Re-greasing the Ultra motor...is it time?

Deacon Blues said:
I went for a 35km ride today and the motor is definitely quieter.
Archer wireless shifter works great.....I've just got to remember to turn the damn thing on. :p
Click to expand...

Deacon Blues said:
I agree-the X1 is overkill (for me). Going into sport mode is like hitting the hyperdrive button. It's fun once in the while, but for the most part I'm happy riding in eco levels 1,2, & 3.
If I eventually have to replace my UC Pro's X1 motor it will probably be with a stock motor, since no one seems to know how to calibrate the motor after a rotor gear swap.
Click to expand...
Thought I'd seen it and the information's in Archon X1 Programming Thread (questions and experiences)
To calibrate you have to run "X1TOOL" in the "release" folder.
And, on the "controller" tab of the dealer version of the X1 Tool, there's a button labeled "detect encoder".
And it can be done with a besst tool which detects the controller. Video on that here.

Fn'F
 
Deacon Blues said:
I don't know what this hacked USB tool is.
Click to expand...
This Feanteek TD chip.
You must open the dongle and solder the incoming yellow and red wires together.
I made one. My beef was the cable's a bit short to reach my laptop on the bench.
I tested last June and it worked. Reset a few things in SP modes on the throttle side.
Then it hit me why not just solder the Y and R wires together using a bafang 5 wire (green plug) extension cable?

Things with chips, getting weird so I bought two. Soldered one jumped internally, the other I made a cord for.
(I'd thought you had gone into the programming?)
I have the files for the X1tool Bypass Login.
It's still there in replies to things evixone said, but not the posts themselves. Reconstruct backwards from there - hehehehe - there he is. EBR may have purged the information. Maybe evixone took it down. It is a hacking tool. Go through the thread you'll see.
May 8th, pg. 14, evixone said:
Hi everyone,
after many many hours analyzing the X1tool I finally managed to unlock the advanced features.
You can now set the max power to 3500w and the motor current to 100A.
Be careful with the settings, the motor as well as the transmission elements will be used harder.
For the battery current setting you need to know the continuous current it can give.
In the Controller tab you have the "detect encoder" function in order to recalibrate the Hall sensor and the magnet, to touch only in case of complete disassembly of the motor.

Enjoy!

I saved all the zip files.
Completely bypasses the login - even for upgrading to 3000watts. That's full privilege's.
The irony is Krasnodar (innotrace) was screwing everyone, not allowing even basic access to X1 tuning.
He'd already been paid for those rights - we found a way to obtain them. Now, full access is open source.
I pass the files on for informational purposes. They're useless to non-X1 owners.

PM me if you need any assistance w/ obtaining the dongle/ cord.

Fn'F
 
scrambler said:
?? 13:31 is the end of the video....
Click to expand...
Dang. My bad. This video at 3:28 >.
Waterproof stuff in action.
I see there's a new, new rotor gear available - steel like the last but with more teeth.
Geenbike's pumping it. They say it's an upgrade from Bafang, but I can't find in PRC sales.
I'll stick with Rome's Mobil solution - unless I figure out a 'splash oil bath' set-up, using typical grade transfer case lube and 'change lube, not gears'.
That's likely more simple than it sounds.
Using Covered Wagon axle grease on a 21'st Century, state of-the-art Ultra performance motor makes me cringe.
My ancestor's Buffalo lard would do that.
While using a slow-cooker to melt wax w/ ptfe is nice, I suspect creating my (proprietary) chain/ gear lube, suspended in a high molecular weight refined paraffin carrier is magnitudes better.
I'll release the formula open-source when I'm certain.
Anyone w/ a rudimentary industrial inorganic chem background can do it.

20200724_185051[1].jpg


A bit of hassle to refine the high molecular paraffin distillate. It's (maybe at best) 1 in 1,000,000 of the molecules in commercial high grade purified paraffin, but I'm seeking a shellac finish hardness to encapsulate a lithium soap and there's no other choice I know of.

Fn'F
 
For christ sake... Grease it with readily available grease like the rest of the industrial world greases everything.
Like whatever you come up with would be better in anycase.
It's a simple electric motor with basic gearing designed for daily use... It's not going to the moon or going to last one minute longer no matter what you convince yourself of.
 
Mobil red grease is what I use. I have spare M620 already pre greased with new gears ready to install before end of the year and rebuild the existing one which has a little over 5k miles accumulated from riding almost everyday.
 
Rome said:
Mobil red grease is what I use. I have spare M620 already pre greased with new gears ready to install before end of the year and rebuild the existing one which has a little over 5k miles accumulated from riding almost everyday.
Click to expand...
Any thoughts on it vs corn head (temperature, datasheet performance)? I put corn head in my new motor as I saw that listed in the forum. Did not pack it super tight as someone criticized another poster for doing that (though I am slightly worried not packing will allow the grease to be flung off/flow away from the gears). So far (~200miles) it has made the motor much much quieter, similar in noise to my wife's Brose motor.

If no no worries just curious to learn.

Edit: I will not be making grease or lube :D
 
 

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The new 'noise reducing' gear replacement does look interesting but I've read no reports of just how much the noise level is reduced when compared to the old gears. It looks like 2023 sourced Ultra motors have the 'new' gears (did I read that correctly?) A side-by-side noise comparison of factory 'old' gears vs the factory new 'quieter' gears would be helpful to see if the new gears really do significantly reduce motor noise. Anyone have a motor with 2023 gears? Unless the gears are worn out, the cost doesn't justify switching just to reduce motor noise. Properly greasing the gears is a better choice. Read below for my experience with noise and re-greasing.

