Bafang G062 / G063 Info

[OkinawaJapan]

It seems the G63 is bafang's replacement for the G62. At some point in 2023 / 2024, the Ali Express listings switched over and the G62 was phasing out. In the g63 there were a number of incremental improvements - better jam nuts that are easier to remove, strong waterproofing glue (not easy to open!), the windings look cleaner and more consistent. I opened up a g63 at some point on my channel, and its on a bike I will ride this winter

I got the g63.1000 (5.5) with the red L1121 connector , its probably the easiest way to find it at a low price and have a good chance of it being an M14 axle. It may be difficult to find G62 with an M14 axle- I have heard RisunMotor had M14 axle g62's in the past.

If doing a dual motor setup, the g63.1000 with the 5.5 wind can be easily paired with the G61.1000 front fat motor thats also available in 5.5 wind. I had some stuttering problems with dual motors in VESC when the front and rear motor was a different winding.

but Yes, It would appear G62 is an endangered species! Potentially, not being manufactured by Bafang anymore.

Thanks for that. Yeah. Seems so.

I did have one reseller say they can custom order the 14mm G62 for me still.

And that link you provided for the G63 from PSR Ebike Store has been great on the communications. Better than all the others so far.

They even just said this:
"The motor is equipped with a temperature sensor, and the temperature sensor and the speed measurement line share a white line

bafang has now been upgraded to 1121 waterproof cables, which can provide a greater current"

That really true? Did you find that to be true for yours? It didn't seem so from the video that it was the case.

CONHISMOTOR Official Store are the ones that claim they can offer the G62 in a 14mm axle for me if I request it.

Risunmotor have been jerks to talk to. They say they have no 14mm axle versions for sale.

Seems that I'll probably go with a G063 from PSR Ebike Store and try to adapt it to my Baserunner L10 or Z9 to mux the speed and temp on the same pin. Just need to figure out which pin that is and find the pinout diagram for both. Edit: Seems it's the white pin listed in the diagram below.

Man, I really want to believe it already has a temp sensor built in. That would make the G63 the way to go nowadays.

$233 delivered is low enough to be worth playing around with.

Edit: They just shared this pinout diagram:

Great customer service from this guy for me today.

They say they provide the other end of the cable so I can adapt it as I need. However I really wished there was an L1019 to L1121 adapter cable. I'll have to research that and see.

 

[OkinawaJapan]

So if the motor side has an L1121 male end on it, then I'll need a female L1121 connector to ? for the Baserunner L10 adapter cable?

All controllers have female on the controller side, right? Because all hubs have male connectors on the hub side, right?

Baserunner/Phaserunner L10 (left pic below) seems to have a female L1019?

So I guess that means I need a Female L1121 to Male L1019 adapter cable?

Adapter - Motor Cable - L1019 Male to L1121 Female

Adapter - Motor Cable - L1019 Male to L1121 FemaleNice and short! Allows you to adapt a Grin Phaserunner or similar controller (L1019) to another motor type.NOTE: Bafang G063 do not seem to be compatible, they use their own unique wiring (unfortunate!)

www.affordableebikes.ca

This it? This look right? I think that's it.

It's good to see that they're available. That means it's likely to work then I believe.

 

[JTK77]

So what size is your axle that you found it risky on? 12mm? How would you feel if it were a 14mm axle? No concerns? Or is it also the gears that are a worry for regen?

Perhaps DD is the way to go for full regen? Maybe this is why Grin removed the option to weld the stator on their Bafang motors this past year?

I also wonder how Engwie the Engine Pro 2.0 is faring with their regen implementation with their customers? I don't think they have a torque arm on it right? That's the bike that originally started me down this track once I'd heard it existed. But now I'm glad I didn't order it as it has some limitations with their controller implementation I've read. So Grin is the only game in town currently for being able to implement all the features and options of regen.

I

Axle is 12mm. I have V7 regen 12mm torque arms on both sides. Gears are sandwiched steel nylon. Welded clutch will hold regen but axle key is now the weakest link. I have super tight clutch body/axle fit that helps but still.
With all the mods the performance is awesome for the stealthiness
If I had time and some $ to play I would next go and mod all axle fat hub for 15-20kw.

 

[Boosted]

Hey Boosted. Great write up here. Thank you for that.

I wrote to Risunmotors via the Aliexpress chat and they say they can't sell me a 14mm axle in the G62 version. I've asked two other resellers and am awaiting an answer. It seems like the G063 is taking over nowadays. Do you know where to purchase a G062 with a 14mm axle? I'm also wanting one with an L1019 connector for use with a Baserunner L10 controller.

