Last place?

[FlatSix911]

What's our wisdom on this? It looks like Specialized has some work to do here.
Experience tells me there will be a strong urge to shoot the messenger. I hope we can do better than that, as enlightened as we are.

Spring 2020 Ebike Reliability Survey Results

Here are the results of the first ever Ebike Test Lab Reliability Survey, which we plan to do every Spring and Fall moving forward. The rankings are based solely on the survey responses. An algorithm was developed to take into account the total number of miles, number of failures, severity of...

electricbikereview.com

Thanks for sharing... unfortunately, Specialized has suffered with reliability because they have pushed the limit on custom technology.

The result has been a number of documented motor and belt drive issues, electronic control problems and stress fractures in frames.
Other manufactures have been more cautious in development and as a result have lower failure rates per mile. Bleeding edge has a risk.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

What about the Trek Verve +3, compared to the Como?

To be totally honest, I can only discuss the Vado

@Sierratim, thank you for explain the Kool-Aid. Anyone can try a large glass of Golden Spiced Rum (1/3) with some sort of Red Bull (2/3). Probably as good as Kool-Aid. Yet I was sober when I wrote my praise of the Vado!

P.S. Only 4 users responded to the WattWagon poll, and those must have been biased.

 

[Phyz]

What about the Trek Verve +3, compared to the Como?

I was looking at the Verve+ 3 and still think it’s got a lot to like. I’m now leaning hard toward the Vado 4.0. Take a look at the EBR review of the Vado 4.0: there’s even more to like.

 

[Sierratim]

What about the Trek Verve +3, compared to the Como?

I don't own either of these bikes, but I do see some obvious differences in the manufacturers' specs. I'm comparing the Como 3 to the Verge+ 3 as they are very close in price.

Motor torque:
Como 85Nm (not on Como 3 page, but quoted elsewhere)
Verve 50Nm

Gearing:
Como 11-42t 10 spd with Deore Shadow Plus derailleur, 40t front ring
Verve 11-36t 9 spd with Alivo T4000 derailleur, 38t front ring

Front & Rear Hub:
Como 15mm (front) & 12mm (rear) through axles
Verve 5mm quick-release skewers

Brakes:
Como Shimano MT200 with 180mm (front) & 160mm (rear) rotors
Verve Shimano MT200 hydraulic with 160mm rotors

Charger:
Como Specialized 4A charger
Verve Bosh 2A charger

Light:
Como Herrmans MR8, 180lm output
Verve Herrmans MR4-E, 120 lm output

Fenders & Rack:
Como none
Verve included

I'm sure there are other differences, but these would get me to consider the Como over the Verge.

 

[Johnmj1]

I don't own either of these bikes, but I do see some obvious differences in the manufacturers' specs. I'm comparing the Como 3 to the Verge+ 3 as they are very close in price.

Motor torque:
Como 85Nm (not on Como 3 page, but quoted elsewhere)
Verve 50Nm

Gearing:
Como 11-42t 10 spd with Deore Shadow Plus derailleur, 40t front ring
Verve 11-36t 9 spd with Alivo T4000 derailleur, 38t front ring

Front & Rear Hub:
Como 15mm (front) & 12mm (rear) through axles
Verve 5mm quick-release skewers

Brakes:
Como Shimano MT200 with 180mm (front) & 160mm (rear) rotors
Verve Shimano MT200 hydraulic with 160mm rotors

Charger:
Como Specialized 4A charger
Verve Bosh 2A charger

Light:
Como Herrmans MR8, 180lm output
Verve Herrmans MR4-E, 120 lm output

Fenders & Rack:
Como none
Verve included

I'm sure there are other differences, but these would get me to consider the Como over the Verge.

Thanks!

 

[pmcdonald]

Thanks for sharing... unfortunately, Specialized has suffered with reliability because they have pushed the limit on custom technology.

The result has been a number of documented motor and belt drive issues, electronic control problems and stress fractures in frames.
Other manufactures have been more cautious in development and as a result have lower failure rates per mile. Bleeding edge has a risk.

Interesting argument. About a decade ago the VW name was mud here in Australia for a similar reason. They produced beautifully refined, economical cars at family prices but were plagued by serious, serious reliability issues. Super AND turbocharged engines and dual clutch transmissions were ticking time bombs, with the similar argument that they were just over-engineered. I'm not sure if you had similar issues in the northern hemisphere? A common refrain was 'Oh, bought a new VW did you? Not planning on holding on to it past warranty are you?'. We actually own a Mk7 Golf and, touch wood, it has been reliable to date. There is the niggling thought in the back of my mind that when something does go wrong out of warranty it's going to be expensive. Sublime road manners though.

The Vado was on my shortlist a few months back, although it was a little out of my price range. The one dealer in my region (an urban area of 500k) is more MTB focused, so it was scratched because they didn't stock the Vado or even sound very familiar with what it was . These survey results would have given me serious pause at the time. I still think they're damn sexy bikes though (those and the Allants).

