Electric Car thread

If you are referring to me, I'm not a diehard ICE person. It's that EVs aren't close to providing the capability, flexibility and overall economy that ICE currently offers - recent moves by Hertz to downsize its EV fleet, reliability studies such as Consumer Reports and others objectively address the shortcomings. EV fans often site technologies and infrastructure that may or may not be available in the future but aren't available now as well as preferences for high acceleration, driving fun etc that don't contribute in a positive fashion to environmental stewardship or economic issues. Then when faced with objective shortcomings seem to often pivot their arguments. There is much more to expenses than the price of fuel including purchase price, depreciation, insurance costs, time value of money and more. And yes, she does seem sensitive and likes her technology "toys" based on her posts, including the one I quoted.

I think you will really like it. It had enough traditional buttons and knobs to make any older driver (I'm in that camp, too!) feel comfortable right away. The EV tech is nice, understated, and easy to understand. The car is a compact a SUV without feeling cramped, has a decent amount of room in the back. I kept saying "I really like this car!" to my husband all the way home (an hour away).

I believe the purchase of a Kona also comes with free Electrify America fast charging for 3(?) years. Plus this year the Tesla superchargers will be opening to certain manufacturers, like Hyundai. Which means you'll have a tons of charging options on your trips.

Let us know if you get the chance to try one out!
I think it's 2 years free charging, but they do give a complimentary level 2 setup, and $600 towards installation. I'm checking to see if Hyundai dealerships are charging opportunities, also.

I'll let you know if I find one to rent!
 
I have a 2022 Kona EV and it is great for around town and 2 adults. The back would be fine for 2 kids (up to 5'6" or so) but 2 normal sized adults in the back would be cramped for any distance driving. If I didnt need the 7500 tax credit at the time, I probably wouldn't have bought it. I got rid of my out of warranty Porsche Macan S that was such a nice car to drive...
Do you have the free EA charging with your Kona?
Sorry about your Macan.
 
Do you have the free EA charging with your Kona?
Sorry about your Macan.
I think I may have had it. Never used it. Primarily charge at home with the level 1 trickle charger and if I need a quick charge, go down the street to a free level 3. Yeah, I miss the Macan. Dont miss the 1000 dollar oil changes though! Or the 6 dollar gas....
 
One of my issues with EV's is the secondary market
There really isn't one at the moment. It's still too early in the EV adoption phase. Probably won't be a viable market until 5 or more years from now. There is, however, a growing lease market that, in 3 more years, will be releasing vehicles to the resale market.

Batteries won't be an issue. Their warranties are long enough to last a decade, and the aftermarket for use as solar batteries is already hot and will continue to be so for many years to come. What will be carried over from the ICE age is the maintenance needs in the infrastructure under the car - tie rods, shocks, etc - things most gearheads and greasemonkeys are used to repairing/replacing.

Your talents with a wrench and grease gun will still live long and prosper.
 
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Depending upon when you purchased your 2022, you should have (not sure but think so) another year of free EA charging left with your Kona.

$1,000 oil changes for your Porsche?? Seriously?😵‍💫
 
I think it's 2 years free charging, but they do give a complimentary level 2 setup, and $600 towards installation. I'm checking to see if Hyundai dealerships are charging opportunities, also.

I'll let you know if I find one to rent!
The $600 towards the NEMA 14-50 setup for Level 2 charging is a sweet deal! It cost me $800 in 2018 to have two NEMA 14-50 outlets installed in my garage for a Level 2 on each side. I thought that was pricy because the dual electrical panels for the house were located right there in the garage. One outlet was less than 6" under the panels.

Guess I was paying for the electrical expertise, not just the wire and commercial outlets. That's what I keep telling myself years later.
 
Depending upon when you purchased your 2022, you should have (not sure but think so) another year of free EA charging left with your Kona.

$1,000 oil changes for your Porsche?? Seriously?😵‍💫
Yeah, I think they changed the cabin airfilter and regular air filter as well-2 things I could do myself but forgot to tell the service advisor. I think a normal is closer to 700. As far as the free EA charging-I rarely need to fast charge. If I do, there is a ChargePoint down the road that is free. The city subsidizes it by putting solar panels on all the parking structures. There are 2 free units. Sometimes they are both occupied, but if you go early, they are usually open. On a big day of driving, I go from 100% down to 88. I plug it in after 9pm when the rates drop and the next day I'm in the high 90s or back to 100. I call my car my golf cart!
 