I was watching @Ebikebuilderyt 's videos on youtube (and loving them). lol. Where he is adding a thermistor to his. Seems like a PITA but I'll do it if necessary, but I'd rather find them sold with the temp sensor already installed and the grey wire actually present and connected in the L1019 connector. It seems Bafang isn't actually installing the grey temp wire even though they have an L1019 10 pin connector on it. Cheesy economics right there from them.

Anyone know a source for motors? Grin only has the 190mm axle version and it's a 6.5T which he says is super loud, which I'd prefer to avoid. I also heard their custom order of the 6.5T didn't actually come with the grey wire installed in the L1019 connector they found when they received their shipment. But does have the sensor installed. So it's not usable as is anyway.

So I'm looking for a 1000w 6T 170mm width, cassette model with 14mm axle with temp sensor, actual grey temp wire present and an L1019 connector already all connected up and working from the reseller. If that's no longer available these days, and no one knows a source, then it seems that the G63 may be the new and only game in town. But it comes with an L1121 connector instead of the L1019. Which I will then have to figure out where to buy or make an adapter...

Such a PITA right now getting what I want in a Bafang motor. Any known sources for ordering and actually getting what I want?

Anyway, love the original post details and all the further info shared in this thread. It's the best one on the net on these hub motors right now. Thank you.

I plan to do regen with it with dual V7 Grin torque arms, so I think the 14mm axle is required, right?

I did get several M14 axle G062.750's (6.5T) from Risun Motor. Not sure what their current stock is. If this is important to you I would ask the seller if axle measurements are 10x12 or 10x14 for clarification.

I havent looked in like a year, but last time I looked you cannot find L1121 cables thicker than 2.5-3 mm2. Grin (and aliexpress now) sell L1019 cables up to 4mm2. So I prefer the L1019 over the L1121 for that reason, and also because its more compatible with controllers. All of the OEM motors (L1019 or L1121) seem to be 2.5-3mm2 phase wires, except for perhaps GRIN's which MAY (im not 100% sure) but may come with a 4MM2 cable.

The GRIN motor does come with a thermistor I believe. However I have never seen any other ones come with a thermistor. Its not too hard to add one if you have a compatible controller

The MXUS GDR19-FAT motor has its own issues too, but its a powerhouse, has an M14 axle, can fit a 4MM2 L1019 no problem, is mechanically stronger and also comes with steel gears OEM.

Good luck!


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[OkinawaJapan]

I did get several M14 axle G062.750's (6.5T) from Risun Motor. Not sure what their current stock is. If this is important to you I would ask the seller if axle measurements are 10x12 or 10x14 for clarification.​

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I havent looked in like a year, but last time I looked you cannot find L1121 cables thicker than 2.5-3 mm2. Grin (and aliexpress now) sell L1019 cables up to 4mm2. So I prefer the L1019 over the L1121 for that reason, and also because its more compatible with controllers. All of the OEM motors (L1019 or L1121) seem to be 2.5-3mm2 phase wires, except for perhaps GRIN's which MAY (im not 100% sure) but may come with a 4MM2 cable.​

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The GRIN motor does come with a thermistor I believe. However I have never seen any other ones come with a thermistor. Its not too hard to add one if you have a compatible controller​

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The MXUS GDR19-FAT motor has its own issues too, but its a powerhouse, has an M14 axle, can fit a 4MM2 L1019 no problem, is mechanically stronger and also comes with steel gears OEM.​

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Good luck!​

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Thanks. Yeah, I have been interested in the MXUS GDR19-FAT ever since you posted about it in your other thread. Sounds promising!
I'm reading that other thread now for the fine details. I may consider it if the wiring works from the factory just fine nowadays with a Baserunner/Phaserunner L10 to just plug and play.

By the way, for anyone interested, these guys at CONHISMOTOR Official Store just added an option to their checkout options for a 20 inch fat wheel build option by itself for a G62 without the rest of the kit.
So that was nice of them. But it's $399. Too much I think. I'd build it myself with a better rim for a bit less. They also said they can offer the 14mm axle if requested. So they are motivated to help.

https://vi.aliexpress.com/item/1005008347539527.html

 

[Boosted]

Thanks. Yeah, I have been interested in the MXUS GDR19-FAT ever since you posted about it in your other thread. Sounds promising!
I'm reading that other thread now for the fine details. I may consider it if the wiring works from the factory just fine nowadays with a Baserunner/Phaserunner L10 to just plug and play.

