Does lectric bikes 2.0 have Puncture-resistant fat tires?

[Gmeng]

Are the are lectric puncture-resistant fat tires? How well do they hold up?

 

[rawlus]

marketed as puncture resistant yes.
i still run tire liners and a tube sealant as a precaution.

 

[m@Robertson]

Tires are spec'd as "Chaoyang or CST 3" x 20" Fat tires" according to their web site so no they are no more than standard-issue fat tires. Nothing wrong with them but the puncture-resistant bit is just marketing.

To amplify on that: Chaoyang doesn't make a belted or otherwise fortified tire. Closest you can come are their 30 tpi tires which are a thick casing and that thicker casing DOES provide added protection. But its still not a flat-preventive. CST makes basic tires. Typically OEM for Asian manufacturers.

For those of you with these bikes, what is the 'tpi' rating on the sidewall? 30 is best for thickness. 60 is more common. 120 is the good stuff for supple responsiveness and not really what you want on an ebike.

 

[rawlus]

Tires are spec'd as "Chaoyang or CST 3" x 20" Fat tires" according to their web site so no they are no more than standard-issue fat tires. Nothing wrong with them but the puncture-resistant bit is just marketing.

To amplify on that: Chaoyang doesn't make a belted or otherwise fortified tire. Closest you can come are their 30 tpi tires which are a thick casing and that thicker casing DOES provide added protection. But its still not a flat-preventive. CST makes basic tires. Typically OEM for Asian manufacturers.

For those of you with these bikes, what is the 'tpi' rating on the sidewall? 30 is best for thickness. 60 is more common. 120 is the good stuff for supple responsiveness and not really what you want on an ebike.

the chai yang tires on one of my bikes are marked as one of their “dino skin” varieties on the sidewall. it is not the kevlar breaker but i think a nylon and added mm rubber breaker.

chaoyang technologies

CHAOYANG TIRES - TECHNOLOGY

CHAOYANG is the earliest and most important brand in ZC-Rubber. As the leader of Chinese tire market, we also continuously get remarkable achievement in global market. Manufacturering high quality tires of bicycle, motorcycle, car tire, truck and bus tire

www.chaoyangtire.com

i have less info on the CST tire though.

 

[m@Robertson]

the chai yang tires on one of my bikes are marked as one of their “dino skin” varieties on the sidewall. it is not the kevlar breaker but i think a nylon and added mm rubber breaker.

chaoyang technologies

CHAOYANG TIRES - TECHNOLOGY

CHAOYANG is the earliest and most important brand in ZC-Rubber. As the leader of Chinese tire market, we also continuously get remarkable achievement in global market. Manufacturering high quality tires of bicycle, motorcycle, car tire, truck and bus tire

www.chaoyangtire.com

i have less info on the CST tire though.

that Dino Skin bit is just marketing. They're just ordinary tires with uneven quality control, unfortunately. Chao Yang actually makes tires for many other 2nd tier manufacturers. In addition to the Chao Yang brand, Arisun is their EU/North American brand. Same tires and same company. Most Origin8 tires are Chaoyangs. Look at the Origin8 Supercell and the Chaoyang Sandstorm. Same tire. Likewise the Chaoyang Big Daddy, the Arisun Big Fatty, the Origin8 Tsunami and the Panaracer Fat B Nimble... all the same tire. Also the Mongoose 'fat tire' sold on Amazon. Same tire.

I have run Chaoyangs for many thousands of miles in their Big Daddy / Big Fatty model. In 30 tpi its a great little tank tread. But its just the 30 tpi providing the protection. Nothing more. Really with ALL fat tires you can forget about anything more than a slightly thicker casing becasue of the sheer weight involved. If you want to ride fat tires you kiss goodbye all of the beefing up options you take for granted with smaller tires. Your flatproofing has to be independent of that. Tannus and FlatOut is what I use and at the moment only FlatOut is what I'd recommend anyone else use. Jury is still out on whether Tannus is going to last long-term.

 

[rawlus]

that Dino Skin bit is just marketing. They're just ordinary tires with uneven quality control, unfortunately. Chao Yang actually makes tires for many other 2nd tier manufacturers. In addition to the Chao Yang brand, Arisun is their EU/North American brand. Same tires and same company. Most Origin8 tires are Chaoyangs. Look at the Origin8 Supercell and the Chaoyang Sandstorm. Same tire. Likewise the Chaoyang Big Daddy, the Arisun Big Fatty, the Origin8 Tsunami and the Panaracer Fat B Nimble... all the same tire. Also the Mongoose 'fat tire' sold on Amazon. Same tire.

