General Creo questions

[kahn]

I was wondering what your general reaction was to getting it. Glad you got both sizes to try and found the bigger saddle to your liking. Like I said the seat didn't blow me away first sitting on it but my sit bones are not as sore after my long rides. I wanted a seat that I could tolerate riding on for long stretches and multiple days in a week and I think this is it. Its a bummer to have a bike thats 10k and my butt is like no you can't ride it as much as you want BUTT now I can!

It was not miraculous but it was unlike the last time I changed saddles and noticed it was going to take some time to get use to. I may do a longer 40 mile ride tomorrow if my vertigo cooperates!

 

[kahn]

Hey consider this.. is riding this seat to failure any more or less stupid than riding in traffic, iffy road conditions, iffy weather, etc etc..even my carbon rims can fail. I had an aluminum rim that did fail. Your seat failed...you survived. I've crashed...you've crashed...we've all crashed.. There is an inherent danger more or less with biking...Not gonna preemptively replace expensive parts without 'some' sign of failure/wear...end of story not going to do it

Oh, I had not thought of carbon rims (I mentioned handlebars and cranks). Have you looked at their instruction manual or spec sheet? Maybe they have a similar limitation. And any number of these items would be more exposed to sunlight (which can degrade "plastics") than a rail hidden under the saddle umbrella.

The only reason I really noticed that proviso was that I did not want to mess up the paper instruction sheet it was on (in case of return) so I scanned it to pdf. And then to read it on the computer, I enlarged it so it could be read. That's where that quote is from - a copy/paste from the resultant pdf file.

Just started a google search but here's the first

life expectancy of an all carbon saddle - Weight Weenies

weightweenies.starbike.com

 

[mschwett]

It is time release, like a good pill/capsule. I was going to ask but Stefan kind of answered. Carbon fiber and maybe its various resins have a life expectancy. I recall years ago going down the basement and then trying to figure out what all of this odd debris on the floor was??? I looked above it and my snow shoes that had some kind of "nylon" strapping to keep the center platform in place kind of just rotted. No use, just idling away in the basement - not even sunlight to decay it.

So does this mean my Trek Madone might dissolve into a pile of nano-particles on day?

Do carbon fiber handlebars/cranks have similar warnings or time limits? Or maybe they are thicker and last 4 or 5 years!

plastics are funny like that. i have a coat which sat in the closet for two years after five years of wear, and when i grabbed it a few days ago the buttons had turned to some sort of gummy sticky resin on their front face. no sun, no temperature variation beyond 60-70f, no solvents nearby. mysterious.

as for CF, it has so many possible variations in quality and composition. bear in mind people have been riding good quality CF frames and bars and forks for a LONG time. since the lessons of the first generation of CF, 20 some years have passed. most CF frames have a lifetime warranty for the original purchaser.

the real risk to CF is from impact damage, which might cause some not-visible internal issues that in a freak situation could give you the mythical “cf assplosion” where the bike just bursts into pieces at speed. this is also a reason why the warranty is for the original purchaser only - it’s hard to “see” the damage so a second hand owner has no idea what happened to the thing in its first life.

 

[AzDave]

Oh, I had not thought of carbon rims (I mentioned handlebars and cranks). Have you looked at their instruction manual or spec sheet? Maybe they have a similar limitation. And any number of these items would be more exposed to sunlight (which can degrade "plastics") than a rail hidden under the saddle umbrella.

The only reason I really noticed that proviso was that I did not want to mess up the paper instruction sheet it was on (in case of return) so I scanned it to pdf. And then to read it on the computer, I enlarged it so it could be read. That's where that quote is from - a copy/paste from the resultant pdf file.

Just started a google search but here's the first

life expectancy of an all carbon saddle - Weight Weenies

weightweenies.starbike.com

Good search. As I suspected people have different results. One guys carbon seat lasted three years on bad roads..It failed but he didn't crash over it ..someone lasted 4 years and going strong..