By the way, for anyone interested, these guys at CONHISMOTOR Official Store just added an option to their checkout options for a 20 inch fat wheel build option by itself for a G62 without the rest of the kit.
So that was nice of them. But it's $399. Too much I think. I'd build it myself with a better rim for a bit less. They also said they can offer the 14mm axle if requested. So they are motivated to help.

https://vi.aliexpress.com/item/1005008347539527.html

I havent ran G062's in a while and have moved on to different motors. My conclusion is its a great motor for low powered setups, but pushing the power limits on this motor just has too many issues. Hard to fit larger phase wires. The windings have limits. No temp sensor OEM. And most importantly mechanical limitations, the clutch can only handle so much abuse, the gears have limits, and as I mentioned earlier and JTK just mentioned the keys have issues. So running this motor at 1500-3000w or maybe a little more and 85nm torque or less its a good motor, but pushing higher than that is asking for trouble IMO

 

[JTK77]

I havent ran G062's in a while and have moved on to different motors. My conclusion is its a great motor for low powered setups, but pushing the power limits on this motor just has too many issues. Hard to fit larger phase wires. The windings have limits. No temp sensor OEM. And most importantly mechanical limitations, the clutch can only handle so much abuse, the gears have limits, and as I mentioned earlier and JTK just mentioned the keys have issues. So running this motor at 1500-3000w or maybe a little more and 85nm torque or less its a good motor, but pushing higher than that is asking for trouble IMO

I have sold quite a lot of controller kits for this motor (stock). These kits are 45A battery current / ~95A phase (48-60v battery compatible). I have received one report of burned windings on 6.5 turn version going on hard and slow in deep snow. I would recommend 45A battery/100A phase as relatively safe for stock G062.
I'm pushing 120A battery/200A phase for modified one. 8 awg phases etc.

 

[Boosted]

I have sold quite a lot of controller kits for this motor (stock). These kits are 45A battery current / ~95A phase (48-60v battery compatible). I have received one report of burned windings on 6.5 turn version going on hard and slow in deep snow. I would recommend 45A battery/100A phase as relatively safe for stock G062.
I'm pushing 120A battery/200A phase for modified one. 8 awg phases etc.

45A controller at 48v is 2200w and 60v 45a is 2700w, sounds like we are on the same page. Most kits from CHINA (OEM kits) do not supply 45a controllers with this motor, around 30-35A is as high as they go. I think theres a reason for that. Deep snow, deep sand, steep hills you can definitely overheat the thing, in a matter of a couple minutes per grin sim. So yeah maybe 3kw is okay if you are taking it easy but even 2kw can burn it on steep stuff depending. 100 phase amp on a 5-5.5T is about 85Nm give or take. Sounds like were pretty much in agreement. Depending how you ride and how hard you use it, most users are pavement princesses.

So yeah its good for these power levels or LESS, but trying to run big power is asking for problems. Read the comments on this thread, nearly ever single person running real power on these motors has come across numerous issues, including you and me.

 

[JTK77]

Yes. I had first wiring damages at ~150A phase, 4500w (60v) with near stock wiring. Following magnets gluing failing (5000w) after 1 year and nylon gears 6000w at 2y mark. Now with all the mods like improved liquid cooling and winding temp logging I have had no issues for a long time.
Some medium power riding on gravel country roads

 

[Ebikebuilderyt]

the grin tech G62 may have had slightly larger phase wires, it felt a little better than my 6T winding, I also think they had some improved processes like the stator seemed much cleaner in the grin tech G62 (more like the G63 windings), but Grin Tech g62 had the old jam nuts, so its kind of in between g62 and g63.

the grin tech G62 has the thermistor and speed signal going to the same wire, i think it was the white wire, and then the motor cable did not have any grey wire (bafang apparently wants to save pennies). I have found this to be true in basically every bafang motor cable, even if it SHOULD have a grey wire for the temperature, they omit that wire from the L1019 and L1121 connectors, there is only a white wire / no grey wire.

if you want to use a G62 + phaserunner and read the speed signal and temp on the same wire - what you can do is get a motor cable adapter, cut it in the middle, and cross the white wire to the grey wire, which is where the phaserunner expects to see the signals.

when i used VESC, with flipsky 75100 pro v2, I could not get the temperature reading to work correctly when it was also hooked up to the speed signal. So, for vesc, i usually go inside the motor, and cut the white wire, then hook a thermistor to GND and the white wire exiting the motor cable. So there is only the temp signal on the white wire. and speed in vesc can be calculated from the motor RPM and such.

In terms of phase amps, I ran my G62 6T for years on 90 phase amps and never had any problems, but after increasing phase amps to 105 I broke a nylon gear quite fast.

