Thoughts Of An Experienced E-Biker

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I’ve only made it to page 7 here, and I don’t want to make a hasty judgement, but can we get “mature” (as in adult, sensible…) back in the title of this thread?

And veering dangerously back on topic, what are the prefered methods of addressing numbness in hands on longer rides? I’ve changed to wider, more supportive grips (helped some), started wearing gloves with some palm padding, and until now (well an hour ago when I started reading this wandering thread), I was thinking about raising the handle bar height 1-2” and maybe changing the bars to bring the grips back a bit.

I’ve considered innerbar ends, but not sure how they would fit with everything else on the bars. Anyone got pics of them on a Specialized bike? Other thoughts from those who have addressed this issue?
Thanks,
Rich
 

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I’ve changed to wider, more supportive grips (helped some), started wearing gloves with some palm padding, and until now (well an hour ago when I started reading this wandering thread), I was thinking about raising the handle bar height 1-2” and maybe changing the bars to bring the grips back a bit.
Are your wrists in a neutral position?
 
Are your wrists in a neutral position?
I’m a complete rookie so I really don’t know. Is there a diagram somewhere on proper position? My wrists are bent slightly with my hands bent back (up) a bit, and I’m putting a lot of pressure on my hands (palms mainly) I believe because my bars are too low, but lets not get into all that.

Its a new Spec Tero BTW. I’ve been mostly desert riding which involves some easy dirt/gravel cruising, mostly bad roads, and torn up 4x4 tracks (with very deep, narrow wheel ruts/bike traps), with a lot of big rocks to dodge, sometimes constantly, and a lot of washes to cross, which are fun, but usually involve some sudden drops before an immediate climb out the other side. I could just cruise around on easy roads for less than 10 miles and experience no ill efffects but I’m easily bored and the trails call. So my hands are usually numb around mile seven or so.

I found this pic of the same bike with innerbar ends on a Johnson H bar but I also have a mirror on the left side which I really like. So adding the innerbar ends would really start to clutter the cockpit (still getting used to calling it that but we must have our nomenclature). But many times while riding I find myself thinking they would be helpful.
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This is mine - not as sexy but not as cluttered either. On the bike above there is no control for a dropper because he changed it out to a Redshift suspension post, but the control shared the same mount as the brake lever so that didn’t free any space. I tried all three possibilities for the mirror and the one pictured works best for me. But I’m open to suggestions.
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Getting your hands so they are in line with your forearm will probably help. The hand bent back is not a good thing. I can't take a picture of my grips because my bike is stored for the winter, but there are grips that will give you a much flatter contact surface and you can turn the grip to better align your hand with your forearm.

Added: if you ride with a death grip, that won't help either.
 
And veering dangerously back on topic, what are the prefered methods of addressing numbness in hands on longer rides? I’ve changed to wider, more supportive grips (helped some), started wearing gloves with some palm padding, and until now (well an hour ago when I started reading this wandering thread), I was thinking about raising the handle bar height 1-2” and maybe changing the bars to bring the grips back a bit.

hand numbness is probably the number one complaint on long rides, and the solution varies quite a bit depending on the rider and bike. for many, moving the seat back, tipping it up a tiny bit, and building core strength help. the key is to get the weight off the hands - it should be on your legs, and thus the pedals. some instinctively want to move the bars/grips up to solve the issue, but paradoxically that may make you lean on the bars even more.
 
hand numbness is probably the number one complaint on long rides, and the solution varies quite a bit depending on the rider and bike. for many, moving the seat back, tipping it up a tiny bit, and building core strength help. the key is to get the weight off the hands - it should be on your legs, and thus the pedals. some instinctively want to move the bars/grips up to solve the issue, but paradoxically that may make you lean on the bars even more.
 
The Jones bar is the solution for me. I raised the bars and have them swept back to me. My seat is the right height so I sit and ride like on a motorcycle. Along with a Cloud 9 seat, Schwalbe balloon Big Ben tires, suspension seat post, and front suspension forks, this bike rides very smooth. I do 25-30 miles every other day in the summer no problem. I'm 73.
 

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yes I see so many people with their levers level I usually set them so my finger rests on the brake lever without bending.
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I just lowered mine a bit more and with rotating the grips a bit more I have a more or less neutral wrist position. Heading out for 10-15 miles of new desert trails today. Hopefully it will help.
 
Exactly what I was looking for - I was definitely in the #1 position - now I’m in the neighborhood of #3. I like the H-bar but want to try to get it right without making a major change yet. I only have 140 miles on the bike so I’m not ready to abandon the stock bars yet.

On another note, Im going to try a bigger chain ring - probably 40t as with the Canadian version. They both have the same 11-42 cassett, but for whatever reason (?) the US version comes with a 36t chainring. I have more than enough low gearing but quickly run out of gears in the top end. The will be a quick swap (same chain I’m told…) that I can easily change back if I don’t like it or I find my self in need of my current ratios.