Kinda curious too...if there was a failure wouldn't it be likely for one rail to fail while the other remains strong? At least there might be time to stop the bike...I dunno. There are many possible scenarios. I like the scenario where I get 5 years out of my seat and it slowly fails

 

[kahn]

plastics are funny like that. i have a coat which sat in the closet for two years after five years of wear, and when i grabbed it a few days ago the buttons had turned to some sort of gummy sticky resin on their front face. no sun, no temperature variation beyond 60-70f, no solvents nearby. mysterious.

as for CF, it has so many possible variations in quality and composition. bear in mind people have been riding good quality CF frames and bars and forks for a LONG time. since the lessons of the first generation of CF, 20 some years have passed. most CF frames have a lifetime warranty for the original purchaser.

the real risk to CF is from impact damage, which might cause some not-visible internal issues that in a freak situation could give you the mythical “cf assplosion” where the bike just bursts into pieces at speed. this is also a reason why the warranty is for the original purchaser only - it’s hard to “see” the damage so a second hand owner has no idea what happened to the thing in its first life.

Yes, "plastics" (a broad concept) are definitely funny. I have a tent that smells like puke!!! I gather the urethane coating just ages and not well. Pinesol can help.

Here's an interesting "letters to the editor" where Canyon bikes changes the language that was similar to the Specialized I posted above:

Technical FAQ: Carbon component lifespan, future of tubular tire tech

Technical expert Lennard Zinn offers his views regarding carbon fiber longevity and the future of tire tech.

www.velonews.com

Re: Plastics and BAMBOO!!! Many years ago I was cross country skiing down a steep hill. I crashed and my bamboo pole hit a tree. It sounded like a rifle shot and when I looked, my bamboo pole looked like a dust broom. All these stringy fibers where it cracked.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Guys,

No doubt carbon fibre is used by competing roadies and MTB-ers. Their teams have the money to spend. If anyone of us is so fortunate to afford CF gear, let them enjoy it. It is more lightweight than aluminium and it dampens vibrations perfectly.

As I am not that fortunate (and whatever can break, will break with me), I avoid anything made of CF totally

I hope I'll be forgiven by you!

 

[mschwett]

As I am not that fortunate (and whatever can break, will break with me), I avoid anything made of CF totally

I hope I'll be forgiven by you!

i’m curious if you would have avoided a vado 5 for this reason!

 

[Stefan Mikes]

i’m curious if you would have avoided a vado 5 for this reason!

Precisely. Specialized Warsaw has offered an expensive upgrade of the 4.0 to the Future Shock and the CF fork. When I heard "CF" followed by "USD820" I said "no, thank you"

 

[itsmel]

I believe there is a huge difference between well-made carbon fiber and cheaper carbon fiber where the manufacturer is more likely to skimp on the resin or be less meticulous in its application. And fiddly bits like saddle rails seem more likely to break than larger structural ones.

Personally I'd expect a high end carbon fiber fork to last as long or longer than a metal one, unless the fork is titanium. Here's a Leonard Zinn Q&A with fork manufacturers on that topic: https://www.velonews.com/gear/road-gear/technical-qa-with-lennard-zinn-carbon-forks-2/

I have a Specialized Roubaix with a full carbon frame and fork that I've been using for 16 years, and I've never had a problem with it. That said, for safety, I've made it my indoor trainer bike for the last several years. On the other hand, I've snapped steel rails on saddles twice in that same time, so you never know what might break. The last time, I ended up riding home 15 miles entirely out of the saddle because I was unable to sit.

 

[Nak]

I was wondering what your general reaction was to getting it. Glad you got both sizes to try and found the bigger saddle to your liking. Like I said the seat didn't blow me away first sitting on it but my sit bones are not as sore after my long rides. I wanted a seat that I could tolerate riding on for long stretches and multiple days in a week and I think this is it. Its a bummer to have a bike thats 10k and my butt is like no you can't ride it as much as you want BUTT now I can!

I just picked up the Mirror in a 155. For background, I just started riding again after a 20 year hiatus caused by a devastating injury. (I just bought a Creo Comp Carbon EVO.) I rode quite a bit before that, running many Tri's and an Ironman Tri. Now I'm old and fat, LOL. Anyways, when I first got on the saddle I was not blown away. Comfortable, yes. But still sore on the sit bones. However, that area is pretty raw from riding every day for the last week after an extended break. It feels very cushy when you sit on it, but there is no squirminess or other negative issues when riding. I notice that I don't have to move around on 20 mile rides any more. The tenderness around my sit bones is fading rather than getting worse. Each ride it hurts just a little bit less to mount up.