If you are riding in the snow , Yeah, you can over heat it quite easily!! I would turn the phase amps down.... I did a ride in the winter on a MTB trail crawling around very slowly and after this ride all my phase wires at the controller were cooked, almost failed !! I could smell something funny when i was riding around Lol

 

[OkinawaJapan]

Hey @Ebikebuilderyt @Boosted

What BMS amperage limit should I choose when having a battery made for me? I'm looking at ordering a new battery and wonder what would be best?

They are saying they can offer the internal frame battery type for my folding bike with 25A. Isn't that too low? Don't I need at least a 30A BMS on it for these motors?

I'm looking at ordering a 48v14Ah or 52v10Ah as that is all that will fit in my folding frame. They offer it with LG 3500 cells. Looks like the DCH-006-L430 length case will fit my frame.

Will be ordering the QS159.8 DD hub motor though instead of the Bafang for now to play with.

They are saying it comes with a 25A BMS but can change it to a 30A if I need for my controller. I'll be using a Baserunner L10 with it which can handle like 50A. But don't think I'll run that high.

I just commute up a big mountain and will do regen down it daily. 18 kilometers each way. So 36k per day.

I'm thinking of sticking with 48v for longer distance efficiency. But am considering going with 52v if you recommend it.

Motor Simulator - Tools

Our ebike motor simulator allows you to easily simulate the different performance characteristics of different ebike setups - with a wide selection of hub motors modeled, and the ability to add custom batteries and controllers and set a wide variety of vehicle parameters you'll be able to see...

ebikes.ca

It's looking like I need about 35A for a steep 20% grade mountain climb. Not that mine is quite that steep. But it is more than a kilometer long.

So if that's sustained amps, I guess I need a BMS that can handle 20% higher than that? So a 40 Amp BMS?

 

[Boosted]

Hey @Ebikebuilderyt @Boosted

What BMS amperage limit should I choose when having a battery made for me? I'm looking at ordering a new battery and wonder what would be best?

They are saying they can offer the internal frame battery type for my folding bike with 25A. Isn't that too low? Don't I need at least a 30A BMS on it for these motors?

I'm looking at ordering a 48v14Ah or 52v10Ah as that is all that will fit in my folding frame. They offer it with LG 3500 cells. Looks like the DCH-006-L430 length case will fit my frame.

Will be ordering the QS159.8 DD hub motor though instead of the Bafang for now to play with.

They are saying it comes with a 25A BMS but can change it to a 30A if I need for my controller. I'll be using a Baserunner L10 with it which can handle like 50A. But don't think I'll run that high.

I just commute up a big mountain and will do regen down it daily. 18 kilometers each way. So 36k per day.

I'm thinking of sticking with 48v for longer distance efficiency. But am considering going with 52v if you recommend it.

Motor Simulator - Tools

Our ebike motor simulator allows you to easily simulate the different performance characteristics of different ebike setups - with a wide selection of hub motors modeled, and the ability to add custom batteries and controllers and set a wide variety of vehicle parameters you'll be able to see...

ebikes.ca

It's looking like I need about 35A for a steep 20% grade mountain climb. Not that mine is quite that steep. But it is more than a kilometer long.

So if that's sustained amps, I guess I need a BMS that can handle 20% higher than that? So a 40 Amp BMS?

Hey @Ebikebuilderyt @Boosted

What BMS amperage limit should I choose when having a battery made for me? I'm looking at ordering a new battery and wonder what would be best?

They are saying they can offer the internal frame battery type for my folding bike with 25A. Isn't that too low? Don't I need at least a 30A BMS on it for these motors?

I'm looking at ordering a 48v14Ah or 52v10Ah as that is all that will fit in my folding frame. They offer it with LG 3500 cells. Looks like the DCH-006-L430 length case will fit my frame.

Will be ordering the QS159.8 DD hub motor though instead of the Bafang for now to play with.

They are saying it comes with a 25A BMS but can change it to a 30A if I need for my controller. I'll be using a Baserunner L10 with it which can handle like 50A. But don't think I'll run that high.

I just commute up a big mountain and will do regen down it daily. 18 kilometers each way. So 36k per day.

I'm thinking of sticking with 48v for longer distance efficiency. But am considering going with 52v if you recommend it.

Motor Simulator - Tools

Our ebike motor simulator allows you to easily simulate the different performance characteristics of different ebike setups - with a wide selection of hub motors modeled, and the ability to add custom batteries and controllers and set a wide variety of vehicle parameters you'll be able to see...

ebikes.ca

It's looking like I need about 35A for a steep 20% grade mountain climb. Not that mine is quite that steep. But it is more than a kilometer long.

