Thoughts Of An Experienced E-Biker

[Djangodog]

What a lame ass statement that is! I ride with other ebikers in a bike club and NOBODY gets out of their seat except to stop. They have much less power on those bikes then I do. I peddle this bike the whole time, don't ever use the throttle, except at intersections, or run all battery power,ever, and I get a good workout without ever standing up. I have 1000 watts for the many steep streets we have here in the Pacific NW. The suspension is for comfort, nothing more. Why do I need to feel the bone shattering effects of potholes and rocks? These are ebikes for the paved trails and streets, not racers or hill climbing dirt bikes. These are made for cruising. If you want off-road, that's another story, but that is not what my bike is setup for. I take mine on an 8 mile gravel trail at times, up and down hills, sitting down the whole way, I have full control. Your statement only makes sense for a mtb in the dirt, climbing big hills, not the streets. I'll post a pic later.

I won’t try to explain the physics to you. If you are happy riding in a passive and unresponsive position, that’s fine.

 

[Robspace1]

I won’t try to explain the physics to you. If you are happy riding in a passive and unresponsive position, that’s fine. Lol.

Yea, I actually prefer "passive riding", much better than none passive riding. I am VERY responsive and take fast turns on the trails with no problem at all. My bike is set perfect for me by bike shop pros, using my specs. The specs are for me, not anyone else. Everyone has their own settings as to the height of bars, saddle, tires, suspension, power etc. You have to input all the personal and geographical facts before setting up any bike. Weight of rider, bike, hills to climb and type of terrain. No two are alike. All bikes need to be adjusted to each persons comfort levels. Mine is and yea, it rides as comfy as a 26" ebike can ride, with as much power as needed for big hills. You were sold a bill of goods my friend by some slick bike saleman. You need no fore and aft leans or standing up to balance a BATTERY POWERED BIKE OK? If you do, you need more juice to compensate. You got sold a weak unit. lol

 

[Djangodog]

It would appear that you know very little about bike handling. I chose my bike carefully and as an experienced cyclist.

Even with a 250 watt, 500 watt peak output, I don’t have to ride out of saddle, (I could simply use a higher assist mode). I do most of my riding in the eco mode. I regularly ride grades greater than 20%.

Riding out of saddle is as much for control as it is for power, (even with full suspension, you are better off being able to absorb shock by unweighting rather than bouncing along with the bike).

On steep climbs you need to balance fore and aft to keep traction while keeping your front wheel on the ground. On steep, rough and fast descents, you should let your front end have some float. Getting your balance right helps in a panic stop as well. Upright works for “cruising” or riding around Amsterdam, but not if you ever need to perform an evasive maneuver.

By the way, mine is not a BATTERY POWERED BIKE. It’s an “assisted” bike, OK? I have all “the juice” that I need, thanks.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

By the way, mine is not a BATTERY POWERED BIKE. It’s an “assisted” bike, OK? I have all “the juice” that I need, thanks.

I thought the American federal and local laws allowed up to 750 Watts. Sure, if someone wants to ride an illegal e-motorcycle, let them do it. Only such people are not "cyclists".
P.S. People who have hijacked this thread are on the Ignore now.

 

[m@Robertson]

Most people that ride these bikes like to make it comfortable, and that calls for suspension and softer, bigger saddles....

You are committing the same sin you are accusing others of. What you said above is simply not true. Plus like the other soapbox preacher in this thread, you don't know enough about the equipment to understand why these choices are not used by people who know what they are doing. Its not like the noobs who just do a teeny bit of riding for only a few years actually know anything. Instead, what they know is how to band-aid their problems well enough to muddle on through. And since we live in the internet era, we have to hear alllll about it.

Most people get into ebikes for the fun of it and for moderate exercise, and not to win a race or wear spandex and pretend they are 21 again.

Again, posting a personal opinion and attributing it to 'most people' is malarkey. Since thats not bad enough, lets end the same sentence with a straw man.

I typically disagree with the OP. Pretty much on everything. Just look at what he posted just above me. More of the same. That thirst for conflict is what got the thread title altered by a staffer who I am sure saw this invitation to endless argument coming a mile away.

 

[Robspace1]

I thought the American federal and local laws allowed up to 750 Watts. Sure, if someone wants to ride an illegal e-motorcycle, let them do it. Only such people are not "cyclists".
P.S. People who have hijacked this thread are on the Ignore now.

1000 watts is completely legal in the US. I peddle mine every mile I go. You can stand up, lean, tilt to the right and left, drop your head over the bars for less wind drag and look like a real real race pro, and do it all in skin tight spandex if that's you're style. Seems like an awful lot of wasted energy just to get down the street lol. If I wanted to work that hard I would go back to riding analog bikes. I'm done with this idiot discussion. I'm going riding.

 

[J.R.]

As someone with a very bad spine, 4 fusions and a lot of titanium, being able to carry my weight with my legs as needed is extremely important. The slight forward body cant of an MTB and proper position over the cranks, as well as proper leg extension allow me to ride pain free. The traditional proven MTB body position isn't severe and it allows the rider to use their legs to take any punishment the spine and backside would otherwise take. Using my legs to spin and carry the weight offers a better workout as well.