 

[steve mercier]

I don't own either of these bikes, but I do see some obvious differences in the manufacturers' specs. I'm comparing the Como 3 to the Verge+ 3 as they are very close in price.

Motor torque:
Como 85Nm (not on Como 3 page, but quoted elsewhere)
Verve 50Nm

Gearing:
Como 11-42t 10 spd with Deore Shadow Plus derailleur, 40t front ring
Verve 11-36t 9 spd with Alivo T4000 derailleur, 38t front ring

Front & Rear Hub:
Como 15mm (front) & 12mm (rear) through axles
Verve 5mm quick-release skewers

Brakes:
Como Shimano MT200 with 180mm (front) & 160mm (rear) rotors
Verve Shimano MT200 hydraulic with 160mm rotors

Charger:
Como Specialized 4A charger
Verve Bosh 2A charger

Light:
Como Herrmans MR8, 180lm output
Verve Herrmans MR4-E, 120 lm output

Fenders & Rack:
Como none
Verve included

I'm sure there are other differences, but these would get me to consider the Como over the Verge.

I have trouble believing that 85 Nm. It seems high compared to other bike ratings. Of course If you gave me the choice I might take the Como ,but I still really like the Verve . The Como 3 in the LBS comes in at $100 cheaper than the Verve 3. Como has no fenders and rack. The Como has a faster charger. Como in the LBS has the same 11-36T and an Alivio and uses Tektro brakes. These bikes are very similar in many ways but there is no denying the Como has more torque which would likely seal the deal for me.

 

[Sierratim]

Interesting argument. About a decade ago the VW name was mud here in Australia for a similar reason. They produced beautifully refined, economical cars at family prices but were plagued by serious, serious reliability issues. Super AND turbocharged engines and dual clutch transmissions were ticking time bombs, with the similar argument that they were just over-engineered. I'm not sure if you had similar issues in the northern hemisphere? A common refrain was 'Oh, bought a new VW did you? Not planning on holding on to it past warranty are you?'. We actually own a Mk7 Golf and, touch wood, it has been reliable to date. There is the niggling thought in the back of my mind that when something does go wrong out of warranty it's going to be expensive. Sublime road manners though.

The Vado was on my shortlist a few months back, although it was a little out of my price range. The one dealer in my region (an urban area of 500k) is more MTB focused, so it was scratched because they didn't stock the Vado or even sound very familiar with what it was . These survey results would have given me serious pause at the time. I still think they're damn sexy bikes though (those and the Allants).

I do enjoy the "phrase-ology" you find on these blogs. The Aussie 'touch wood' is 'knock on wood' here in the States and 'niggling thought' would be 'nagging thought'.

In our younger years we had a young English lady stay with us for a year when out twins were born. It took some translation to communicate in presumably the same language. Am I safe in assuming that everyone knows what a nappie is?

 

[Sierratim]

I have trouble believing that 85 Nm. It seems high compared to other bike ratings. Of course If you gave me the choice I might take the Como ,but I still really like the Verve . The Como 3 in the LBS comes in at $100 cheaper than the Verve 3 . Como had no fenders and rack. The Como has a faster charger. Como has the same 11-36T and an Alivio and uses Tektro brakes. These bikes are very similar in many ways but there is no denying the Como has more torque which would likely seal the deal for me.

OK, but I found several online references to this spec for the 1.2 motor. My Vado 1.3 motor has a 90nm spec. Have you found other sepcs I might have missed?

 

[steve mercier]

OK, but I found several online references to this spec for the 1.2 motor. My Vado 1.3 motor has a 90nm spec. Have you found other sepcs I might have missed?

No I believe you Sierratim. Never mind me talking through my hat. I need to spend less time typing and more time pedaling.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Specialized/Brose motors are silent and torquey, Steve. The only problem is Canada doesn't allow Class 3 e-bikes. I sympathise.

 

[PDoz]

. Am I safe in assuming that everyone knows what a nappie is?

No worries , we enjoy a short sleep

 

[Sierratim]

No worries , we enjoy a short sleep

Ah, there's the rub in trying to communicate with our young English lady. To me, a nappie could be a short sleep. To her, nappie = baby diaper, which our twins used a lot of.

 

[harryS]

On a less light hearted note, "Drinking the Kool AId" comes originally from the Jim Jones cult debacle in Guyana where 900 followers died after they willingly took it mixed with cyanide per instructions from Jones. Jones shot himself.

 

[Feliz]

Ah, there's the rub in trying to communicate with our young English lady. To me, a nappie could be a short sleep. To her, nappie = baby diaper, which our twins used a lot of.

Some old people also wear nappies..............just saying

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Some old people also wear nappies..............just saying

Or chamois, if we're at it

 

[Captain Slow]

Geez, I sure hope that I don't have problems with the Creo. It is an expensive bike. I'm hoping the problems are with the older Brose system that I've read about and hopefully unrelated to what I have. I'll have to keep my fingers crossed.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

"Let's worry when the problem occurs".
Probably more people die from worries than from illnesses...