If you already own an e-bike, are you considering another?

[dblhelix]

There is always a next bike.

Right now, I'm thinking pretty seriously about getting a Bike Friday, probably a Diamond Llama with a Rohloff Hub. That bike solves a couple of specific problems that the R&M Charger does not:

• Taking the Charger on public transportation, whether by bus, train, or plane, is at best problematic and at worst flat-out impossible.
• Having a bike I can take with me when I visit the city and can easily take with me into a store rather than stress about securing it.
• There are some bicycle tours I'd like to do where the e-bike is at best a liability and at worst forces rather contrived routing changes.

For long-haul adventure riding, one day I'd like to own a Co-Motion Siskiyou.

Down the road, if I were to replace the Charger I'd like to get my hands on a 20mph Kogo E-World Traveler. I understand they sell a dual-battery version.

To your first point: I no longer own a Charger, but when I did I had no problem with the DC Metro (subway) or Amtrak. I even used roll-on with tires > 2” wide. I was told by the baggage handlers that they’ve put larger bikes with wider tires on the train.

I 100% agree with the sentiment that the RM feels cumbersome at times, but my point here is that it isn’t a deal-killer in and of itself— the darn thing is pretty sturdy on the roads and surprisingly exceeded my off-road expectations.

I also was told my a metro bus driver that the front bus racks would support the Charger. I didn’t want to test this w/o more evidence but haven’t done so as I don’t take the bus much.

Other public transit ventures with an RM: Baltimore light rail, Vamoose NYC-DC express bus (too many to count) SF ferry, Lake Express (Milwaukee-Muskegon, MI) (twice).
To your second point, my experience has been that a no-bike policy applies to all bikes, irrespective of size.

I don’t understand your third point and hope you elaborate. I have over 3k miles in on a cross-country tour and recently replicated a 5-state portion originally biked in 2013 with a non-electric bike. No route changes, same route.

Now, one element of ebike touring that feels contrived is the amount of time I spend charging, even using two chargers simultaneously. This is particularly severe for a Bosch bike sold in the US with no access to the 6A fast Charger.

More data to follow once trip is complete.

 

[jim6b]

"If you already own an e-bike, are you considering another?"

Heap. Something that weighs 20 lbs less and still has a motor.

 

[Mr. Coffee]

To your first point: I no longer own a Charger, but when I did I had no problem with the DC Metro (subway) or Amtrak. I even used roll-on with tires > 2” wide. I was told by the baggage handlers that they’ve put larger bikes with wider tires on the train.

I 100% agree with the sentiment that the RM feels cumbersome at times, but my point here is that it isn’t a deal-killer in and of itself— the darn thing is pretty sturdy on the roads and surprisingly exceeded my off-road expectations.

I also was told my a metro bus driver that the front bus racks would support the Charger. I didn’t want to test this w/o more evidence but haven’t done so as I don’t take the bus much.

Other public transit ventures with an RM: Baltimore light rail, Vamoose NYC-DC express bus (too many to count) SF ferry, Lake Express (Milwaukee-Muskegon, MI) (twice).
To your second point, my experience has been that a no-bike policy applies to all bikes, irrespective of size.

I don’t understand your third point and hope you elaborate. I have over 3k miles in on a cross-country tour and recently replicated a 5-state portion originally biked in 2013 with a non-electric bike. No route changes, same route.

Now, one element of ebike touring that feels contrived is the amount of time I spend charging, even using two chargers simultaneously. This is particularly severe for a Bosch bike sold in the US with no access to the 6A fast Charger.

More data to follow once trip is complete.

I've had very poor luck on taking my bike on the train both on the Amtrak Empire Builder and Amtrak Cascades route. This, I think, is largely because there is only room for ten bicycles per train.

Similarly, I am 0 for 3 on using Oregon Point Intercity buses which are limited to 3 bikes per bus and every bus driver I talked to wasn't okay with the Charger. Strangely, the local bus service doesn't seem to have a problem accommodating my bike.

