2019–2020 R&M Homage : Riders' Impressions

[Deleted member 18083]

The Delight is such an energetic and athletic bike and I actually like the 11-speed Shimano XT 8000 derailleur… an incredibly quick and fun bike to ride with a peppy personality.

Richard …
Late this afternoon I spent an hour on my Trek Powerfly 5 (same Performance Line CX motor but with 10-speed derailleur and no rear suspension).

'Lively' is the best word to describe the experience. It was like being back in my early-1970s short wheelbase Land Cruiser FJ40. Not for a moment was I permitted to forget that I was on a rough trail. Every bump was accentuated. Oh, so fast! So exhilarating!

And now the sun's gone down and I'm at my computer and my Ride with GPS record shows that the Powerfly was actually 5–10% slower than the Homage on a similar ride!

The upside was changing down through the gears on really steep slopes – no need to slacken off. If singletrack riding were 'my thing' (it isn't!), I'd choose an 11-speed derailleur with a dinner plate-sized sprocket.
… David
Trek Powerfly 5 : 4658 km

 

[e Kiwi]

@David Berry Many thanks for the detailed answers.

My 2018 Homage Rohloff allows me to pedal at a cadence of 90 while gliding down a hill at 35 mph (56 KMPH), which is quite fast enough. As a further point of reference, while on flat ground, in sport (the HS does not have EMTB) mode,

Hi Alaskan. I notice you have the HS model. I am wondering if you would comment on how the HS model has performed for you, what prompted you to gett a HS model over the CX motor version. What do you think are the plus and minus points for the HS model over the CX version. Thanks

 

[Alaskan]

I use my bike for fun and also as my principal vehicle. The HS allows me to pedal at close to if not equal speed to other vehicles on the road. This is a significant safety factor. It is also just more plain fun than a bike that tops out at 20 mph (in reality 18.5 mph). I don't travel at higher speed on every ride but it sure is great having the option.

The HS version lacks the impressive boost you feel with a CX but keeps going past 20 mph. I live near the top of a steep hill so every ride ends with a climb. We have two bikes with the HS motor (a 2018 Homage and a 2019 Homage and two with the CX (a Cube Touring Hybrid and Riese & Muller Delight Mountain) so I do have reasonable points of comparison. Both of the HS bikes have the Rohloff Speed Hub which, with its broad gear range the Rohloff in the lower gears is just fine climbing hills, not quite as effortless or eager as the CX. but just fine. The Rohloff's top gears allow full and useful exploitation of the speed capabilities of the HS motor. The CX bikes both have Shimano XT 8000 Shadow Plus 11 speed drive trains. Riding an HS does spoil a person's enjoyment of the CX as the 20 mph limit becomes almost insufferable.

The best of both worlds is attainable using a Bikespeed RS speed delimiter on a CX motor. You get zip of the CX, with its 20% more torque, for a sportier, more athletic performance with assistance continuing as high as you can spin in top gear. I not only added the Bikespeed but I also replaced the 15 tooth front chain ring with a 16 tooth one to give me higher gearing making utilization of the higher speeds sustainable and changed rear cassettes from 11-42 to 11-46 tooth to recapture the hill climbing. The price you must pay for such a no compromise set up is loss of manufacturer's warranty on the motor. I can tell you from experience, it makes for the best, most fun performance and utility...for me, it is worth the risk.

 

[e Kiwi]

Thank you so much for your detailed reply. This was just the answer I was looking for. It is amazing how ones head gets in the way while one is waiting patiently (yeah, sure) for ones Homage to arrive. For a moment there I thought I had ordered the wrong version but your reply has allowed my head to come back to the straight and narrow. The weather here in New Zealand is lovely sunny autumn days (with little wind) ... absolutely perfect for long rides in the sun. Thanks.

 

[lerxst]

Alaskan, I’m hoping to take delivery of a dealer demo 2018 R&M Delight Mountain Rohloff, CX motor in a few weeks. No belt drive, just a single speed chain. Do you think if you had the rohloff system, you’d still have wanted to change the chain ring and cassette? Or in that situation would you only change the sprocket, because of the rohloff’s wide gear range?

 

[Alaskan]

Alaskan, I’m hoping to take delivery of a dealer demo 2018 R&M Delight Mountain Rohloff, CX motor in a few weeks. No belt drive, just a single speed chain. Do you think if you had the rohloff system, you’d still have wanted to change the chain ring and cassette? Or in that situation would you only change the sprocket, because of the rohloff’s wide gear range?

If the Delight Mountain had the Rohloff no change would be needed as it already has a very wide ratio range. Putting a larger front sprocket increases the ration of the smallest gear. Putting a cassette with a gear with more teeth on the largest sprocket lowers the gear ration for the lowest gear. The 11-42 cassette has a gear range of 381%, the 11-46 gear range is 418% The gear range on the Rohloff is 526%.

If you wanted to really boost the gear range on a delight without the high cost of a Rohloff an option would be the Sram 12 speed Eagle set up with a 1-50 tooth cassette which has a 500% range.