One of my issues with EV's is the secondary market. It's going to be virtually non-existent. I don't buy new cars, I have no desire to take out a loan on something that loses so much value in such a short time. Leasing is out of the question because I do not want to be limited to miles or pay more at the end of the lease. I like buying used cars in decent shape, fixing as what they need, I do most of the work myself. I don't expect any used car to have no problems and accept that they all need some work. Buying a used EV would be a disaster if it need a new battery. Sure a used ICE might need a new engine, but that's far less than what I've seen for costs for a new battery. Plus of many cars I've owned, I've never needed such a major repair. My dead suburban went to the scrapyard in the sky with 227K miles on it, and it still had a lot to go. When I got it I put less than $600 into it for actual repairs plus a new set of tires, and it was a 1999. I do miss the days of driving to the scrapyard and finding a car like mine and getting the parts I need.

It’s a great time to but a used EV if you qualify for the $4000 tax credit. Owning our EV has really opened my eyes to how much time and money I used to spend on just maintaining our ICE cars. In 30k miles, I’ve only replaced the cabin filter and the not so great stock windshield wipers. Pads are practically brand new due to regenerative braking and no fluid changes to do every 3k-10k miles. When I was single, I found car maintenance was very therapeutic. As a father with two young kids, I’m thrilled to have my weekends back. We still have a big Honda Pilot around but it gets driven maybe 5-10 miles a month and I have to put it on a trickle charger just to maintain the battery. I guess we ended up having two vehicles that we need to plug in. But if I ever get disposable income again, we’re replacing the ICE with a used EV.
 
In mentioning early EV adoption in this thread, I remembered reading a long time ago, when I was doing research for a carriaging article I was writing for a carriage driving magazine, about an interesting early auto enthusiast named Horatio Nelson Jackson. His adventures ended up being figured in the article I wrote on road infrastructure in the horse drawn era.

Not surprisingly he found his way into Wikipedia (which was a decade away from existing as yet when I wrote the article):

Jackson [a physician living in Vermont], was an auto enthusiast who differed with the then-prevailing wisdom that the automobile was a passing fad and a recreational plaything. While in San Francisco's University Club as a guest on May 18, 1903, he agreed to a $50 wager (equivalent to $1,629 in 2022) to prove that a four-wheeled machine could be driven across the country. He accepted, even though at age 31 he did not own a car, had practically no experience driving, and had no maps to follow. Jackson and his wife planned to return to their Burlington, Vermont, home in a few days, and both had been taking automobile driving lessons while in San Francisco. She returned home by train, allowing him to take his adventure by automobile. [BTW - her dad was one of the richest men in Vermont at the time who made his fortune in a partnership manufacturing and selling what we'd call today "snake oil". ]

Having no mechanical experience, Jackson convinced a young mechanic and chauffeur, Sewall Crocker, to serve as his travel companion, mechanic, and backup driver. Crocker suggested that Jackson buy a Winton car. He bought a slightly used, two-cylinder, 20 hp Winton, which he named "The Vermont", after his home state, bade his wife goodbye, and left San Francisco on May 23, carrying coats, rubber protective suits, sleeping bags, blankets, canteens, a water bag, an axe, a shovel, a telescope, tools, spare parts, a block and tackle, cans for extra gasoline and oil, a Kodak camera, a rifle, a shotgun, and pistols.


His adventures in driving this novel machine across a horse-centric machine-unready county is, in one word, hilarious. The part where the car made so much noise that the intrepid doctor and his companion failed to hear their supplies falling off the back of the car along the way was beyond funny. But their trials even getting out of San Francisco also echoes the stumbling blocks of any new intrusion into society and the prevailing infrastructure. Back then, Jackson set off into it a landscape of horse drawn vehicles and their wide and firmly established support system, while virtually nothing supported the automobile. The horse ruled economically and socially, and cars were looked upon with suspicion and wonder and (most times) derision. Only in the cities did cars gain an early foothold in acceptance, although fuel and service was both scarce and difficult to find.

