Giant SyncDrive Pro 2020 "tuning"

[McCorby]

"The devil is in the details" McCorby Have you derestricted your e-bike?

I'm full of respect to 2solar. The Giant process is hard. What pleasure it will be to Tomaz's wife to be able to takeover other bikes on road or safely cross intersections! (Because you don't ride fast off-road).

No I haven’t Stefan. I really don’t have the need to for how and where I ride. Who knows, maybe someday.....

 

[FlatSix911]

If you regularly hit the wall at 19-20 mph you will wonder how you lived without the speed delimiter.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

No I haven’t Stefan. I really don’t have the need to for how and where I ride. Who knows, maybe someday.....

I wanted to say what looks easy on YT doesn't need to be easy in practice

 

[FlatSix911]

Here's a case in point... delimiting can help achieve a maximum speed of 54mph while descending.

 

[McCorby]

I wanted to say what looks easy on YT doesn't need to be easy in practice

I’ve had the access cover off. It is definitely easy! Just 3 screws and 3 simple connections. No need to unbolt and drop the motor.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

I also asked because (perhaps it is the matter of the past) Shimano motors used to be protected well against de-restriction. Just curious.
Regarding the derestriction itself, I wouldn't do that if I lived in North America. It is the Euro/AUS 25 km/h limit that is really nasty.

 

[FlatSix911]

I also asked because (perhaps it is the matter of the past) Shimano motors used to be protected well against de-restriction. Just curious.
Regarding the derestriction itself, I wouldn't do that if I lived in North America. It is the Euro/AUS 25 km/h limit that is really nasty.

I have de-restricted two Shimano mid-drive motors... no issues even with recent software updates.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Honestly FlatSix, the 20 mph/32 kph limit would be enough for me. I just want to re-iterate there are just three situation in which the "wall effect" at 25 km/h is unacceptable for me:

• Negotiating an intersection. There happen to be some signals in my area that let me cross intersections within 10 seconds only. If I follow a car (or two!), I'm hit with the "wall effect" exactly in the middle of the junction (after the signals already turned red). Bad thing.
• Overtaking slow traditional cyclists, especially on road. I accelerate and suddenly ride in parallel to the other cyclist, unable to ride faster. And there's a car opposite. Very bad thing.
• Running away from a thunderstorm.

 

[McCorby]

Regarding the derestriction itself, I wouldn't do that if I lived in North America. It is the Euro/AUS 25 km/h limit that is really nasty.

Yes, I agree. Like I said, there is no reason for me to do so with the riding I currently do.

 

[McCorby]

I have de-restricted two Shimano mid-drive motors... no issues even with recent software updates.

Do your de-restrictors halve your displayed speed Or does the displayed speed stop increasing after 20mph?

 

[FlatSix911]

Do your de-restrictors halve your displayed speed Or does the displayed speed stop increasing after 20mph?

Actually, the displayed speed is half of the actual value (BadAss Box)... I use Strava for the corrected metrics.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

The VolSpeed thing (and other electronic wired dongles) pays off with giving accurate speed and distance at the cost of hard installation. @2solar has encouraged me to try setting the wheel circumference again using VolSpeed V2. I will report if that works after any longer ride.

 

[McCorby]

The VolSpeed thing (and other electronic wired dongles) pays off with giving accurate speed and distance at the cost of hard installation. @2solar has encouraged me to try setting the wheel circumference again using VolSpeed V2. I will report if that works after any longer ride.

The SpeedBox displays the correct speed up to 20 mph, and then freezes/remains at 20mph above that.

 

[almikel]

What is your current size? I think you don't need any special tools if you just want to replace the chainring. (The lockring-tool is for removing the spider). If you buy a chainring of the same BCD but with more teeth, you just unscrew four bolts with an Allen key. The point is, the chainrings made for MTB are rather not bigger than 36T. Also: Do you have a chain-guide on the e-bike you're talking about?

my front chain ring is 42T and I run out of gears on pavement downhills on my Revolt - good to know that no special tools are needed to swap it.
I'll wait till my first chain replacement and review then, I might go to a 44T or 46T...the chain-guide is in its lowest position with the stock 42T.

cheers
Mike

 

[Stefan Mikes]

my front chain ring is 42T and I run out of gears on pavement downhills on my Revolt - good to know that no special tools are needed to swap it.
I'll wait till my first chain replacement and review then, I might go to a 44T or 46T...the chain-guide is in its lowest position with the stock 42T.

cheers
Mike

@almikel: Be careful as not to make a mistake. First of all, the chain-guide should have markings indicating possible chainring sizes. Secondly, I'm not sure what Bolt Circle Diameter (BCD) is appropriate for your chainring. Thirdly, a larger chainring might simply not fit because it could be hitting the chainstay. The stock photo of your Revolt indicates the latter might be the case!

Be careful as to avoid future frustration.

 

[riverracer]

I have had my 2020 Explore E+1 (syncdrive sport) here in Australia for just over 2mths now and love it, almost...... the 25km/h limit is a killer.
So i tried the "move the sensor, add magnet to the crank" trick... I love the POWER it gives, so, i want to do it correctly now.
Have read thru this post a few times but am still confused (maybe old age..),
I would like everything to appear normal on the bike, speed correctly displayed etc.
The tear down and wiring mess has me worried with my Small frame for room.
That leaves the "BikeSpeed RSc" or the "VOLspeed V2/3" as my choices i think as the smallest internal device.
I like the fact that the "BikeSpeed RSc" you can set your own activation combination, but have read that "Auto" wont work properly....
Are the units detectable if the bike had to go in for warranty/repairs, or do you remove it beforehand?
What about software/firmware updates thru bike shop/phone app, will it render the unit useless?