Canadian Version:

Chainrings 40T (doesn’t specify brand/part # but pic shows Praxis)
Chain KMC e11T, 11-speed w/ Missing Link™
Cassette SRAM PG-1130, 11-speed, 11-42t
Rear Derailleur SRAM GX, long cage, 11-speed

US Version:

Chainrings Praxis, 36T, 104BCD
Chain KMC e11T, 11-speed w/ Missing Link™
Cassette SRAM PG-1130, 11-speed, 11-42t
Rear Derailleur SRAM GX, long cage, 11-speed

Can anyone explain that to me?
 
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Exactly what I was looking for - I was definitely in the #1 position - now I’m in the neighborhood of #3. I like the H-bar but want to try to get it right without making a major change yet. I only have 140 miles on the bike so I’m not ready to abandon the stock bars yet.

On another note, Im going to try a bigger chain ring - probably 40t as with the Canadian version. They both have the same 11-42 cassett, but for whatever reason (?) the US version comes with a 36t chainring. I have more than enough low gearing but quickly run out of gears in the top end. The will be a quick swap (same chain I’m told…) that I can easily change back if I don’t like it or I find my self in need of my current ratios.

Canadian Version:

Chainrings 40T (doesn’t specify brand/part # but pic shows Praxis)
Chain KMC e11T, 11-speed w/ Missing Link™
Cassette SRAM PG-1130, 11-speed, 11-42t
Rear Derailleur SRAM GX, long cage, 11-speed

US Version:

Chainrings Praxis, 36T, 104BCD
Chain KMC e11T, 11-speed w/ Missing Link™
Cassette SRAM PG-1130, 11-speed, 11-42t
Rear Derailleur SRAM GX, long cage, 11-speed

Can anyone explain that to me?

they must think americans ride up more hills or something, or are heavier and weaker, lol.

changing one praxis chainring for another would be a very, very easy thing to do, as you’ve been advised. you might need a longer chain, but hopefully not.
 
and I’m putting a lot of pressure on my hands (palms mainly)
This is one of the MANY reasons that the "crotch rocket" lean forward biking position doesn't work for me.

A lot of people will focus on the hand position -- and yes it's important -- but if you feel like you're putting enough pressure on your hands it's worthy of mention, you're likely off balance, leaning too far forward, and aren't young enough to "put up with it" like a lot of folks who advocate for skinny seats and straight bars.

As someone who works in accessibility and ergonomics in the workplace, (and for websites) I'll say it again, this "sporty" lean the f**** forwards "everyone should ride like they're a pro racer" bullshit does more harm than good, and reeks of the same type of snake oil peddling rubbish as those knee-busting "ergonomic" chairs from the '90's or the "standing table" rubbish that's all hot and trendy right now.
Irregardless of how many effete, pretentious, holier than thou snobs and marks get their panties in a knot or "want to puke" over the mere idea of riding upright.

If you've got that much pressure, you're probably also stressing the elbows and shoulder. In fact if you're riding with your arms out straight, you are guaranteed hurting more than just your hands.

Are your arms out straight? Your bars are too far forward.

Pressure on your hands relying on grip instead of light friction with them just resting on the bars? Bars are too far forwards and you're leaning forwards too far.

Are you waking up the next day with pain from the Altas (c1) down to C5? You're leaning too far forward and looking up to see ahead is the cause.

Excessive pain in the coccyx whenever you get off the bike? That's skinny seat and leaning too far forwards at fault. Something I experience first-hand as I'm just not built for those wafer thin narrow seats. Because the whole "sitz bones" thing is a bunch of predatory bull when leaning that far forward, and your weight ends up distributed on the perennial and through the soft tissues straight to the coccyx and sacrum instead! Said "logic" of leaning forwards only working for people 6 foot tall or more with the BMI of an Indian cow or Auschwitz survivor.

And that's another thing to beware of, It's not just the pain while riding, it's the pain caused by riding. You can do a lot of damage with bad posture that doesn't show up until the next morning.

If you are fully extending the legs whilst pedaling, you're risking injury. If you are fully extending the arms whilst riding, you're rising injury. If you have to crank your head back just to see straight ahead, you're risking injury and limiting range of motion. And thus sacrificing situational awareness.

It reminds me of the people who plaster their face 6" from their computer's display with their keyboard way up atop the desk, who then wonder why their eyesight is shot and they have both back problems and carpel tunnel and/or repetitive motion injury... as opposed to a comfortable 3 feet with the keyboard at minimum 5" over your lap, ideally ON your lap.

Basic real anatomy and ergonomics, not the garbage doublespeak market-talk used to peddle cheaper corner cut mass manufacture trash to you! As if it's some miracle cure-all because it's what some sports star uses.

We're not all sports stars. Honestly since I've gotten back into bicycle tech the past two years, the amount of outright gibberish unfounded claims that would/should make any doctor cringe is only rivalled by the likes of Paltrow's "Goop", Oz's hoodoo supplements, or the "healthiness" advice of that dirtbag calling himself an avocado.

