The new Stromer ST5

[MinnBobber]

....I just saw on the Stromer site that the US version of the bike only has a 650w....

.............................................................................
I copied this post where someone said the Euro 850 watt and US 650 are the same, with explanation:

"I especially like the difference in power between the ST5-USA (650W) and ST5-EU (850W) ... Let everyone be clear that it is exactly the same engine and software, the difference is that in the USA apparently only the nominal power may be displayed and in the EU one can make a mess of it by suggesting the peak power as nominal. Evidence is in the range that is the same for both. "

 

[eschummer]

Watts can be confusing. Is it Watts into the motor from the battery, or Watts produced by the motor? We could argue these points at infinitum. I think if you look a the torque numbers it will give you a better comparison. I now have about 160 km on my ST5, live in San Francisco, and so far have't found a hill that it can't handle. Occasionally I kick it up into "sport" mode..

I'd say try it if you can, and see what you think. It's not as "jumpy" off the line as I have found some to be, but the exhilaration with accelerating up a hill when you switch the assist from level 1 to level 2 is just breathtaking. And the smoothness and lack of noise really do remind me very much of my Model S.

 

[Waverydr]

Yes, its encouraging that the torque rating is the same for both. I spoke to the shop selling the bike and they weren't too confident in their response but basically said the same thing as what MinnBobber quoted. This is an informative link about wattage/volts and touches on how bike manufacturers report the motor specs differently depending on the red tape of different regions. What do you all make of this info:

http://www.ebikeschool.com/myth-ebike-wattage/

 

[Waverydr]

Watts can be confusing. Is it Watts into the motor from the battery, or Watts produced by the motor? We could argue these points at infinitum. I think if you look a the torque numbers it will give you a better comparison. I now have about 160 km on my ST5, live in San Francisco, and so far have't found a hill that it can't handle. Occasionally I kick it up into "sport" mode..

I'd say try it if you can, and see what you think. It's not as "jumpy" off the line as I have found some to be, but the exhilaration with accelerating up a hill when you switch the assist from level 1 to level 2 is just breathtaking. And the smoothness and lack of noise really do remind me very much of my Model S.

Congrats on the ST5 @eschummer! I'm wondering if you have tried using the phone app to adjust the motor settings. I saw it mentioned that you can adjust the off the line responsiveness. Also, on my test ride, I was riding up an incline and switched from 3 to S and didn't notice that much of a boost. I was worried that, assuming they are throttling back the wattage, that's where the bike is taking the hit. What is your sense on that?

 

[Waverydr]

Lol. I’m going with the torque numbers... and a test ride. If I like it, I’ll buy it. So confusing. Thanks for the link and happy trails to you. Let us know if you go with the ST5.

Ha! It really is. And your approach is wise. Appreciate your input. I probably will go with the ST5, my Turbo died (commuting is hell without it) and there is nothing else out there I'm excited about. I just want to know exactly what I'm getting myself into before plunking down 10k+. Will post the outcome.

 

[eschummer]

Congrats on the ST5 @eschummer! I'm wondering if you have tried using the phone app to adjust the motor settings. I saw it mentioned that you can adjust the off the line responsiveness. Also, on my test ride, I was riding up an incline and switched from 3 to S and didn't notice that much of a boost. I was worried that, assuming they are throttling back the wattage, that's where the bike is taking the hit. What is your sense on that?

I'm still struggling to get a good bluetooth connection going. When launching the app on my phone (iPhone X), it updates only sometimes, and seemingly reluctantly. I haven't tried changing many settings from the app. I use the touch screen on the bike, and I think I have level 2 pretty much dialed in to my liking, but there is still the nagging hesitation when switching from braking (or even coasting) back to power on. For a crank revolution or two, it feels like the brakes are on before it kicks in...

Here is a link to my last ride: https://www.strava.com/activities/1876214580

Strava flagged it (understandably) because it is on an e-bike, but I don't know how else to show the details of the ride..

 

[bluecat]

As everybody noticed, the power of the Stromer motors are raised along the model hierarchy.

There is some engineering behind this, but more important the change of the power-measurement in the EU. With other words: I don't expect power-differences between Swiss and US models. Simplified, let's say, power is needed to maintain Stromer speed, torque is needed to reach Stromer speed.