When I've rented cruiser bikes at the beach, the forward cranks, legs bent at the knees and spine straight doesn't permit me to take my weight off the saddle to prevent even the smallest bump from reaching my spine. In my opinion MTB designers are genius.

 

[Robspace1]

Well here's my feedback...
If you're going to dispense authority in a thread, and use a wall of text, you should probably use better grammar...

"more comfortable then that. Most add suspension and softer seats. If your a roadie".

Nitpik

 

[Robspace1]

As someone with a very bad spine, 4 fusions and a lot of titanium, being able to carry my weight with my legs as needed is extremely important. The slight forward body cant of an MTB and proper position over the cranks, as well as proper leg extension allow me to ride pain free. The traditional proven MTB body position isn't severe and it allows the rider to use their legs to take any punishment the spine and backside would otherwise take. Using my legs to spin and carry the weight offers a better workout as well.

When I've rented cruiser bikes at the beach, the forward cranks, legs bent at the knees and spine straight doesn't permit me to take my weight off the saddle to prevent even the smallest bump from reaching my spine. In my opinion MTB designers are genius.

I ride a mtb. It rides smooth and comfy. Raised saddle and bars made a big difference.

 

[Djangodog]

Nitpik

If Dave was nitpicking, he would have pointed out that peddling has to do with selling a bike and pedaling is what you do on a bike. Just saying.

 

[DaveMatthews]

Nitpik

It's a living...

 

[Mr. Coffee]

There are a lot of people on this site who are very opinionated about what they know and they can't imagine that anybody would do anything other than the way they do it. That's a pretty common malaise amongst the demographic that this website has attracted, honestly.

I think everybody here would do well to take a deep breath and maybe go outside and ride their bike.

 

[DaveMatthews]

There are a lot of people on this site who are very opinionated about what they know and they can't imagine that anybody would do anything other than the way they do it. That's a pretty common malaise amongst the demographic that this website has attracted, honestly.

I think everybody here would do well to take a deep breath and maybe go outside and ride their bike.

I am in agreement.

 

[kevinmccune]

I had to change to a Schwinn "No Nose" (Nose less) seat, it gave me the 4-1/2+" shorter nose length, when compared to the Cloud 9 seat, for the extra room I needed to reduce 95% of the stand over height problems of the top bar, by allowing me to slide off the seat as close as possible to the seat stem.
The Schwinn seat is a very good seat IMHO. YMMV

Think I will try one of those someday( wally World has them)

 

[kevinmccune]

You could ask why the title was changed . I thought that it was odd that it had. Maybe experienced would be acceptable. I took the title as meaning that you had been doing it for some time. Someone must have been offended, but I am not sure how.

From Merriam-Webster

Definition of mature (Entry 1 of 2)
1 : based on slow careful consideration
a mature judgment
2a(1) : having completed natural growth and development : RIPE
mature fruit
(2) : having undergone maturation
b : having attained a final or desired state
mature wine
c : having achieved a low but stable growth rate
paper is a mature industry
d : of, relating to, or being an older adult : ELDERLY
airline discounts for mature travelers
3a : of or relating to a condition of full development
a man of mature years
b : characteristic of or suitable to a mature individual
mature outlook
a show with mature content
4 : due for payment
a mature loan
5 : belonging to the middle portion of a cycle of erosion
a mature stream

I still don’t get it, but if someone wants to be offended, they will find a way.

I am supposed tp be getting elderly, dang it I don't feel elderly.

 

[kevinmccune]

Whilst I've only been e-biking for a year and a half and only owned two (well, three. First two were same make/model and were returned for controllers dying in first week) I have ridden regular bicycles for 40+ years and I really have to call bullshit on that... to a degree. Because personally? No. Just... no!

The moment I get on those wafer thin "padding what's that" narrow seats with the straight bars leaning way the hell forward, the area around my coccyx lights on fire. The pain starts out as an annoyance, and proceeds over the course of a ride up into the sacrum to the point it hurts to try and lift my ass out of the saddle. Just trying to dismount is pure agony. Likewise the neck pain of cranking the head way the hell back so I can even look where I'm going much less look-around is absurd. Do you want agonizing neck pain? Because that's how you get agonizing neck pain!

This narrow seat lean way the smeg forward garbage isn't for everyone. A lot of us just don't bend that way and have more pain -- in the first few yards just TRYING to ride that way -- than one would ever have in a comfy seat positioned upright.

The true absurdity being the mental-huffing-midgetry of saying "padding on the seat bad" and then wearing glorified diapers. As if it makes any flipping difference which side the padding is on! Is there padding between A and B? Yes. Job done.

A more common screwup is people using saddles that aren't smooth. Friction causes chafing, so the glossier, shinier, and slippery the better. A reason I can't stand spandex. Scratchy, uncomfortable, clingy, sticky when wet, itchy when dry... and people wear this stuff by choice? I'd sooner wear wool underpants!