My suggestion is just ride it. If you don't derestrict the CX to go faster than 20mph, you really won't need to change anything as it will reach 20 mph with ease and is geared low enough to climb almost any hill. It only becomes necessary to add a tooth or two to the front chain ring if you want to increase the top end and be able to pedal at a comfortable cadence at 22-28 mph speeds. Once you add the tooth on the front putting a cassette with a higher tooth number for the lowest gear is needed to regain the steep hill climbing ability. If you live where there are not steep hills, that may not be needed.

Be careful adding too many teeth on the front chain ring. I have heard rumors that Bosch now senses this and disables the motor if you put on a ring with too many teeth. I went from a 15 tooth front chain ring to a 16 tooth without a problem.

 

[lerxst]

I’ve got a Trek Powerfly Speed HS right now and routinely go above 20mph, so I do plan on derestricting the Delight. Thanks for the info!

 

[lerxst]

Where did you buy your 16t chain ring? Have a part number maybe?

 

[Deleted member 18083]

Bosch eBike Connect …
Now available for download from the Australian iPhone App Store – nine months after it was so enthusiastically announced by Riese & Müller.

Connecting the Kiox to the app was not too difficult. I'll add comments before long.

 

[Norm Harrris]

Bosch eBike Connect …
Now available for download from the Australian iPhone App Store – nine months after it was so enthusiastically announced by Riese & Müller.

Connecting the Kiox to the app was not too difficult. I'll add comments before long.

Bosch eBike Connect now also available in US iOS App Store!!

 

[Alaskan]

and the google play store in the USA as well

 

[Norm Harrris]

Bosch eBike Connect …
Now available for download from the Australian iPhone App Store – nine months after it was so enthusiastically announced by Riese & Müller.

Connecting the Kiox to the app was not too difficult. I'll add comments before long.

David-I can connect my Kiox to the eBike Connect app via Bluetooth, but no data is transferred after a ride. It says syncing has occurred but again no info is communicated. Have you had better success?

 

[Deleted member 18083]

David-I can connect my Kiox to the eBike Connect app via Bluetooth, but no data is transferred after a ride. It says syncing has occurred but again no info is communicated. Have you had better success?

Norm …
My Homage has been out of action for almost three weeks so I haven't been able to check the Kiox/eBike Connect combo.

I slashed the wall of the rear tyre – a case of a razor rock on the rail trail destroying a Rock Razor. After waiting for two weeks, I ordered a replacement tyre from Germany and it will go on tomorrow and then I'll be able to try out Kiox plus eBike Connect.

With the rear wheel off, the Kiox displayed an error message (presumably, because it couldn't find the E-14 Rohloff), so I proceeded no further than pairing the Kiox with the app on my iPhone.

Hopefully, the Homage will be back to normal tomorrow.
… David

 

[Norm Harrris]

Wow! Best of luck with repairs.

 

[David Roy]

I wondered why there were no recent photos with the Homage. I’m very interested in that bike. Seems ideal for the riding I like to do and would open up new trails and roads that are too rough for my current bike. Thank you for your review of it. I look forward to your comments on the Kiox.

 

[Shawthorn]

Norm,
I had the same problems with the KIOX/eConnect not showing ride data.
However, about 24 hours after I first connected the KIOX to the app, I was prompted to install an update on the KIOX. This took some time to install, but I successfully managed to upgrade the firmware to 1.0.4.3.
After this, my ride data did appear in the app and web platform.
My only problem was getting the KIOX to pair with my phone (android) It must have taken at least 20 attempts before this worked. When paired, the KIOX seems to recognise the phone very quickly, and I now see the mobile phone icon and what looks like a GPS icon in the KIOX display alongside the bike battery icons . The GPS icon flashes orange periodically - presumably when it is syncing data to the phone.

 

[Deleted member 18083]

Fitting the Rock Razor (tubeless) was not too difficult – third time lucky.

Note how the tyre labels are not lined up with the valve (mandatory according to the style police); that's where the pressure recommendations (always near-impossible to find or read) are sited!

 

[Deleted member 18083]

One small step for Kiox …
Bosch's recently-released eBike Connect app allows updates to be made to what is displayed on Kiox's screen; for example, the rider's average cadence and power are now shown.

It must be stressed that the changes are those determined by Bosch. We do not have any choice in the matter; for example, we cannot choose what data is displayed on the various 'pages' that we scroll through whilst riding – a feature that is commonly available on bike computers.

When Rohloff gear changes are made, the new gear choice is now displayed in a small font (previously minuscule) against an unnecessarily busy background (no change).

An improvement? Technically, yes. In reality, major flaws have been reduced to lesser flaws.

The Kiox remains a work in progress. The progress is glacial.

Rides : 92 / Distance : 5711 km

 

[Deleted member 18083]

Satnav tracking with Kiox …
My understanding has been that satnav tracking on Bosch's eBike Connect is only available for the fortunate few with Nyon.

One day (but no one's promising) satnav integration might be available for Kiox. So be it; or so I thought.

And then this following today's 102 km ride…

After 69 km, I stopped at Kholo Gardens for nineteen minutes (sufficiently long for the Kiox to switch off). Afterwards, I powered up and rode the long way home.

There's nothing special about the map compared with what I'm accustomed to with other apps – there's even a section of the ride missing between first and second maps – but it is more than I was expecting (which was nothing).

 

[ottomark]

Well, I didn't even know the app was yet available. Thanks for that. Will use it on my next ride.