Which way would you go?

Have any other Australians fitted a delimiter and what did you choose, and why that brand over any other?

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Are the units detectable if the bike had to go in for warranty/repairs, or do you remove it beforehand?

They are probably detectable. I'm so happy my Giant e-bike doesn't break.

What about software/firmware updates thru bike shop/phone app, will it render the unit useless?

No issues with that.

 

[almikel]

I would like everything to appear normal on the bike, speed correctly displayed etc.

if that is a key requirement for you, then the only options are the better dongles (eg Volspeed), which are basically a PITA to install (pull stuff off, drop the motor, fit dongle, put everything back together) - from threads here it appears 2-3 hours work.

The tear down and wiring mess has me worried with my Small frame for room.

agreed - the install for a dongle is difficult - think many, many times about whether your requirement below really is mandatory

I would like everything to appear normal on the bike, speed correctly displayed etc.

is it a requirement you'd "like" or is it a requirement you "need"?...keep in mind Strava on your smart phone and/or a cheap cycle computer can provide accurate speed/distance data if you chose a de-restricting option that mucked with speed etc on the display...but was vastly easier to install/remove (eg seconds rather than hours)

Are the units detectable if the bike had to go in for warranty/repairs, or do you remove it beforehand?

I couldn't advise whether dongles are detectable or not when the bike goes in for service and the LBS plugs in whatever diagnostic tool they have...
I do know that fitting dongles to Giants takes specialist tools to remove bits and several hours to fit and put back together again...not something you would want to remove prior to taking your bike into the LBS for repairs, but definitely recommended to remove before any warranty work.

the 25km/h limit is a killer.

agreed - I just put up with it

Have any other Australians fitted a delimiter and what did you choose, and why that brand over any other?

I have friends that have fitted the Bad Ass Box (BAB) - a small device that fits over the stock speed sensor.
Very simple install - especially if your Giant has the speed sensor on the rear wheel spoke rather than in the rear brake disk.
If spoke sensor, then literally < 5 minute install and sub 30sec removal.

My understanding is that the display reads 1/2 actual with the BAB fitted, and my mates have commented that on long downhill pavement they still occasionally hit the limit (ie display exceeds 25km/h and the assist cuts out), but never on the flats/uphill.

What about software/firmware updates thru bike shop/phone app, will it render the unit useless?

always a risk - one of my mates showed me the instructions that came with his BAB, and it recommended not updating the bike firmware for the reason you mention...but with the BAB specifically, which is only providing a modified speed input, it's hard to imagine any software/firmware updates that could impact the BAB operation and/or render it useless.

Keep in mind that de-restricting an e-bike in Australia allows it to be used on private land only.

cheers
Mike

 

[almikel]

@almikel: Be careful as not to make a mistake. First of all, the chain-guide should have markings indicating possible chainring sizes. Secondly, I'm not sure what Bolt Circle Diameter (BCD) is appropriate for your chainring. Thirdly, a larger chainring might simply not fit because it could be hitting the chainstay. The stock photo of your Revolt indicates the latter might be the case!

Be careful as to avoid future frustration.

View attachment 79506

Hi Stefan,

as always, great info/advice - cheers !
There's no markings on the chain guard, but plenty of travel...and in reality I don't need a chain guard on the 1X for my usage (99% road)...my old school 3X dualie doesn't even have a clutch derailleur, and only suffers chain suck occasionally on serious off road terrain...

...I always wanted a chain catcher for the inside of my 2X road acoustic...I swear it has a special sensor on the front derailleur...it shifts flawlessly and never dumps the chain on the inside ever...until I'm tired and cranky and over it - then when I drop to the smaller chain ring before a big hill, the "special" sensor knows I'm tired/cranky/over it, and dumps the chain on the inside

Modern 1X setups with the taller and narrow/wide chainring teeth plus a clutch derailleur on a gravel bike like mine should make chain suck risk negligible...I could just remove the chain guard..but if it fits a bigger chain ring within its range I'll just leave it.

I was always going to seek a replacement chain ring with the correct BCD (104)...but I hadn't considered the chainstay clearance!
On looking closer it appears OK - this is the clearance with the stock 42T chainring

Great pickup though - a shiny new chainring fouling on the chainstay would be tears before bedtime

Thanks as always - forewarned is forearmed

cheers
Mike

 

[gehu]

Glad I found this syncdrive motor dropping support group.....I was living in my dream world after watching this video until I took the front lower cover off of my 2020 Explore E+ 4 GTS sync drive sport. Volspeed on my Bosch was a 30 min job. It is certainly worth it to be able to ride my bike as if it was my mechanical bike as an endurance athlete for 30 years.

Glad I am just a damn ole tech and bike repair nerd now to engine surgery. Guess I might as well learn my way around in there.
Here is another option but you still have to drop the motor but, it gives high top end speed limit and easy setting via bluetooth app. Have not had any direct experience with this one like I have with Volspeed and Badass.

GreenPed for Yamaha Syncdrive

GreenPed E Bike Tuning for Yamaha Syncdrive with your Smartphone. Derestrict Your Yamaha E Bike and control it with Your Mobile Phone.

www.ebiketuning.com

You have to have a display (which I don't). I would talk to them first about what display and model engine you have to make sure. I just like the sound of setting it via bluetooth (really easy to do with my StUnlocker on my Shim E8000 engine). Volspeed is great if you have a display or using your phone for one and it works well on my Bosch with Purion display. Just the button coding sequence without having any feedback for me on my Giant Explore E+ 4 2020 is kinda a pain and I don't want to install a display on this bike right now and there displays aren't that great for my particular setup on this bike with really large gravel drop bars and my Garmin display.