Though I have observed a lot of riders doing crazy stuff that would cause hand numbness... like not aligning their brake levers so that when your hand sits in the natural flat position, they are inline with your fingers. You want to know what causes hand numbness? Holding onto the bars with a death grip and keeping your fingers bent all the time. You're pulling the tendons taut instead of leaving them "relaxed and ready!" Same reason so many people get carpal using a mouse -- a problem switching to a thumb driven trackball where your hand remains in the flat and "proper" relaxed position and you're not constantly stressing the wrist and lower arm moving the mouse around instantly solves.

Don't even get me started on the damage narrower bars cause likely akin to the strain we see when people put their keyboard above navel level. The ideal position is actually at the waistline though that can vary slightly based on the ration between arm and torso length.

I've been an accessibility and efficiency consultant both for web presence and office-spaces for twelve years. Including witnessing both for prosecution and defense in US ADA and UK EQA cases. SO MUCH of this "ergonomic" stuff people spew about bicycles reeks of the same scam artist nonsense you see with office furniture. Manufactured fancy sounding BS bingo that has not a wit to do with comfort, and everything to do with suckering gullible masses into spending more money for more cheaply made and poorly engineered products. Or as Steve from Gamers Nexus would say, "But what does that mean?"View attachment 137059

To that end whenever people talk about the "pain" being relieved by this narrow wafer-thin seat straight-bar ass-in-air position, I can't help but be reminded of the early '90's ergonomic stool scam, and the plethora of knee injury lawsuits that followed.

And today the same type of gullible quacks, morons, and fools light money on fire for anything labeled "gaming"

To be frank, the very notion that a bike "from the factory" and "as designed" is going to fit is absurd. The most basic rule, one size fits all fits nobody. I imagine if you're in the perfect 5'6" to 5'9" in the perfect 150 pound weight in perfect health, all that chazerei might actually work and you'd be fine with a bike "as designed". I know as I shed the 100 pounds the past 10 years a lot of "comfort" stuff that wasn't comfortable now is. But to go full on flaw of averages? No.

A bespoke suit always fits. To that end, at least bike makers are now coming out with frames in different sizes beyond what size tire they take. Not sure when that became a thing, but I like it.

Though I really wish my aventure was 6" longer with 3 degrees more rake. That's what she said.

I make no "bones" about I like "Sissy Jones-Beach Cruiser" my spine will hardly bend and my dang feet will hardly clear the top tube or bar on anything. I do find I can basically apply as much or more to the pedals in this position I never have to stand on the pedals even on the steeper hills.

 

[kevinmccune]

Most comfy bicycle ever for me.
View attachment 137200

Going against the wind, I simply adjust the assist level. Going long distances? I go. I've had it on easy trails, on unpaved roads, on paved roads, in the rain, and it is just fine for me. Of course, I grew up riding clunkers and rode my Sears ten speed on what is now deemed only good for mountain bikes. I did get a good mountain bike to commute to work on later because it was low geared enough that I could pedal up the steep road to my house.

Did I say I like this bike?

Nice looking bike

 

[dodgeman]

I pretty much agreed with Stefan’s original post, not because he told me so but because I form my own opinion’s. I don’t understand why people feel the need to tear someone down they don’t agree with. Stefan can come across pretty strong at times, I accept this, it’s just the way he is. Ignore what you don’t like and move on. Instead people drive others away like our friend from down under.

 

[Djangodog]

1000 watts is completely legal in the US. I peddle mine every mile I go. You can stand up, lean, tilt to the right and left, drop your head over the bars for less wind drag and look like a real real race pro, and do it all in skin tight spandex if that's you're style. Seems like an awful lot of wasted energy just to get down the street lol. If I wanted to work that hard I would go back to riding analog bikes. I'm done with this idiot discussion. I'm going riding.

The statement “1000 watts is completely legal in the US.” is only partially true. Many states restrict the maximum output to 750 watts. While it is true that 1000 watt maximum output is legal in the US, in Washington State, (where Robspace 1 lives), 1000 watts is not legal, (750 maximum in Washington).

“The electric motor may not have a power output more than 750 watts.”

E-bike Rules and Regulations | WA - DNR

Electric-assisted bicycles (e-bikes) are increasing in popularity and the Washington State Department of Natural Resources is in the process of assessing changes to how they are managed. E-bike means a bicycle with two or three wheels, a saddle, fully operative pedals for human propulsion, and...

www.dnr.wa.gov

Here's what you need to know about Washington’s new e-bike law - Washington Bikes

New E-bike law in Washington state takes effect on June 7, 2018. In early 2018 […]

wabikes.org

 

[kevinmccune]

Yea, just ask that loudmouth Alex Jones where his free hate speech got him. A 1 billion dollar award against him. Yes, free speech has boundries.

The rights of some are truly misunderstood, the clown that belittles and makes fun of you has the right to a cudgel on the noggin. Bullies in any form are not welcome in my universe.