Are Flat Out, Slime and Stans a scam?

[m@Robertson]

I bought a couple of large 500CC Syringes (included about 2ft of tubing) from Amazon. I will just pour the correct amount in the syringe and “push” it into the tube. Easy and accurate.

Eeek. Open up the bottle of FlatOut. You'll find there is a hose built into the top of the bottle cap that you only need to extend. Its sized for a Schrader valve. I use a Presta-to-Schrader adapter and then just press that to the presta valve once I remove the Presta valve core. Then squeeze the bejesus out of the bottle and the sealant roars into the tube at a fast rate. I use the hashmarks on the side of the bottle to gauge how much I am loading in. Not precise but good enough for my purposes.

Bottom line FlatOut should not need anything additional to get it into the tube. it even has a valve core remover (Schrader) built into the little lid that caps the hose extension.

UNLESS you have a wonky valve. I have actually - rarely - needed to use a meat marinade injector with its long, broadly-opened needle from the grocery store to either a) extend past a rubber flap at the bottom of the valve at tube-level or b) poke a hole into the tube itself to inject the sealant. I used the latter with Slime for the few presta tubes I owned with non-removable valve cores. If doing the latter you can either let the sealant seal the tube or do a proper Rema-type vulcanizing patch over the hole you just made.

 

[m@Robertson]

Doesn't Slime dry inside a tire or tube and you need to refresh it every so often?

I think your assumption is off a bit. Consider this: For Slime to dry out, the water needs to get from the inside of the tube to the outside. Rubber doesn't let water or water vapor through, so there's no way for this to happen.

I suspect their two year rating is more about marketing and repeat sales than any science.

If that were true, then the various flavors of Orange Seal and Stans would also not harden? But they all do, including Slime. The one exception appears to be FlatOut.

• Stans hardens to weird things that you can google to see: "Stan's boogers". Stans is rated for 2-7 months (!). You can hear the boogers rattling around sometimes as the tire rotates. In the hot/dry climate I am in, it lasts for longer than 7 months. Maybe as much as a year.
• Orange Seal hardens to an ultra-thin layer over either the inside of the tire or tube, depending on how you use it. It can be peeled off or left on. It was so thin I always left it. OS is rated for 30-45 days (!!!). The Endurance formula I went to because of this short life is rated 60-120 days. I really liked OS Endurance while I used it, but In my experience its good for about 6 months. edit: This longevity rating is so much lower than it used to be, they either changed the formula or they are doing exactly what @retiredNH speculated upon.
  
  https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1700/9831/files/OS_product_info_sheet2.pdf?12244408881823713349
• Slime varies. I'd say the 2 year number is a pretty good approximation. The stuff I have seen dry becomes almost like mashed potatoes. (usually a tube gets so many holes over its life that the Slime never has a chance to dry out... I'll get something I can't patch and then its time for a new tube)..

The slime never dried in this tube but that was only because Hole #7 happened on a seam and neither Slime nor a patch could seal properly over it, even with sanding and shaving.

 

[Gionnirocket]

I think your assumption is off a bit. Consider this: For Slime to dry out, the water needs to get from the inside of the tube to the outside. Rubber doesn't let water or water vapor through, so there's no way for this to happen.

I suspect their two year rating is more about marketing and repeat sales than any science.

But in fact it does dry out...
So though the time frame may be marketing to a certain extent and there may also be a bit of erring on the side of caution, thinking it can last forever is a bit silly.

 

[6zfshdb]

Rubber inner tubes can be slightly porous to air, true, but not by osmosis, at least not as a chemist would use the term. You might note that for most solids, gas permeability is higher than liquid permeability, usually much higher. But this is a complicated field unless you're a chemist!

I'm certainly no chemist. I picked it up by reading articles on the net. The term osmosis is used in reference to air escaping through a rubber membrane. The process is also referred to as "permeation"

How often should I check the air in my tires?

www.goldensbikeshop.com

Making sure your motorcycle tire pressure is correct for cool weather riding | Dairyland® motorcycle

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Tire Deflation: What Causes Tire Pressure Loss?

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Google "tire osmosis" and you'll see more.

 

[retiredNH]

But in fact it does dry out...
So though the time frame may be marketing to a certain extent and there may also be a bit of erring on the side of caution, thinking it can last forever is a bit silly.

Didn't say it would last forever! I'm actually not surprised if it has a limited use life. It's components are no doubt not stable for a long time. I suspect the stuff that seals aggregates with time. That's pretty common with any kind of suspension.

 

[Gionnirocket]

I ran over a jagged piece of metal half buried in grass yesterday about 8 miles from home.
It was about 3pm on a very hot, sunny and humid day. +90° / 70° dew point... and with a lot of hills between me and home.
It was on the rear and the tire deformed feeling like I was running over an acorn with every tire rotation... but for fear of a leak I kept about a 15mph return speed. Not only did the tube hold air all the way home... But it was still full this morning.

