve done several of these installs but let me ask my techs as I know it was a bit of a PITA compared to standard light installs.

For the light switching, the daytime running light is always on and the standard low beam comes on based on the ambient lighting conditions. The high beam can be activated by the auxiliary button.

Are you getting an error? What trouble are you having with the install? Keep in mind that taping into the Bosch harness is outside the scope of what Bosch would generally deem acceptable. Riese & Muller did this as kind of a pilot and we’ve replicated it a few times, but I don’t think Supernova or Bosch has this down to a science.

Chris, thanks for your reply! Essentially, I purchased an M99 Pro earlier in the year and did the installation as per Supernova's instruction manual. The in-line splices gave such a poor connection, that I think it was causing the Bosch motor to shutdown. It's a really poor way to connect something, as the splices were designed for very small gauge wire, and the battery harness wires are much thicker. After about a month of random shutdowns on the Bosch system, I decided to cut the harness and solder all four wires of the battery harness cable to the M99 Pro wire harness. This still caused the random system shutdowns. I do have a high degree of confidence in my soldering ability, but it's unclear if tapping into the yellow and green CANBUS cable is even needed. It's also unclear if splitting those wires off to the light might have caused those shutdowns.

Currently I sent the m99 pro back to Supernova for a checkup, but have yet to hear from anyone there. If you do have any customers that are using the m99 pro with the bosch system aftermarket, I'd be interested to know if your shop tech only connects the power leads and not the CANBUS cables.

 

[Mr. Coffee]

While the integrated lights are awesome and very bright, for myself I usually use a helmet-mounted light such as a Light & Motion Trail 1000 FC Ranger.

There are a couple of reasons. The biggest one is that I can use the light as a flashlight if I am making emergency field repairs in the dark or setting up camp in the dark. The other reason is that a helmet-mounted light lights where I look, which can help a lot if I am anticipating a turn. Finally, I usually ride with a large front basket and that gets in the way of the built-in light and greatly limits its usefulness.

Having a strobe is awesome for early-morning and dusk to make sure you are seen from a long ways away. With some experimentation I found I could see a helmet-mounted light over 2 miles away at sunrise.

At full power the Ranger provides over an hour of light, which is about as long as I would ever ride in the dark.

Just my $.02.

 

[JoeLong]

Great thread, just purchased a bbs02 kit from Luna, is there a plug & play lighting system 52v that would integrate easily, or should I just install a rechargeable unit.

Regards, Joe

 

[rich c]

Great thread, just purchased a bbs02 kit from Luna, is there a plug & play lighting system 52v that would integrate easily, or should I just install a rechargeable unit.

Regards, Joe

I've never seen anyone make a 52v light. Maybe by plug and play you mean a transformer as well?

 

[Amish David]

I used to work in the ebike industry. I found that lights that work off the battery generally are not that bright. I would suggest choose something with it's own battery scorce. I ended up buying a Lights and Motion Seca 2000. The ones that run off the bike batteries also require a special harness and some light cut and paste wiring connections. On early bikes it's extremely difficult to add without cut and paste with a custom setup with a switch. Hope that helps clarify some of the options avalible.

That's exactly what I'm doing with mine. Running a LED brake light parking light, LED blinkers and a and I LED headlight all 12 volt. I have already taken a template and Mark out where my motorcycle battery will go into the frame, obviously the 48v battery will go on the back tray. I've already installed the lights, and integrated my brake light switch at my front disc brake arm. Hopefully next weekend my neighbor will have time to help me fabricate my 12 volt battery holder. But this write-up was very informative, lots of good options to.

 

[hurricane56]

I successfully installed a Supernova m99 Pro onto my 2016 Haibike Trekking S. The low beam brightness is equal to if not brighter than most newer LED automotive headlights. This is probably due to the amazing job they did designing the reflector. When I compare this to my Juiced Bike HF1000, which has a 1600lm dual LED, there’s just so much more throw with the m99. Plus with a properly designed reflector your not being a jerk to other road users by blinding them with glare.