The Future of eBikes: How Fast is Too Fast?

I saw my first National Park Ranger on the rail trail this week. He was riding a recumbent with a "RANGER" sign on the back of the seat. Rangers here are law enforcement officers, so they can detain offenders, impound vehicles, call town or state cops, etc. I slowed down when I passed him 😅
 
A few of the kids I see on the trail would do a wheelstand on their Surron as they passed. Not much chance of catching him with a recumbent. :rolleyes:
 
Suronster is probably the most infuential 'safe' influencer for road riding high power emotorcycles.
He has covered the Bonnell CYC powered mountain bike and his surprise is genuine, you can see deep down he wants to be accepted by society, but of course its still ludicrously overpowered and very dangerous on shared trails.
But now hes involved you are going to see a surge of these on the trails with riders trying to justify them because of
the way they look, of course no one is going to be fooled, these are 6KW bikes.
But I will admit, I would love one if we had dedicated trails for them, which isnt going to happen.
You can see him on the trails interacting with legal bikers frrom around 5min onwards
It is restricted to 30mph in 'street' use, but has a race mode as well.
This motor and battery are 2 grand to buy as a kit, you can fit it to any mtb that can squeeze the battery in the frame

 
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The fastest I've gone on my race bike is 63mph (indicated). At the front of the field, closed caravan. I also worked as an official at the Tour of Utah when Sepp Kuss rode away from the field solo for the GC win. Descending into Park City, he hit 74mph. My driver was smoking the tires in the switchbacks. Scared the crap out of me.
 
Chargeride said:
But I will admit, I would love one if we had dedicated trails for them, which isnt going to happen.
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Moto/4x4 trails have existed for a long time, and bikes like the Surron/Talaria would be great on them! But if you mean new moto trails at places that only have hiking and MTB trails, no, probably not. Most managing agencies and volunteers from other user groups have been fighting motos poaching and tearing up trails for decades and their opinion of moto riders are (in my experience) extremely negative. If the Surron guys want to get together and work on access and trail building, more power to them, but from what I see they aren't really interested in doing the work and have a massive uphill battle ahead to build a positive image of themselves if they ever wanted to start.

Certainly possible! Skateboarders did it in the late 90s-2000s. But not easy and wouldn't be fast.
 
kevinmccune said:
had fantasies of MBTs around here,the forest service was not interested,then reality checked in.
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When I was younger we did a lot of riding on forest service roads on our motorcycles but there were restrictions in some areas due to risk of fire (sparks from the exhaust). At least there is no concern of that from the ebikes.
 
Mr. Coffee said:
One of the things a lot of people miss about the non-street-legal electric bikes is the liability issue.

On one side, if somebody hits you with a motor vehicle and injures you, chances are you are SOL on getting any compensation from them or their insurance because you were operating an illegal vehicle. To some extent that depends on the state though.

If you, god forbid, cause an accident with your illegal bike than you are in for a universe of pain and suffering. Chances are whatever insurance you have won't help you, and chances are when you get sued you will lose and lose badly. Given what even modest personal injury payouts can be chances are that you will lose your home and your retirement savings and be squeezed dry by lawyers. Oh, did I mention the legal fees you'll have to pay to defend yourself? Nobody will help you with those either.

So even if something isn't "enforceable" by a cop on the bike path you could still find yourself in a world of hurt when things go wrong. That also means if you bought an illegal bike for your precious little offspring to ride to school you could also be sued into the dirt.

For myself I'd rather pay fines and have my bike confiscated than be on the losing side of a personal injury lawsuit.
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Yep. Insurers have no sense of humor. If the claim can be denied, under any law or municipal ruling, it will be.
 
stompandgo said:
The fastest I've gone on my race bike is 63mph (indicated). At the front of the field, closed caravan. I also worked as an official at the Tour of Utah when Sepp Kuss rode away from the field solo for the GC win. Descending into Park City, he hit 74mph. My driver was smoking the tires in the switchbacks. Scared the crap out of me.
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In the big descents around here the sides of the switchbacks are lined with rusted barbed wire. It is like an evil human cheese cutter.
 
Ads for Charlie’s Electric Bike of Encinitas, CA used to be a common sight on the EBR pages served to me.