I have run Chaoyangs for many thousands of miles in their Big Daddy / Big Fatty model. In 30 tpi its a great little tank tread. But its just the 30 tpi providing the protection. Nothing more. Really with ALL fat tires you can forget about anything more than a slightly thicker casing becasue of the sheer weight involved. If you want to ride fat tires you kiss goodbye all of the beefing up options you take for granted with smaller tires. Your flatproofing has to be independent of that. Tannus and FlatOut is what I use and at the moment only FlatOut is what I'd recommend anyone else use. Jury is still out on whether Tannus is going to last long-term.

i understand what you are saying and i also use amendments for added puncture resistance but curious about your statement that their technologies are “just marketing”.

do you have specific objective evidence to support this conclusion or is this a subjective conclusion you’ve come to over time.

the “technologies” mentioned in their “marketing” make some specific claims with regard to material and thickness specifications as a means of differentiating them from “regular tires”…. are you suggesting that none of that is in fact true? that the tires do not have these different added layers and materials?

trying to cut through brand perception variabilities and stick to facts. thx.

 

[m@Robertson]

i understand what you are saying and i also use amendments for added puncture resistance but curious about your statement that their technologies are “just marketing”.

do you have specific objective evidence to support this conclusion or is this a subjective conclusion you’ve come to over time.

the “technologies” mentioned in their “marketing” make some specific claims with regard to material and thickness specifications as a means of differentiating them from “regular tires”…. are you suggesting that none of that is in fact true? that the tires do not have these different added layers and materials?

trying to cut through brand perception variabilities and stick to facts. thx.

Show me those specifics, please. They will fall into one of the categories below. Beyond this it will be your level of experience and understanding that will determine how much of the claim you consider to be functionally real or ... marketing bullshit.

Puncture resistance is a property that comes about via a number of areas. The lowest level of protection is to decrease the thread count on the tire. You see this primarily on downhill tires. If you have some experience with bicycle tires - particularly with respect to cycling, you will have become familiar with the tpi counds, and what is considered desirable on a bicycle. A road bike is going to find 120 and the rare 160 tpi to allow the thinnest casing with the most supple performance. A 30 tpi casing is the opposite. Its more of a thick hide and prior to ebikes was used primarily with downhill tires that needed to absorb enormous stresses. If you research this I can't see anyone disagreeing with that point. So if a tire is 30 tpi then it has a modicum of puncture resistance purely because its a little thicker and more durable.

Another level, that will vary entirely by tire, is to simply put more rubber on the tread side (thickness). Thats generally fine so long as there are no gaps. And since there always are, you'll often find nails have a way of finding said gaps. I'll class this as marketing, as while there may be thick parts there are also very thin ones. A great example of this is the Chaoyang Sandstorm which has a super thick tread that is long-wearing, but the lines in between the tread are super thin. I stopped using these tires because of the frequency of flats as the tires seemingly never saw a nail they didn't want to get stabbed with, and the thick tread was useless to stop them.

The next level is usually going to be found via the tires designated with an e25 or e50 certification. The number is the max km/h speed the tire is rated for. Here again, protection is applied via thicker rubber, with e50 tires being more substantial than e25. But the thicker casing is more aimed at performance at high speed than it is at flatproofing. Still, it achieves a similar benefit to a 30 tpi tire without going to 30 tpi. A good example of this would be the Schwalbe Crazy Bob, that has no belts but is a thick, strong e50 tire. I've never flatted with any e50 tire, but THAT is subjective and you already said you hate that . Worth noting: Many e50 tires have puncture-resistant belts but that is not necessary to get an e50 designation.

Up past that, is a tire with extra casing layers to provide flatproofing. Perhaps the most hi profile member in the cycling community is the Schwalbe Pickup. Its a tire designed for very high loads - cargo bikes - but it has no under-tread puncture resistance belts. Still, this is the first tire on the list that has features specific to puncture resistance that are truly effective.

Next we get into belts. This is where a tire becomes genuinely puncture-resistant. Tires with belts can be e25, e50 or have no such rating. Belts can be thin, thick or made up of different materials. If there is a famous tire in this category its the Schwalbe Marathon Plus that is effectively flatproof. Not so hi profile is the Continental Contact Plus City which is a direct competitor to the Schwalbe and which used to be much cheaper.

