Front page LA Times today regarding Ebikes

We are occupied! There are millions of highly armed delusional people killing us daily in large numbers. Darwin is the only upside. They mostly kill, in this order, themselves, their family members, their personal community members. Assault weapons are like the Ring on Gollum. 'My Precious'. Possession makes them warped and possessed. They fantasize about delusional scenarios that will justify possession, even making them heroes. And then enact their offensives. One lady shot at a guy she thought might be a shoplifter. They might even point overseas to deflect from their own heart of the real problem, their twisted minds. When is enough, enough? Gun Nuts need to go. There is no justification or excuse for these mass killings. Those who side, cover with excuses, or deflect for those nuts are on the wrong side of history and opposed to the founding ideals of America. Our reason for being and goal, is for a more, and more, and more perfect Union. Change is how we get there. Doing nothing will not make for a different result.
 
We are occupied! There are millions of highly armed delusional people killing us daily in large numbers. Darwin is the only upside. They mostly kill, in this order, themselves, their family members, their personal community members. Assault weapons are like the Ring on Gollum. 'My Precious'. Possession makes them warped and possessed. They fantasize about delusional scenarios that will justify possession, even making them heroes. And then enact their offensives. One lady shot at a guy she thought might be a shoplifter. They might even point overseas to deflect from their own heart of the real problem, their twisted minds. When is enough, enough? Gun Nuts need to go. There is no justification or excuse for these mass killings. Those who side, cover with excuses, or deflect for those nuts are on the wrong side of history and opposed to the founding ideals of America. Our reason for being and goal, is for a more, and more, and more perfect Union. Change is how we get there. Doing nothing will not make for a different result.
With all due respect
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There are millions and millions of gun owners that have never committed a crime, have no intent of committing a crime, and basically just want to be left alone. Owning a firearm does not make one into Gollum, that has got to be about the silliest thing that I've ever read.

You have basically just spouted a bunch of bigotry that if one were to say that about black people you'd be quickly excoriated. It is just flat out wrong to dump millions of law abiding gun owners into the same bucket as those that willingly commit crimes. Trying to seize firearms from those millions of people will do nothing to stop the killings, considering the fact that the states with the most stringent gun laws, are the states with the highest amount of gun crime.

In closing, I'd like to point out that Obama's presidential motorcade has killed more people that all my firearms combined.
 
As a lawful gunowner, today I went to the dog groomers, spent 10 minutes getting puppykin's nails trimmed. Went to Costco and got gas, and then went into Costco to pickup something I forgot the other day, then went to the grocery store, then came home. A little later I took two of the kids to the eye doctor to see if they needed glasses or not. Spent almost 2 hours in there.

Throughout all that running, I carried a firearm with me, no one but me, and my kids knew that. No one got shot, and at no point in time was anyone in the public in danger from my firearm. I am a friendly, well adjusted extrovert, and I spend much of my time helping other people.

If you were to meet me, and not know that I was carrying you would never actually suspect that I was.

Among the Amish community (there's Amish in 42 states and 6 Canadian provinces), they own 10's of thousands of firearms, and there are zero mass shootings committed by the Amish. It's not a gun problem, it's a people problem. Gun ownership does not make one crazed or inherently evil.
 
Possession of an inherently evil thing does twist a brain. Making it also Evil. Seeking justification. Apologizing, and making deflections and excuses and pointing fingers in odd directions. The fact is these are intended to kill local humans. There is no justification. 3,628 American have lost their lives to guns in January, 2023. That is 100% upon the mentally twisted possessed. It makes them feel POWER. Insane. When is enough, enough? This has got to change. Or the trend is for a growing more of the same insanity.
 
Possession of an inherently evil thing does twist a brain. Making it also Evil. Seeking justification. Apologizing, and making deflections and excuses and pointing fingers in odd directions. The fact is these are intended to kill local humans. There is no justification. 3,628 American have lost their lives to guns in January, 2023. That is 100% upon the mentally twisted possessed. It makes them feel POWER. Insane. When is enough, enough? This has got to change. Or the trend is for a growing more of the same insanity.
Ahh, I found where you got that number. 2/3's of those deaths are suicide. Do you think that if those people didn't have a gun, they wouldn't find another way to commit suicide that is just as easy as a firearm? Didn't Kate Spade, hang herself? People throw themselves off tall things, people drive into lakes and off cliffs Was the rope Kate hung herself with inherently evil? How about bridges and buildings? No, they were just a convenient method to check out. No different than using a firearm. People use what they have at hand.