Screenshot_20251126_160024_Chrome.jpg


Accidently clicked on one recently and got a very sad notice, quoted verbatim below. The upshot: Illegal e-motorcycles sold as "ebikes" are driving legal ebikes out of this market.

Hello Encinitas,

Charlie’s Electric Bike will be closing. Niko’s original vision of bringing an e-bike store to Encinitas began in 2017 and grew steadily—especially during the Covid era. It is with a heavy heart that I share this news: my views on e-bikes no longer align with much of the industry, particularly when it comes to youth riders. I’ve been outspoken about this, and I continue to believe it’s an important issue.

To succeed as a bike shop in Encinitas today, you need to sell what are essentially electric motorcycles marketed toward kids. These machines are not bicycles—they’re illegal for street use. If you’re considering an e-bike for street riding, please make sure it’s classified as a Class 1, 2, or 3 e-bike. Anything outside these classes is most likely an unlicensed motorcycle.

Kids: if you’re reading this, ride safely, and always be aware of your surroundings—even on a Class 1 e-bike.

Parents: please reconsider buying your child an e-bike to ride in traffic alongside cars.

In our absence, we recommend Leucadia Cyclery for servicing the brands we’ve sold over the years. Jeff, the owner, is knowledgeable about both bikes and e-bikes. You can reach them at 760-436-2786.

Thank you, Encinitas, for allowing Charlie’s Electric Bike to serve you—both in helping you choose the right e-bike and in keeping your bikes rolling.

— Niko Sougias
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This was a big shop on a prime corner lot in downtown Encinitas. They sold a wide range of quality ebikes, including Gazelle and Reise & Muller. I shopped there for accessories now and then. And now it's gone.
 
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I would avoid to ride on the streets with the traffic with a restricted 1, 2 or 3 class e-bike - it is too slow and too underpowered to be safe on the streets. On the streets you need to be able to move at least at car speeds or faster and be able to accelerate fast enough at least like a car and keep up with the traffic. It is misconception that slow and underpowered bikes are safer on the streets - those underpowered class 1, 2 and 3 e-bikes are more dangerous on the streets than overpowered e-bikes.
 
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TPEHAK said:
I would avoid to ride on the streets with the traffic with a restricted 1, 2 or 3 class e-bike - it is too slow and too underpowered to be safe on the streets. On the streets you need to be able to move at least at car speeds or faster and be able to accelerate fast enough at least like a car and keep up with the traffic. It is misconception that slow and underpowered bikes are safer on the streets - those underpowered class 1, 2 and 3 e-bikes are more dangerous on the streets than overpowered e-bikes.
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that’s quite a generalization and i doubt there is any evidence to support this. there IS a growing body of evidence that injuries sustained on bikes going 20+ are far more severe than those typically sustained on riding bikes at slower urban speeds.

the answer is better infrastructure (protected bike lanes), better enforcement of the laws that exist (e.g. cars needing to give you 3 feet to pass, bicycles being allowed to take the lane where it’s unsafe to pass, full stops at red lights before turning etc), and cyclists knowing and obeying the laws where their behavior affects pedestrians and drivers.
 
This may well be true and I would feel much safer at traffic speeds, but Ive also ridden a motorbike for forty years and I didnt get to ride that motorbike through parks or shared paths.

I had one pedestrian accident in that time when someone ran out into the traffic without looking and the impact broke his leg.

Im pretty sure at 18 years old on a 30mph ebike that could be ridden in such areas my crash count would have dramatically increased
 
mschwett said:
that’s quite a generalization and i doubt there is any evidence to support this. there IS a growing body of evidence that injuries sustained on bikes going 20+ are far more severe than those typically sustained on riding bikes at slower urban speeds.

the answer is better infrastructure (protected bike lanes), better enforcement of the laws that exist (e.g. cars needing to give you 3 feet to pass, bicycles being allowed to take the lane where it’s unsafe to pass, full stops at red lights before turning etc), and cyclists knowing and obeying the laws where their behavior affects pedestrians and drivers.
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The major threat on the streets is not going 20+, but cars behind you and around you when you are going 20-
 
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