Thats it for determining the puncture resistance of a tire. Whats left is for you to understand whether a manufacturer's claim is worth anything in real life. Add to that some experience: Fat tires are heavy. Learn how much they tend to weigh. Look at the weight of the tire you are reviewing. Is there enough added weight to lend credence to a claim? Is a claim of magical casing properties credible on a cheap tire from Durkadurkastan? I obviously made that up... Bottom line is experience counts, and an old saying applies here: keep an open mind, but not so open your brains fall out.

 

[m@Robertson]

Maybe I should have done the short version: I know these tires from these manufacturers because I have used them myself for many thousands of miles and they are simply low cost, decent tires and nothing more. they eat nails just like any other basic tire.

Also... you posted info that is irrelevant to the original poster's question... which was about fat tires. Look for the puncture belts in that link of yours and see if any of them are on a fat tire. goes back to my first post on why those don't exist.

 

[rawlus]

Maybe I should have done the short version: I know these tires from these manufacturers because I have used them myself for many thousands of miles and they are simply low cost, decent tires and nothing more. they eat nails just like any other basic tire.

Also... you posted info that is irrelevant to the original poster's question... which was about fat tires. Look for the puncture belts in that link of yours and see if any of them are on a fat tire. goes back to my first post on why those don't exist.

i made the comment earlier that my wife’s lectric stepthru has a 20” x 3” fat tire from chaoyang with the colored labeling for dino skin with a breaker measurement. to be clear, i’m not claiming the tires are nail
proof or even that they are above average quality.

i am merely responding to the OP’s ACTUAL question about the tires provided on Lectric XP 2.0 bikes from Direct experience, since i have one, with tires on it from the factory, and they are marked indicating they include dino skin nylon + 3mm rubber breaker. Dino skin is listed in the link i shared earlier as one of several technologies chaoyang uses specific to “puncture resistance”…. however, the web lists dino skin with Kevlar 3 breaker and the label on my tire indicates nylon and rubber breaker - since this is an OEM tire and not retail i can see them building something outside of their retail line, Shark skin in their line uses nylon so perhaps this is a shark/dino variant that is not as high grade as the kevlar stuff. As you said, it is up to the owner who reads that to interpret as they may, and to trust as they will. I am running the chaoyangs at the recommended pressure of 35psi

im not trying to be difficult here, i’m not even stating as a fact that dino skin does in fact prevent or reduce punctures. I have not cut the tires to inspect the profile and analyze the accuracy of the specifications.

i cannot answer that for all variables, and i can go all meta and even ponder what does “puncture resistant“ really even mean, how is it quantified, etc.

to the OP, the chaoyang tires on the Lectric bike are marked with specifics as to their tech. and as i mentioned in the beginning, i still use a liner and tube sealant. i have had no flats or anything close to one for several hundred miles on mixed gravel, roadside pavement, paved rail trails and packed dirt.

 

[velos]

I don't think you can find real puncture resistant 20x3 or 20x4 tires offered by most ebikes.

As a solution, go with motorcycle tires. Make sure it is 16x3 size which fit perfectly for Lectric 2.0. 16x3 is close to 20x3, I would say the same size. I haven't tried yet, but here is the guy from youtube who has this installation -

Quick search on amazon.
Shinko 16x3 motorcycle tires - https://www.amazon.com/Shinko-244-Dual-Sport-Front/dp/B001CDC1TC/ref=sr_1_3?dchild=1&keywords=motorcycle+tires+16x3&qid=1633636490&sr=8-3&th=1
Kenda motorcycle tube 16x2.75/3 - https://www.amazon.com/Kenda-05163420-2-Motorcycle-3-00-16-Straight/dp/B086PGC5L4/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=kenda+2.75/3.0-16&qid=1631379657&sr=8-1

Fenders has to be removed by the way because of the tire thickness.

 

[YaHeyDere]

Thanks, @velos ! I've been wondering what size motorcycle tire would fit on our rims. Looks like Pandafoo is pretty happy with the tire swap, from his positive comments in his later videos, though he had to futz with the rear fender to keep it from rubbing on the tire.

The Duro HF319 3.50-16 motorcycle tire appears to be a less knobby alternative. An Amazon reviewer was able to fit it onto a Juiced Hyperscorpion ebike, which comes with 20x4.25" (puncture-resistant) bike-measurement tires.