As a human, I have the right to defend myself and my family if need be. So far, and I hope it stays this way, I have never had to do that. At the same time, I carry a fire extinguisher in all my vehicles, including my boat, and I have them on every floor of my house, and in every garage. Have I ever had to use them? No, but they are there, just in case. It's more about preparation than it is about being evil.

To punish millions of people by depriving them of property due to the crimes of a very few is rather anti-freedom don't you think? I'm also not sure how an inanimate object can actually be evil? It isn't the one ring of power as you stated before, Sauron isn't talking to people through their firearms and giving them long life in return for evil acts. Can you explain the science behind that statement? Is it the chemicals in the gunpowder, maybe the Hopps #9?

People can be evil, and commit evil acts with objects regardless if it's a firearm or not. Remember, the Boston bombing was done with a pressure cooker, I have 4 of them, I never considered building a bomb out of them and placing it in a public place. A firearm, is no more evil than a hammer or any other tool. But someone just assaulted Paul Pelosi with a hammer, I don't see anyone screaming to have hammers banned. But the hammer was the tool that was used.

The vast majority of gunowners in the US are not how Hollywood portrays them, we're not Burt Gummer. But ya know what? When the graboids came, Burt saved the day with a few household chemicals in the right proportions. :)
 
Possession of an inherently evil thing does twist a brain. Making it also Evil. Seeking justification. Apologizing, and making deflections and excuses and pointing fingers in odd directions. The fact is these are intended to kill local humans. There is no justification. 3,628 American have lost their lives to guns in January, 2023. That is 100% upon the mentally twisted possessed. It makes them feel POWER. Insane. When is enough, enough? This has got to change. Or the trend is for a growing more of the same insanity.
I have yet to see an inanimate object that was inherently evil. Unless it was a Vado. :p
 
This is what I say about guns and ebikes.
It's better to have it when you need it more better than needing it and not have it.
I ride in some fucked up sections of Pearl Harbor Bike Path where there are homeless people sent here from the Mainland US and they have camps along side the pathways.
Vicious looking dogs, if you don't stand your ground you don't deserve to ride through.
I thought Hawaii was difficult to not only get a firearm, but also to get a license to carry? Unless you're Magnum PI
 
You must be thinking of 'Open Carry'.
I has to be approved by the Police Chief.
Legally registered guns are easily acquired, all you needs to be is a law abiding citizen no felony, no domestic violence, no mental problems and you good to go.
Cool, now all you need is a Ferrari 508 with the plate Rome1 on it.
 
Preparedness has everything to do with ebikes, unless you would like to walk 20 miles or have a vicious dog or human bite you.(Hey) These threads are an eclectic mix oft times straying and usually returning to the subject. As a whole we are very tolerant of others' opinions and attitudes you want to see trolls and butthurt go to some of the 4x4 sites and "personal sites"( thats how they degenerate anyway)
🤣
 
Ahh, I found where you got that number. 2/3's of those deaths are suicide.
Let's talk about suicide. I find it extremely interesting (and telling) that the suicide rate is significantly higher if there is a handgun in the house. By a factor of eight for men and thirty-five for women:


This forum is largely composed of older, white men whom are already at elevated risk for suicide. So that gun is literally pointed at us.
 
To punish millions of people by depriving them of property due to the crimes of a very few is rather anti-freedom don't you think?
Help me out here. Are the kids that die in school shootings not being "punished" too? Are you being punished because you are deprived of your "right" to drive your car on the left side of the road at 100mph? Maybe you have a perfect driving record and are capable of doing so safely.

We live in a complex society with millions of other people, many of whom are not exactly like us. That means there have to be some rules. Some of those rules are going to seem ridiculous and many of them are going to clearly suck. However, they likely suck much less than the alternatives.

Also, don't go around blaming people who just want to go peacefully about their business without being maimed or murdered. If you want to blame anyone, either blame fruitcakes who go off and murder a bunch of people or idiot politicians who think they can solve this problem with thoughts and prayers. Or people who make cop-outs about "mental health" but would scream bloody murder if we actually allocated (or even could allocate) adequate resources to address that obvious problem.

I own multiple firearms. I have done so since I was approximately twelve. Largely I use them to shoot beer cans, but only in self defense. However, I find all of the arguments that firearms advocates use for their retention to be at best questionable and in many cases ridiculous.