I am looking at several long-ish trips in Northern Nevada, Southeastern Oregon, and Central BC where there are long sections without any services, few developed campgrounds, and even fewer hotels. So it makes it challenging to come up with a route that will work and won't involve either carrying an insane number of batteries or bizarre and complex detours to get to someplace to charge the bike. A similar situation (though not as extreme) exists on the eastern parts of the Palouse to Cascades trail in far Eastern Washington (I find it bizarre that Lind has Combine Demolition Derbies but does not feature any place to stay or camp).

 

[Cowlitz]

Lind needs to get their act together. It would be an opportunity for more business in their town if they promoted it and had a camping area, with showers. Other little burgs along the trail also ought to be exploring possibilities.

 

[dblhelix]

I've had very poor luck on taking my bike on the train both on the Amtrak Empire Builder and Amtrak Cascades route. This, I think, is largely because there is only room for ten bicycles per train.

Similarly, I am 0 for 3 on using Oregon Point Intercity buses which are limited to 3 bikes per bus and every bus driver I talked to wasn't okay with the Charger. Strangely, the local bus service doesn't seem to have a problem accommodating my bike.

I am looking at several long-ish trips in Northern Nevada, Southeastern Oregon, and Central BC where there are long sections without any services, few developed campgrounds, and even fewer hotels. So it makes it challenging to come up with a route that will work and won't involve either carrying an insane number of batteries or bizarre and complex detours to get to someplace to charge the bike. A similar situation (though not as extreme) exists on the eastern parts of the Palouse to Cascades trail in far Eastern Washington (I find it bizarre that Lind has Combine Demolition Derbies but does not feature any place to stay or camp).

I just did the norther Nevada “Western Express” route (mainly Rt 50), and it was a problem-free experience. Feel free to DM if questions on specifics. I only dipped into a 3rd battery here and there and probably could have avoided it if more judicious regarding riding mode. The biggest battery drain was Austin Pass after Austin.


Regarding Amtrak, I have found what works for me is that I show up for in advance to discuss what I need to do to work with Amtrak’s rules/regs. Preparedness is really appreciated, I have found. I have offered to deflate, swap out to 2” and get waved off. I have found that it’s all about attitude. It never hurts to tip an especially helpful Amtrak employee. I can’t say whether it’s my approach or dumb luck, but things have worked well for me on Amtrak.

 

[dblhelix]

I've had very poor luck on taking my bike on the train both on the Amtrak Empire Builder and Amtrak Cascades route. This, I think, is largely because there is only room for ten bicycles per train.

Similarly, I am 0 for 3 on using Oregon Point Intercity buses which are limited to 3 bikes per bus and every bus driver I talked to wasn't okay with the Charger. Strangely, the local bus service doesn't seem to have a problem accommodating my bike.

I am looking at several long-ish trips in Northern Nevada, Southeastern Oregon, and Central BC where there are long sections without any services, few developed campgrounds, and even fewer hotels. So it makes it challenging to come up with a route that will work and won't involve either carrying an insane number of batteries or bizarre and complex detours to get to someplace to charge the bike. A similar situation (though not as extreme) exists on the eastern parts of the Palouse to Cascades trail in far Eastern Washington (I find it bizarre that Lind has Combine Demolition Derbies but does not feature any place to stay or camp).

If you look closely, you should find the R&M haha

When I get home I’ll be putting up more details on self-supported ebike touring on a trip blog. Some additional photos will be posted on my Instagram account @lbc2bk

Over the winter months I expect these accounts to be focused on ironing out some of the issues I encountered. Not sure if this will be possible with Bosch, but will be my first try because the motor reliability has been fantastic. Not a hiccup.

 

[DaveMatthews]

Yes I would like to add a R+M Load but only with lottery winnings. Also I would replace my Charger with a smaller frame. The one I have is slighty too large for me. Since I always carry 2-3 batteries I would consider a Delite but I love my Charger for touring. While we are fantasizing about more bikes, toss me in a Norco Sight VLT1. I need this because I live at the feet of Burke and Eagle mtns. Both mountains are loaded with downhill singletracks like this , most of which I no longer have the motor skills to attempt. This is a blue run ,but for me it would be a double black diamond..