Who knew the spandex wearing "cycling life" crowd were as gullible as the fools buying "organic foods", railing against GMO's, making up nonsensical chazerei like "gluten intolerance"? To the point we now have packages of chicken -- CHICKEN -- labelled "gluten free"

Oh wait, the people selling bicycle accessories. They knew. Ah the power of propaganda and arbitrary societal norms.
 
I sometimes ride with a local bike club and most members are seniors. About half are riding the ebikes with the hidden battery. Made to look like a water bottle. But, some of these good folks are still riding on butt floss hard seats, narrow tires, and leaning forward. We ride around 25 miles on adverage on these trips and you know this can't possibly be comfortable for them. I show up on my big fat Cloud 9 seat, sitting straight up and using super comfy Jones h bars. I ride along on balloon tires, under inflated by 5 lbs. and it's a breeze. No body pain at the end of the ride at all. I hope more people will be swayed into not biking like a road warrior that's training for the the Tour de France but like a person enjoying the fun of biking. Riding any bike, especially an ebike, should not be a painful experience but pure pleasure.
 
I sometimes ride with a local bike club and most members are seniors. About half are riding the ebikes with the hidden battery. Made to look like a water bottle. But, some of these good folks are still riding on butt floss hard seats, narrow tires, and leaning forward. We ride around 25 miles on adverage on these trips and you know this can't possibly be comfortable for them. I show up on my big fat Cloud 9 seat, sitting straight up and using super comfy Jones h bars. I ride along on balloon tires, under inflated by 5 lbs. and it's a breeze. No body pain at the end of the ride at all. I hope more people will be swayed into not biking like a road warrior that's training for the the Tour de France but like a person enjoying the fun of biking. Riding any bike, especially an ebike, should not be a painful experience but pure pleasure.
Don't count on them being uncomfortable. Narrow seats keep your thighs from pushing on them. some weight on your hands keeps some weight off your sit bones. if you ride a lot a soft and fat seat will cause its own issues. I ride uptown 250 miles a week I put a lot of effort into peddling. a wide seat kills me in the long run. it all depends on how much effort you put into cycling. it takes time to get used to a narrow seat tis not instant but the rewards are long term and the ability to be hours on it. a bike is not a couch.
 
Don't count on them being uncomfortable. Narrow seats keep your thighs from pushing on them. some weight on your hands keeps some weight off your sit bones. if you ride a lot a soft and fat seat will cause its own issues. I ride uptown 250 miles a week I put a lot of effort into peddling. a wide seat kills me in the long run. it all depends on how much effort you put into cycling. it takes time to get used to a narrow seat tis not instant but the rewards are long term and the ability to be hours on it. a bike is not a couch.
I agree with @fooferdoggie. If you are putting in a fair amount of effort, a saddle that supports your sit bones is actually the most comfortable and any weight being put onto your hands is removing that weight from your but, (moderation is the key). Your core muscles can also relieve some hand pressure.

It doesn’t have to be all or nothing. If you are relying on the motor for most of the propulsion, then upright and sitting on your gluteus muscles is probably fine. This doesn’t mean that if you are providing most of the propulsion that you have to ride in a time trial position. Some forward lean provides a more engaged and balanced riding position and allows you to go out of saddle. It also lowers your center of gravity and moves it forward, which increases stability while lowering your wind resistance. If you simply cannot ride with a forward lean, then you shouldn’t. It’s better to ride upright than not to ride. It’s better to ride with 100% motor than to sit on the couch or drive an internal combustion vehicle.

I am 67 and have had serious back and neck injuries and surgeries. I can’t ride in a very aggressive position anymore, but I do ride with my bars at close to the height of my saddle with is fairly stiff and narrow, (a Fizik Aliante). It works for me and everyone should feel free to do what works for them. The thing is that physics and comfort do not go hand in hand. Find the compromise that works for you.
 
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I sit upright and use very little motor usually PAS 1-2 on the steep hills after the 16 mile mtn loop still have all bars on display left on a 500 watt mag wheel bike.I have always sat upright on any bike I owned.I could sit down and pedal by guys pushing their bikes, different strokes for different folks.
Sitting bent forward is hard on the back and puts too much pressure on the hands. I didn't buy an ebike to work real hard or cause pain to myself. Why would I want to sit on a hard, unpadded seat for hours at a time? I wouldn't replace my car seat for hard plastic either. I could have stuck with an analog bike if I wanted that much exercise or that much pain. Like you said, everyone has to find their own comfort zone on these, and mine is dialed in just about perfect. I cruise at 15 mph in pos on the flats and use a little more power on the steep hills here in Wa. State. Who cares about wind resistance? This is not a racing bike and I am not looking to go to France anytime soon. Why lean into the wind? What next, buy Spandex and dump all lights, fenders, tool kits, and big puncture resistant tires just to make the bike lighter? What for? It weighs 75 lbs with all my gear. The bike has 1000 watts to overcome the extra weight and wind. I'm no roadie. I'm an experienced ebiker having a lot of fun, not trying to be competitive. Why ride like a young guy, I'm not. I'm a super senior on a very comfy cruiser!
 
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