Last year with about 400 mi on the Rize RX Ultra (Canbus), I decided to open the motor and see if it needed grease. I had read about the lack of grease and also felt the motor noise was excessive. I decided to try the red Mobile grease. Yes, the motor was quieter right away. This week, with the motor at 1600 mi I decided to re-grease the gears. The noise had returned to a level I was no longer comfortable with and was curious about the condition of the Mobile red. Opening the motor revealed that some of the red grease had turned brown and some had migrated to the sides of the motor case and away from the gears. After a thorough cleaning (between teeth and all), I decided to use the Cornhead grease. It is very gooey and clingy, coats the gears well! Today, after a 20mi ride, my unofficial (no decibel meter readings here) assessment is that the Cornhead made the motor significantly quieter. Having compared the Mobile and Cornhead, they both work, but I like the viscosity of the Cornhead better. Pick your poison!
 
Slick50 said:
After a thorough cleaning (between teeth and all), I decided to use the Cornhead grease. It is very gooey and clingy, coats the gears well! Today, after a 20mi ride, my unofficial (no decibel meter readings here) assessment is that the Cornhead made the motor significantly quieter. Having compared the Mobile and Cornhead, they both work, but I like the viscosity of the Cornhead better. Pick your poison!
Click to expand...
I installed Cornhead grease (heavily) in my Ultra in July of 22'. Noticed a 70% reduction in noise. Reopend the motor in May 2023, plenty of grease in the motor and on the gears. Packed it again with more fresh grease. Runnning smoothly, very little noise.
 
Slick50 said:
The new 'noise reducing' gear replacement does look interesting but I've read no reports of just how much the noise level is reduced when compared to the old gears. It looks like 2023 sourced Ultra motors have the 'new' gears (did I read that correctly?) A side-by-side noise comparison of factory 'old' gears vs the factory new 'quieter' gears would be helpful to see if the new gears really do significantly reduce motor noise. Anyone have a motor with 2023 gears? Unless the gears are worn out, the cost doesn't justify switching just to reduce motor noise. Properly greasing the gears is a better choice. Read below for my experience with noise and re-greasing.

Last year with about 400 mi on the Rize RX Ultra (Canbus), I decided to open the motor and see if it needed grease. I had read about the lack of grease and also felt the motor noise was excessive. I decided to try the red Mobile grease. Yes, the motor was quieter right away. This week, with the motor at 1600 mi I decided to re-grease the gears. The noise had returned to a level I was no longer comfortable with and was curious about the condition of the Mobile red. Opening the motor revealed that some of the red grease had turned brown and some had migrated to the sides of the motor case and away from the gears. After a thorough cleaning (between teeth and all), I decided to use the Cornhead grease. It is very gooey and clingy, coats the gears well! Today, after a 20mi ride, my unofficial (no decibel meter readings here) assessment is that the Cornhead made the motor significantly quieter. Having compared the Mobile and Cornhead, they both work, but I like the viscosity of the Cornhead better. Pick your poison!
Click to expand...
I'd think that manufacturer wouldn't go through the trouble of putting out an upgraded gear set if there wasn't an improvement... But then again we are talking Bafang 🙃

I'd be curious to know your thoughts after another 1600mi using corn head.
 
I'm not gonna open my motor again but helical gears 9t vs 15t?
I don't know what I have.
 
I have a new motor, purchased 2023. I did not check the number of teeth on the gear, so I do not know if I have have the 15 tooth version. I also greased it with cornhead. It is tons quieter as I said, but I had not greased my old motor with cornhead, so it is hard to compare.

I have noticed on my usual commute power consumption seems to be down significantly. I usually start out at 56.6 volts (85%) on my 52v battery and burn down to ~45-47 volts. With the new motor I have been coming back with 49-50 volts in the pack.
 
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Data sheet performance graphs is not for me you can be anal about your methods of ebike maintenance.
Just ride the fucking thing till some things break.
 
I have to admit these motors are powerful and fun motor.
I'm fine tuning my pedal rpm and throttle use.
 
Ok.... My turn @ 1400mi.
First try I had to retreat as the chain ring lock nut wouldn't budge and after 10 minutes of putting all my spaghetti arms had in them.. I warped the p.o.s flat wrench that Bafang provides with the BBS02B.
Ordered this 1/2 drive Socket
PXL_20240129_200504712.jpg
which arrived in 10 days and I spun off the lock nut in 5 seconds.

PXL_20240129_201534694.jpg


There was fair amount of factory grease.... at least more than I've seen in other pics.
PXL_20240129_203832480.jpg


Cleaned it up nicey nice...
PXL_20240129_221749958.jpg

I'd say I added back about double the factory amount. Basically I lightly coated all surfaces and packed between the teeth of all the gears. I used Mobil SHC100 because I had almost a full tube on hand left over from my BBS02B. Additionally I've read it's similar to the factory grease and less chance of contamination from grease incompatibility if any remnants exist.
My gasket looked just as good as the two replacement ones I had on hand so I didn't change it this time around.

One things no one mentioned in any of the videos I watched...
Careful with this ring that sits on top of the large gear bearing as it's delicate. Mine fell off when I split the case open leaving me not sure where it went.
PXL_20240130_153057644.jpg


On assembly I sat it on the controller side and held it in place with a thin coating of grease.
PXL_20240130_153114847.jpg


Now for the results...
I went for about a 20mi ride and it was noticeably smoother with less micro vibrations. As for the noise that too was noticeably less, especially at low power output.. Almost silent say below 100w. At higher output the sound changed to a deeper more pleasing tone then before but was still pretty audible. Went from a GRrrr sound to more of a RRrrr sound. Or from a super charged electric can opener to a high end stand mixer.
Didn't get arrested during any of this.... So I guess it was time well spent 🙃
 

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