I would have high-sided at least 4 times on that run.

 

[Ricky]

I have 4000 miles on a Diamondback Lindau e-bike and I love it and it works as well as the day I bought it. I then bought an iZip Moda last year and have 1000 miles on it. I love it more and would highly recommend it. The Lindau works great as a commuter bike and biking by myself. However, it doesn't work well when going on bike rides with other people. The Moda is amazing because it is the most natural feeling e-bike I have ever ridden. I can ride with anyone and feel like Lance Armstrong riding it.

I also test drove a Specialized Turbo Vado on vacation. Basically any bike with a Brose drive system is amazing. Natural, smooth, quiet mid-drive system. If it holds up well, I think it is an ideal bike.

I have put in a suspension seatpost on both bikes and HIGHLY recommend it. I use the Suntour NCX and love it.

That being said, it is possible a better bike could appear and I am on the lookout.

 

[Trail Cruiser]

I am now on my ebike #5 and ebike #6. Ebikes #1 thru #4 were already sold. Lately, I haven't used my ebikes that often since I have limited free time and sometimes my only free time is night time.

So I spent more time lately on my Peloton exercise bike with all the fancy metrics (power meter, speed, distance, calories, heart rate monitor, cadence, etc..) while browsing the internet at the same time.

 

[Ricky]

I am now on my ebike #5 and ebike #6. Ebikes #1 thru #4 were already sold. Lately, I haven't used my ebikes that often since I have limited free time and sometimes my only free time is night time.

So I spent more time lately on my Peloton exercise bike with all the fancy metrics (power meter, speed, distance, calories, heart rate monitor, cadence, etc..) while browsing the internet at the same time.

So inquiring minds must ask. What were e-bikes 1-4 and what are 5 and 6 and why?

 

[FlatSix911]

I am now on my ebike #5 and ebike #6. Ebikes #1 thru #4 were already sold. Lately, I haven't used my ebikes that often since I have limited free time and sometimes my only free time is night time.

So I spent more time lately on my Peloton exercise bike with all the fancy metrics (power meter, speed, distance, calories, heart rate monitor, cadence, etc..) while browsing the internet at the same time.
View attachment 37655

I guess you could consider your Peloton eBike #7!

 

[Trail Cruiser]

So inquiring minds must ask. What were e-bikes 1-4 and what are 5 and 6 and why?

Ebike#1 = mid 2000 chinese 20 incher folding ebike, throttle only. Top speed was only something like 15 mph. Sold it and bought
ebike#2 = late 2000 Rayos ebike (also throttle only). I machine fabricated the motor sprocket to increase top speed from 18 mph to 26 mph.
ebike #3 = 2015 Izip E3 Dash (a hot rod).
ebike #4 = Left over 2015 Raleigh Tekoa (also a hot rod but not as fast as the Dash).
I later sold my ebike#2 and then bought
ebike #5 = Luna Giant full suspension ebike with 1000 watt BBSHD and 52volt battery.
By that time, I also bought the Peloton exercise bike.
I later sold ebikes #3 and ebike#4 and bought
ebike #6 = Magnum metro plus.

For now, I am riding on my Peloton while typing this post.

 

[steve mercier]

Ebike#1 = mid 2000 chinese 20 incher folding ebike, throttle only. Top speed was only something like 15 mph. Sold it and bought
ebike#2 = late 2000 Rayos ebike (also throttle only). I machine fabricated the motor sprocket to increase top speed from 18 mph to 26 mph.
ebike #3 = 2015 Izip E3 Dash (a hot rod).
ebike #4 = Left over 2015 Raleigh Tekoa (also a hot rod but not as fast as the Dash).
I later sold my ebike#2 and then bought
ebike #5 = Luna Giant full suspension ebike with 1000 watt BBSHD and 52volt battery.
By that time, I also bought the Peloton exercise bike.
I later sold ebikes #3 and ebike#4 and bought
ebike #6 = Magnum metro plus.

For now, I am riding on my Peloton while typing this post.