What was noticeable on the first ride is how much the saddle absorbs road vibrations. Wow. I installed an eeSilk seat post (20mm of compliance) several rides before I installed the Mirror. That was an amazing improvement. Adding the Mirror to the mix just really improved the ride even more. The roads I ride on have some rough sections. You still feel the bumps, but there is no "edge" or sharpness to the bump. Just a smooth up and down.

My lower back pain is gone, which was starting to be an issue. (Hence the purchase of the seat post and mirror.) It's hard to say it's worth the rather exorbitant price, but I'm not sure I'd give it up if offered a full refund either. Probably wouldn't part with it, why screw with success?

 

[Raf49]

Hello, I would like to put a carrier on my Turbo Creo Expert. I see that there is a special clamp for the seatpost with two nuts to screw the carrier, but I cannot find the appropriate measure. The normal clamp has a diameter of 30.8 mm and on Specialized's page I only find 29.8, 31.6, 31.8, 32.6 and 34.9 mm.
Does anyone know a solution?
Thanks.

 

[Elkman]

I am still riding a bike with a Brooks leather saddle that I bought in 1971 and it has not deteriorated in any manner. I have used the same synthetic road bike saddle on a series of bicycles over the past 20 years as once I find one that works well for me there is no reason to go to a new one. When I decide to sell an old bike I put the factory saddle on it and as it has had zero wear the buyer is happy.

 

[DJRib]

I have a Specialized Roubaix with a full carbon frame and fork that I've been using for 16 years, and I've never had a problem with it. That said, for safety, I've made it my indoor trainer bike for the last several years. On the other hand, I've snapped steel rails on saddles twice in that same time, so you never know what might break. The last time, I ended up riding home 15 miles entirely out of the saddle because I was unable to sit.

I've got a 2006 full carbon Roubaix and the frame is still in great shape also. It's spent most of 2021 on my trainer and earlier this year the saddle rails broke. A lot easier to deal with getting home when already in the basement !

 

[kahn]

I've got a 2006 full carbon Roubaix and the frame is still in great shape also. It's spent most of 2021 on my trainer and earlier this year the saddle rails broke. A lot easier to deal with getting home when already in the basement !

Last year my steel rails partially ripped out of the saddle frame. The rails themselves did not break.

 

[jodi2]

Hello, I would like to put a carrier on my Turbo Creo Expert. I see that there is a special clamp for the seatpost with two nuts to screw the carrier, but I cannot find the appropriate measure. The normal clamp has a diameter of 30.8 mm and on Specialized's page I only find 29.8, 31.6, 31.8, 32.6 and 34.9 mm.

Why don't you ask your dealer? Or just use a caliper and measure the seat tube yourself?

About carbon parts on bicycles: My experiences are not that long yet, just three years on my first gravel bike and one year on the Creo. But today I totally trust in frames and forks of serious/well-known brands/producers for a sportive bike. I've seen tests of destroying alloy and carbon frames from "neutral" brands (which offer both) and the carbon frame won. And I've seen several alloy frames failing in real live. Maybe I would not choose a carbon frame for my ride allday to the railway station and to the grocery store. And I would not choose a carbon frame from a very cheap brand or shop.

But I was always a little bit afraid of carbon at stem, handle bar or seat post, also as I'm a heavy rider. But carbon is on it's way here as well and for example at race or gravel bikes a carbon seat post is quite normal (also on my ones). But I would take more care of life time/aging here.

Where I'm dissapointed at the moment from carbon is for wheels/rims. Fine for competitons, but for allday use quite sensible, at least for gravel/MTB use. I have two good and quite expensive carbon wheel sets with well-known rim brands for my gravel bikes. On both the rims had quite ugly scratches already after a few hundred miles. No crashes or unexpected contacts with rocks or anything else, no jumps, just normal gravel use on unpaved, sometimes rough roads. Especially the rim on the front wheel seems very exposed. One has a scratch so deep, that I'm not sure if it's still safe to use. On the other hand I had in my life dozens of alloy wheels/rims used for many years and thousands of miles and never any marks like this. I'm thinking of going back to alloy rims for gravel after these wheel sets.
But back to frames: I sold the gravel bike with that ugly front rim scratch a few weeks before (without the carbon wheels) and inspected the frame and it's bottom side very carefully before selling it. I expected quite some marks due to the rim and as the frame had a lot more miles than the wheels. I found absolutely nothing, after 2.5 years. After cleaning the frame it looked everywhere as new.
I'm not sure why there is such a big difference between carbon frame and carbon rims here. The lower tubes and the area around the bottom bracket is also very exposed to dirt, sand, rocks, stones. Is it the surface finish/the painted colour or just these few thin transparent plastic covers/not much more than tape in these areas? Can't they make the rims the same way?