Operating a firearm safely and effectively is a learned and highly perishable skill. Which means you need continuous practice to keep the skill. Doing so in a kill-or-be-killed situation is an even more difficult and more perishable skill, as your own reflexes are working against you. Again you need continuous practice to maintain that skill. Very few civilians (and bluntly not enough police officers and people serving in the military) get the hours of training time needed to acquire and maintain those skills. At the same time most civilian firearm owners have a ridiculous degree of confidence that they could handle themselves effectively in a gunfight. Having a firearm in your home for self-defense without having those skills makes you a danger to yourself and others, but not necessarily the invading Venezuelan militia or the psycho killer in your kitchen.

I'd also add that it is pretty well-documented that a pretty substantial percentage of soldiers serving in WWII were just unwilling or unable to shoot at people, even in a life or death situation. You won't really know until you really are in one of those situations if you can shoot a person, even in self-defense.
 
Help me out here. Are the kids that die in school shootings not being "punished" too? Are you being punished because you are deprived of your "right" to drive your car on the left side of the road at 100mph? Maybe you have a perfect driving record and are capable of doing so safely.

We live in a complex society with millions of other people, many of whom are not exactly like us. That means there have to be some rules. Some of those rules are going to seem ridiculous and many of them are going to clearly suck. However, they likely suck much less than the alternatives.

Also, don't go around blaming people who just want to go peacefully about their business without being maimed or murdered. If you want to blame anyone, either blame fruitcakes who go off and murder a bunch of people or idiot politicians who think they can solve this problem with thoughts and prayers. Or people who make cop-outs about "mental health" but would scream bloody murder if we actually allocated (or even could allocate) adequate resources to address that obvious problem.

I own multiple firearms. I have done so since I was approximately twelve. Largely I use them to shoot beer cans, but only in self defense. However, I find all of the arguments that firearms advocates use for their retention to be at best questionable and in many cases ridiculous.

Operating a firearm safely and effectively is a learned and highly perishable skill. Which means you need continuous practice to keep the skill. Doing so in a kill-or-be-killed situation is an even more difficult and more perishable skill, as your own reflexes are working against you. Again you need continuous practice to maintain that skill. Very few civilians (and bluntly not enough police officers and people serving in the military) get the hours of training time needed to acquire and maintain those skills. At the same time most civilian firearm owners have a ridiculous degree of confidence that they could handle themselves effectively in a gunfight. Having a firearm in your home for self-defense without having those skills makes you a danger to yourself and others, but not necessarily the invading Venezuelan militia or the psycho killer in your kitchen.

I'd also add that it is pretty well-documented that a pretty substantial percentage of soldiers serving in WWII were just unwilling or unable to shoot at people, even in a life or death situation. You won't really know until you really are in one of those situations if you can shoot a person, even in self-defense.
Now you're getting deep into philosophy (among other things).

The situations behind the people who get murdered are what we have to focus on; otherwise we're treating symptoms instead of the illness. I see two roots to the problem.

One root cause is mental illness. There are more issues and situations nowadays because many (most?) states no longer have the treatment facilities they once supported. Instead, arrested individuals who need treatment wind up incarcerated instead of in a place that specializes in treatment. (But we still might ask: why is there a surge in mental illness these days?)

The other (deeper) root cause is spiritual. People who think there is no deity watching their actions, and who think there are no eternal consequences, are far more likely to steal, kill, destroy property, etc. People who do not believe there is a God who loves them but who also expects high moral standards are more prone to be self-centered, self-serving, and uncaring about the needs, wants, and rights of other people. After all, if all we get afterward is the same dirt nap as everyone else, why not swipe that check out of your neighbor's mailbox or shoot the guy who cut you off in traffic, as long as you think you can get away with it? Or maybe you hate yourself and your life so much, you don't even care if you live or die, so why not go out in a "blaze of glory?" Contrast this with folks who believe that they are expected to love God, and love one another as much as they love themselves, and that an eternal penalty awaits those who refuse? We are seeing the societal results of a far lower number of changed hearts and lives.

In the 1950s plenty of people went to bed with their doors unlocked. Neighbors looked out for neighbors. Kids took their guns with them to school so they could go hunting before or after, and there was no "mass shooting" problem. Schoolteachers led the students in prayer every morning and taught the kids Biblical moral values (you know the ones... the values our founders had). Students behaved in class and applied themselves to their lessons with a minimum of cheating. Parents backed all of this up, and gladly.

But starting in the 1960s a series of legal decisions changed all that.