Very interesting. My only question is why you wanted the Magnum metro when you aleady have the Luna which seems superior to all the other bikes in your brood? My guess is the fenders, lights and rack?

 

[Trail Cruiser]

Very interesting. My only question is why you wanted the Magnum metro when you aleady have the Luna which seems superior to all the other bikes in your brood? My guess is the fenders, lights and rack?

Fenders and lights are not the main reason. It's the ability to spin at high cadence and low effort that suits well with my sensitive knees. I also missed the feeling of my old ebikes that were throttle-only. The motor can do it's thing independently while I pedal at my own preferred pace.

Current more sophisticated ebikes with torque sensors forces you to pedal with pressure if you want more power. Good if you are already fit and you knees are still strong. However, that is counter productive to my aging knees, I would rather pedal faster but with less force.

The good thing about my mid drive BBSHD (on my other ebike) is that the 52 volt moves the operating cadence range to a higher RPM.

 

[tomjasz]

Current more sophisticated ebikes with torque sensors forces you to pedal with pressure if you want more power. Good if you are already fit and you knees are still strong. However, that is counter productive to my aging knees, I would rather pedal faster but with less force.

Exactly why us older fellas, not so able, do so well the a simple PAS feature. I still keep my legs moving and get SOME exercise, but get good movement and positive results even when “clown pedaling.”

 

[Ricky]

That sounds a lot why I have 2 e-bikes.

My Diamondback Lindau fits the description of your Magnum Metro in that it is rear hub drive with cadence only sensor. It is the best bike for commuting on a hot humid day because it does its thing and I spin at a high rate and choose the gear to choose how much work I put in. However, this bike does not work well for going for a bike ride with other people as it tends to go the speed it wants to go.

My iZip Moda (center drive with torque sensing) is perfect for riding with other people as it feels very much like a regular bike and works just like a non e-bike except that hills are not nearly as much effort. I am liking this bike more and more, but both bikes have their place.

 

[Cowlitz]

My pickup broke down at the half way point home on my trip to buy ebike number 2. The diagnosis is a wheel bearing went bad in the pickup. So, I have been using my bike as my means of transportation. Number 2 is a Gazelle Arroyo and has me going along at a faster clip without the numb hands--so far, and gives me a smoother ride. I find myself using a lower power level on it also. It does not go up the really steep hill as easily as the Radmini, but it still goes up the hill.

I'll be using the Radmini for riding on dirt and gravel roads.

Now I need to bike to the grocery.

 

[Trail Cruiser]

That sounds a lot why I have 2 e-bikes.

My Diamondback Lindau fits the description of your Magnum Metro in that it is rear hub drive with cadence only sensor. It is the best bike for commuting on a hot humid day because it does its thing and I spin at a high rate and choose the gear to choose how much work I put in. However, this bike does not work well for going for a bike ride with other people as it tends to go the speed it wants to go.

My iZip Moda (center drive with torque sensing) is perfect for riding with other people as it feels very much like a regular bike and works just like a non e-bike except that hills are not nearly as much effort. I am liking this bike more and more, but both bikes have their place.

We have the same arrangement. My hub motored magnum does not do well on group rides since it has its own speed range and I had to continuously change the assist level just to be in the group. if it's going up a hill, I leave the group behind and if it's going downhill, I have to up the assist level to catch up with the group. On the other hand, I can free spin as much as I want, and shifting from one gear to the next is so easy and drama free. Crossing intersections in the hub drive is so easy, safe, and quick.

In contrast, I can just leave it to one setting in my mid drive BBSHD and I can keep up at the same pace with a bunch of lycras. That's why I keep the 2 ebikes. One is for easy and carefree solo ride. The other is for group rides or semi competitive rides.

 

[GregGritton]

Number 2 is a Gazelle Arroyo....

I'll be using the Radmini for riding on dirt and gravel roads.

I have a Gazelle Arroyo and find that it does well on dirt and gravel roads; far better on gravel roads than the road bike I used to have.

 

[Turfherder]

Just picked up a full suspension Luna mid drive mountain bike to alternate with my fat tire rear drive Juced RipCurrent S. Love It!

Alan in the Amargosa Desert