 

[Allan47.7339]

Hello, I would like to put a carrier on my Turbo Creo Expert. I see that there is a special clamp for the seatpost with two nuts to screw the carrier, but I cannot find the appropriate measure. The normal clamp has a diameter of 30.8 mm and on Specialized's page I only find 29.8, 31.6, 31.8, 32.6 and 34.9 mm.
Does anyone know a solution?
Thanks.

Best advice given was to ask your dealer. I've used the support page to double check the dealer.

The support page with replacement parts, lists a S184700001 STC MY18 DIVERGE SEAT CLAMP WITH RACK MOUNT 30.6.

Replacement Parts

support.specialized.com

The amaincycling page lists it as compatible with a Creo

Specialized 2018 Diverge Seat Clamp w/ Rack Mount (Black) (30.6mm)

This is the 2018 Diverge seat clamp with rack mount in 30.6mm size. This is compatible with the following bikes: Model Year Category Model 2020 CREO... S184700001

www.amaincycling.com

This site in EU lists it as well:

SPECIALIZED MY18 DIVERGE SEAT CLAMP WITH RACK MOUNT

SPECIALIZED MY18 DIVERGE SEAT CLAMP WITH RACK MOUNT

webshop.bestbike.de

 

[kahn]

Well, I had the Creo updated with the "remote" buttons to control power levels. Only took it for a spin around about three blocks to get a feel for it and their positions. The shop offered to move them if I want. Mine were placed under the flat part of the handlebars toward the center. I generally selected that position since I am very rarely on the drops. It might take an hour or two to get use to the new buttons as opposed to reaching down to the top tube.

At the moment, the only possible issue is that you have to press the LEFT (in my case) button a few times to disengage the motor power as opposed to the Press/Hold on the top tube select button. I am sure that I will appreciate being able to step up or down one power setting without having to rotate up to 3rd and then one more press to be down to 1st. Or go from 3rd down to 2nd by going through 1st.

We shall see....

 

[DJRib]

Well, I had the Creo updated with the "remote" buttons to control power levels. Only took it for a spin around about three blocks to get a feel for it and their positions. The shop offered to move them if I want. Mine were placed under the flat part of the handlebars toward the center. I generally selected that position since I am very rarely on the drops. It might take an hour or two to get use to the new buttons as opposed to reaching down to the top tube.

At the moment, the only possible issue is that you have to press the LEFT (in my case) button a few times to disengage the motor power as opposed to the Press/Hold on the top tube select button. I am sure that I will appreciate being able to step up or down one power setting without having to rotate up to 3rd and then one more press to be down to 1st. Or go from 3rd down to 2nd by going through 1st.

We shall see....

Mine were placed in the "corners" where the bar bends back towards the stem. I like this placement as I usually ride on the hoods and can hit either one pretty easily with my respective thumbs. Regardless, it did take some getting used to.

 

[Rincon]

I'm not sure which width to get. So thinking of being insane and getting both and returning one or both depending on whatever.

Uh oh. Specialized just released a new Power Mirror Saddle for you. The Romin, undoubtedly from Romulus, and even more comfortable than the previous $450 model. I still have Specialized reward bucks left over from buying the Creo and Vado. Maybe I’ll get one.

Specialized’s Latest Saddle Expands Its 3D Printed Saddle Range With a More Traditional Long Shape

Can a saddle actually be comfortable enough to be worth $450?

www.bicycling.com

 

[kahn]

Uh oh. Specialized just released a new Power Mirror Saddle for you. The Romin, undoubtedly from Romulus, and even more comfortable than the previous $450 model. I still have Specialized reward bucks left over from buying the Creo and Vado. Maybe I’ll get one.

Specialized’s Latest Saddle Expands Its 3D Printed Saddle Range With a More Traditional Long Shape

Can a saddle actually be comfortable enough to be worth $450?

www.bicycling.com

Go to HE!!

I'm past my return date by about a week. I don't know if the traditional, longer saddle would make any difference. But I guess you get more saddle for the same exorbitant price!

Which probably means I liked it enough. I see these are, so far, in stock. And even at that price, I bet not for long.