Now we have seen the kids of the '60s grow up and have kids of the '80s, who had kids of the 2000s, all of whom grew up in a different school environment. And this school environment inevitably trickled down into the home environment. Now it is against the law to teach kids in school the real reasons why they should obey their parents, respect teachers and elders, and avoid cheating. Now we lock our doors, bar the windows, and peer out nervously at the miscreants on the sidewalk while hoping they don't take a notion to break in. Kids are more far unruly and disobedient at home. Their parents were raised to not believe in absolute moral standards, so the kids don't believe in them either. It's 'dog eat dog,' everyone for himself, and let the foolish nice guys get the hindmost. I hear from school personnel that even the parents now come into the building exhibiting behavior issues! (Some example they are setting for their children!) Violent video games and movies, along with easily accessible porn which debases the female human being, have contributed to an unconsciously held belief in today's young adults and youths that other people exist on this planet to give them pleasure and to take advantage of.

Should we be surprised at the uptick in mass shootings? Should we be surprised by rampant corruption in government? Should we be surprised by corporate greed? These are the logical outgrowths of excluding from our society the basic moral tenets which glue a society together.
 
People like to blame Reagan for his closing of the mental treatment facilities in the 80's, basically making it a left vs right issue. But, there were 8 years of Clinton, 8 years of Obama, and now 4 years of Biden, I have yet to see them try to resolve the problem that is blamed on Reagan.

Those that blame Reagan have had more than enough time to get legislation to help the situation, and they've done nothing.
 
Help me out here. Are the kids that die in school shootings not being "punished" too? Are you being punished because you are deprived of your "right" to drive your car on the left side of the road at 100mph? Maybe you have a perfect driving record and are capable of doing so safely.

We live in a complex society with millions of other people, many of whom are not exactly like us. That means there have to be some rules. Some of those rules are going to seem ridiculous and many of them are going to clearly suck. However, they likely suck much less than the alternatives.

Also, don't go around blaming people who just want to go peacefully about their business without being maimed or murdered. If you want to blame anyone, either blame fruitcakes who go off and murder a bunch of people or idiot politicians who think they can solve this problem with thoughts and prayers. Or people who make cop-outs about "mental health" but would scream bloody murder if we actually allocated (or even could allocate) adequate resources to address that obvious problem.

I own multiple firearms. I have done so since I was approximately twelve. Largely I use them to shoot beer cans, but only in self defense. However, I find all of the arguments that firearms advocates use for their retention to be at best questionable and in many cases ridiculous.

Operating a firearm safely and effectively is a learned and highly perishable skill. Which means you need continuous practice to keep the skill. Doing so in a kill-or-be-killed situation is an even more difficult and more perishable skill, as your own reflexes are working against you. Again you need continuous practice to maintain that skill. Very few civilians (and bluntly not enough police officers and people serving in the military) get the hours of training time needed to acquire and maintain those skills. At the same time most civilian firearm owners have a ridiculous degree of confidence that they could handle themselves effectively in a gunfight. Having a firearm in your home for self-defense without having those skills makes you a danger to yourself and others, but not necessarily the invading Venezuelan militia or the psycho killer in your kitchen.

I'd also add that it is pretty well-documented that a pretty substantial percentage of soldiers serving in WWII were just unwilling or unable to shoot at people, even in a life or death situation. You won't really know until you really are in one of those situations if you can shoot a person, even in self-defense.
It's quite simple, I did not kill any children, no crimes were committed with my firearms, therefore I should not be deprived of property based upon the crimes of another person. Is that callous? Maybe, but it's the way it's supposed to work. I don't see anyone saying that the German civilians during WWII should be held to the same standard of punishment as the soldiers that worked in concentration camps. I've read stories where BMW drivers have killed people, should all BMW drivers be held liable? They've even killed children. I have done nothing to harm anyone, nor society as a whole.

I'm not sure what your diatribe about training comes from. You don't know me, you have no clue what my training is. People, if they own a firearm, should have training, should it be mandated by law? No, because the moment it's mandated by law it will be a tool to deny people the ability to own a firearm, that's the game that NJ is currently playing with a recent SCOTUS ruling. How? By making it incredibly difficult to get the training that's required whether it's be cost or by scheduling and location. Sure you can get training, but it only happens on the 2nd tuesday of the third week of Smarch, the cost is $1500 paid in cash, for 8 hours, next year you'll have to come in for more training.
 
Jeebus here we go, god and Guns. I’m not sure which is more dangerous.
Taking guns away from people that committed no crime is no different than the mindset that some have that because some people "misuse" a throttle no one should have them.
 
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