Thanks Mr. Slime.

I was able to patch the tube but the tire needs to be replaced. It was just about due anyway.

 

[FrankR]

I would no longer trust someone saying Slime and Flat Out are scams. Are they going to work in every case? No. But the data is definitely there that they legitimately prevent lots of fails.

 

[Nomad]

I would no longer trust someone saying Slime and Flat Out are scams. Are they going to work in every case? No. But the data is definitely there that they legitimately prevent lots of fails.

generally speaking tire sealants work to a good degree some better than others. I run tubeless my self and carry a tube incase the sealant doesn't work.

 

[fooferdoggie]

PSI is the biggest fan tor. anyone over around 50 psi and most of the time it wont work. or if you cant find what's in the tire and remove it.

 

[m@Robertson]

... or if you cant find what's in the tire and remove it.

I carry needlenose pliers in a fast-grab place on my bike for this specific reason. I have had several instances where - if I had just stopped and pulled the nail or whatever - my tire sealant would have worked entirely on its own.
Sealant DOES work on its own if you, say get a puncture from something that stays on the ground. But if its stuck in the tire, chances are almost certain that the sealant will not seal the puncture. Now... from there what I have done is finally give up and pull the offending bit out. Then reinflate and continue on. THEN the sealant works.

So, in the present day, If I hear the telltale hissHissHiss, I stop and ensure the hole is free of nails etc. then I continue the roll to let the sealant work. Worst case I drop the kickstand to use it as a lever to get the bike up off the ground. Lift the bike and spin the rear wheel with the throttle. If my dismount has caused too much air loss... no need to panic. Break out the battery powered air compressor and fully refill. Then ride a block and reassess. Even the worst multi-nail holes have never needed more than 3 refills until a permanent seal is obtained.

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[fooferdoggie]

most of the time if I get something I the tire I cant find it from the outside only after I take the tube out and feel inside. my last flat I found the nail removed it used c02 to rein flat the tire so I could spin it so it would Sean and taking the c02 thing off it unscrewed the valve.

 

[Nomad]

I carry needlenose pliers in a fast-grab place on my bike for this specific reason. I have had several instances where - if I had just stopped and pulled the nail or whatever - my tire sealant would have worked entirely on its own.
Sealant DOES work on its own if you, say get a puncture from something that stays on the ground. But if its stuck in the tire, chances are almost certain that the sealant will not seal the puncture. Now... from there what I have done is finally give up and pull the offending bit out. Then reinflate and continue on. THEN the sealant works.

So, in the present day, If I hear the telltale hissHissHiss, I stop and ensure the hole is free of nails etc. then I continue the roll to let the sealant work. Worst case I drop the kickstand to use it as a lever to get the bike up off the ground. Lift the bike aFor instance ind spin the rear wheel with the throttle. If my dismount has caused too much air loss... no need to panic. Break out the battery powered air compressor and fully refill. Then ride a block and reassess. Even the worst multi-nail holes have never needed more than 3 refills until a permanent seal is obtained.

A Lightweight Electric Emergency Bike Pump

Got an ebike? Use the big battery you are already lugging around to power a small portable pump.

talesontwowheels.com

One should take a look the different videos out there regarding fixing flats on tires with sealant in them as you may need to do something to help the process work if there not well versed in that. For instance if you run tubeless it a good idea to carry tire plugs for bigger holes.

 

[m@Robertson]

One should take a look the different videos out there regarding fixing flats on tires with sealant in them as you may need to do something to help the process work if there not well versed in that. For instance if you run tubeless it a good idea to carry tire plugs for bigger holes.

Sure. I do carry them when using FlatOut as a tubeless sealant although I've never run into anything - including a strip of roofing nails that gave me six punctures in a row - that needed them. FlatOut as a tubeless sealant is in my opinion better than Stans or the different flavors of Orange Seal (I've tried them) in that its rated for filling larger holes. For me, both Stans and OS are great for pinholes (i.e. thorns) but when you get cut with glass or a bolt/shard of steel the traditional sealers are out of their league.

I carry Lezyne tire plugs on tubeless kits, and a self-made Rema patch kit and a tube for tubeless setups. On my tubeless fat cargo bike I'm also carrying a spare tube.

I have a '2022' version of my tool kit posts that among other things do without the co2 and use Knipex pliers in place of the wrench and needlenoses. Waiting to publish it after the build-a-bike series is done.

A Proper (e?)Bike Tool Kit

You need to carry tools as a matter of routine. Especially if you ride daily for transportation or commuting. But what do you really *need*?

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[BigNerd]

Slime on a tube worked for me. It kept leaking Slime so I just had the tube replaced.

 

[Tom@WashDC]

still using tubes wherein the slime sealed snake eye punctures.