So if that's sustained amps, I guess I need a BMS that can handle 20% higher than that? So a 40 Amp BMS?


View attachment 198405

I would worry less about the discharge and more about the capacity. If you have a 10AH battery for example with a 30a BMS that means it will run full power for 20 minutes. If you are going 30 kmh up this steep hill you are only going to make it 10km before you are out of battery. To add to that, many chinese batteries' capacities are overstated by 10-20%. Then you may have another 20% degradation over the first year or two. If this was the case you may only make it 6 km before running out of battery, even on a full charge. These numbers may be slightly exaggerated but you get the point.

Additionally chinese batteries are already usually maxed out or sometimes over spec'd on discharge to begin with. So a 30a discharge on a 10ah battery, is probably already more than whats safe, and might cause your battery to explode if running 30 amps continuous up a steep hill 18 km long, it also is possibly going to cause issues for your phase wires and possibly the motor itself overheating depending on the average and max grade of the hill.

I see lots of potential issues with this strategy. 18km long mountain hill climbs usually require more than a folding ebike with the cheapest components.

 

[OkinawaJapan]

Thanks guys. Great input shared.

Sorry, meant my commute is 18km long one way. With a 1km mountain climb in the middle. Then 18k home with a 1km down hill in the middle of that same mountain.

I don't plan to climb it at full speed, but did want to spec the bike as much as possible to handle it, that way I'm well within limits when going slower. Typically I'd probably only climb at like 15kph or so I think.

Okay. Sounds like these smaller internal battery cases intentionally come with 25A BMSs for a good reason. First of all being safety, and second of all to limit discharge to ensure range as their Ah is already low. Makes perfect sense now that you have given me some good perspective on it. Thank you.

They say they can only find up to a 30Amp BMS for it. Or the stock 25a. I guess I will ask for the 30amp and be happy at that. Perhaps keep my baserunner L10 set at only 25-27A max to be safe? Sound like a good plan?

In reviewing things here, I think I've found these great motors you've shared at great prices and I can just run them at a middle to low output for my commuting needs and come out way ahead over lower quality, lower power motors. So I'm still way ahead from having found and learned from your thread here and the great answers. Thank you.

I'm one who likes to learn what's optimal so I know the range within which to work and then also find the value spot. Then match it to myself for best value use case. Seems I've found it.

 

[Boosted]

Thanks guys. Great input shared.

Sorry, meant my commute is 18km long one way. With a 1km mountain climb in the middle. Then 18k home with a 1km down hill in the middle of that same mountain.

I don't plan to climb it at full speed, but did want to spec the bike as much as possible to handle it that way I'm well within limits when going slower. Typically I'd probably only climb at like 15kph or so I think.

Okay. Sounds like these smaller internal battery cases intentionally come with 25A BMSs for a good reason. First of all being safety, and second of all to limit discharge to ensure range as they Ah is already low. Makes perfect sense now that you have given me some good perspective on it. Thank you.

They say the can only find up to a 30Amp BMS for it. Or the stock 25a. I guess I will ask for the 30amp and be happy at that. Perhaps keep my baserunner L10 set at only 25-27A max to be safe? Sound like a good plan?

In reviewing things here, I think I've found these great motors you've shared at great prices and I can just run them at a middle to low output for my commuting needs and come out way ahead over lower quality, lower power motors. So I'm still way ahead from having found and learned from your thread here and the great answers. Thank you.

I'm one who likes to learn what's optimal so I know the range within which to work and then also fine the value spot. Then match it to myself for best value use case. Seems I've found it.

Big difference between 18km hill climb and 18km ride with 1km hill climb. You might be okay then. Even still a 36km round trip is a lot to ask from a 520 w/h battery. You can use the grin sim to help estimate range with your setup but I still am not sure you could make the commute on a battery that small. My recommendation would be the largest capacity battery you can find (48v/14ah) but even still, not sure that would be enough.

If you are only running 48v 25a (around 1200w) and not riding on anything crazy steep, a G062 may work fine for you. A G062 (or any geared motor) is run OEM, by many bike manufacturers, the reason is they produce MORE power output, and more efficiency than direct drive motors. Take your pick but a G062 will give slightly more range than a direct drive, the regen braking doesnt make a huge difference.

G062: More power output and torque (for the same input). More efficiency (more range).
QS159.8 Direct Drive: Silent (no noise). No gears/clutch/keys more durable. Regen capable. Can handle a little more power, especially with statorade. Has built-in temp sensor, and can fit larger phase wires.

If you happen to have any more non G062 related questions, feel free to PM.