Pretty much the same playbook that the EV is following today. Except that EVs don't have to worry about scaring horses like the noisy ICE cars did back then. We just have to deal with the reverse - government recently mandating "noise" programmed into our silent cars up to 7mph so we don't "scare" pedestrians. And yes, I actually did startle a few people with my earlier EV because they only saw movement but no sound. At least my current EVs sound like spaceships (which is how a pedestrian described it to me because he thought the sound was really cool).

It took over 20 years, and lots of mechanical and supporting innovation for the car, combined with the development of abundant and easy fueling along all major roads, for the car to finally dethrone the horse. It took another 30 years after that for a President who saw the need for a national highway system to be developed with paved roads in lieu of dirt, and had it built.

I wish I could peek into the future to see how long before EVs become the dominant mode of personal transportation with charging infrastructure on every corner and in every home, apartment and condo. If history has any say, it will be another 20 years.

I wonder if I'll still be driving my first electric truck then, or have replaced it for a truck that drives me....

"Alexa, take me to the grocery store, please."

"Of course. Taking you to the grocery store now."
 
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We still have a big Honda Pilot around but it gets driven maybe 5-10 miles a month and I have to put it on a trickle charger just to maintain the battery.
I feel your pain. I would take my F250 out for a drive at least once every 3 weeks or so, whether I wanted to or not, just to keep its dual batteries maintained. We finally replaced the old batteries with new ones so we could let the truck sit for two months or more between drives. In retrospect it probably could have been cheaper in the long run to just use a battery tender.
 
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I currently use both. There are times that we end up not putting it on a battery tender for a few weeks so we use this handy little remote battery disconnect.
I have a similar not remote device in my truck. There's a second battery under the hood wired into it. When the truck is running it charges that battery, but when it shuts off, it disconnects that battery so as to not drain the start battery. I have the second battery wired in to run some accessories as well as tied into the two batteries in the trailer via the trailer connector. When I'm pulling the truck can supply 12V@40A to the trailer to keep the batteries back there charged up and running the fridge. If I'm out and we're serving, if we have to we can start the truck to charge the batteries, or we can rely upon solar, or a small generator. But we should never kill the start battery.
 
That remote battery disconnect is so clever. Wish I'd know about this nifty item when I had my Living Quarters horse trailer. I had to disconnect the batteries when the trailer wasn't in use. I did have the solar panels for recharging the trailer batteries when I arrived on site. Those were fabulous and did a great job...as long as the sun was shining.
 
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Never occurred to me to disable the truck.🤔
Our Mercedes Sprinter has an easily accessible disconnect next to the throttle; never used it because I make it a point to drive it at least every two weeks.

Parasitic loss is a problem in many (most) newer vehicles with all the electronics. Periodically I'll walk past Sprinter or Subaru and see the monitor lit up for unknown reason. My Subaru had a battery replaced (class action suit I think) and the replacement was much bigger. During COVID my son worked from home, so Honda sat in the garage; battery had to be replaced after sitting for a month. As great as technology is, parasitic loss is a design defect in my opinion.
 
Our Mercedes Sprinter has an easily accessible disconnect next to the throttle; never used it because I make it a point to drive it at least every two weeks.

Parasitic loss is a problem in many (most) newer vehicles with all the electronics. Periodically I'll walk past Sprinter or Subaru and see the monitor lit up for unknown reason. My Subaru had a battery replaced (class action suit I think) and the replacement was much bigger. During COVID my son worked from home, so Honda sat in the garage; battery had to be replaced after sitting for a month. As great as technology is, parasitic loss is a design defect in my opinion.
Discussing parasitic loss is how we ended up with the idea of putting a 270W panel on the top of the truck. Kid and I were talking about it how modern cars have a constant draw of power, why isn't there a small panel built into the vehicles to offset the parasitic draw? We don't drive all our cars all the time to keep them charged. 2 weeks of sitting can pull the battery down, thew newer the car the more the draw. A 5W panel on the top of the vehicle would be enough to offset the draw and keep the battery topped off. I have a 15W panel with a simple charge controller that will bring a battery up to full within a couple of days.
 
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