BTW: I heard from people riding the fabulous Specialized turbo, they believe - after a ST5 test ride - their turbo is lame duck ;-)

 

[eschummer]

@Waverydr - didn't answer your entire question - so on a sustained uphill (like the one I went on yesterday), there is a slight but still noticeable difference between 3 and S. But uphills don't happen without effort on your part. My general sense after a few rides is that the ST 5 is generally built for (adrenaline pumping) speed - up to a certain incline level. The steeper the incline, the less effective it is. Probably true for all hub-drive bikes. Haven't taken it to it's limit yet, but intend to find out soon.

Mind you, I'm not disappointed - this is exactly what I need - where I want to work hard, the reward is mind-blowing speed - where I don't want to work hard (or can't), I can still get there at a more leisurely pace without spilling my guts onto the pavement...

 

[bluecat]

The steeper the incline, the less effective it is. Probably true for all hub-drive bikes.

As lower the speed, als worse the efficiency. Take 20km/h as minimum speed. With other words: whilst a "normal" hill goes with lazy biking, a steep hill demands your full personal effort. Valid for all non-geared hub drives (the bike drive from renowned company maxon has an internal gear).

If you ride below 20km/h with much motor power, the engine will heat up. Then, the software will reduce the power to avoid any damage.

 

[Jagudelo12]

Hello, long time reader, first time poster. I was just about to pull the trigger on an ST5 but after researching and being very excited about this bike and the 850w motor, I just saw on the Stromer site that the US version of the bike only has a 650w motor. I haven't seen any reviews that mention this. That is a pretty big drop in power for a 10k bike. Anyone have more insight into this? Living in the hills of San Francisco, I was really looking forward to that power. (sorry if this has been covered, I flipped through the pages and didn't see it addressed but its a long thread)

Long time reader) I didn’t think I’d be writing on this forum but when I read this post I had to get involved.
I don’t know who you are or where you live but you are my cousin because this was way to close to my exact situation and thinking.
I also have a specialized turbo that I wish had little more power. So I was about to pull the trigger on ‘10k’ (I don’t even call it st5)
Stromer would have had my money but the ‘650 in U.S’ turned me off.
That money is for your Best Motor. I even thought about buying one in Canada and bringing it to U.S for those extra 200 Watts.
I messaged stromer ‘Are the motor watts less in America when it comes to the st5? If so why (650). The limit is 750 in the U.S. are they different hub motors?’
and they replied, and I quote “ Yes, it was a strategic decission. The ST3 is with 600, the ST5 with 650 in US available.”
Messaged them back again and again with more questions but no reply.
I really want to buy this bike but not feel like everyone else out there is getting faster bike for the same price.
New Forum friends, thoughts?

 

[eschummer]

Go ride one if you can, and decide. I have about 210 km on mine, over some of my most demanding rides (San Bruno Mt.), and for me the compromises they (Stromer) made are right on the money. It's not the mountain goat hill climber some of the center drive bikes can be. OTOH it offers the most exhilarating speed on flats and medium hills I have ever experienced. Yes, it asks you to work a little harder to get that speed, but boy the reward is exhilarating, quiet, faster than it feels kind of propulsion...

 

[Merc]

Juiced has a new bike with 750 watts, 80 nm motor and a 52 volt 21 ah battery.

 

[Jagudelo12]

Does anyone know the ‘PEAK’ Output on this motor?
(Obviously not under warranty) Would it ever be capable of 35mph if speed limiter was modified / hacked?
Or is the Peak motor output too low to hit 35mph even if modified?
{off-road track purposes }

 

[bluecat]

Juiced has a new bike with 750 watts, 80 nm motor and a 52 volt 21 ah battery.

I always like these Bafang advertising. At the regulars' table, you'll be the best with these huge numbers ... until somebody with an M1 Spitzing will crash the party.

 

[bluecat]

Does anyone know the ‘PEAK’ Output on this motor?
Would it ever be capable of 35mph if speed limiter was modified / hacked?

1) I don't know. But this is not the point. These motors are optimzed for 45km/h. Above this, efficiency will drop sharply.

2) Since the ST2, the motors are no longer controlled by the asian legacy software (with all the cheat codes in the internet) I expect, nobody can hack them.

BTW: To support the landing procedure of the SI2 solar sailing/motor plane the company set up a few ST2 with 60km/h...

 

[elliot friedman]

It has to have way more torque. My wife can smoke me with her Pedago Interceptor....I mean really smoke those bikes are fast up hills and she is only 5'4 and 110 pounds.

Maybe that's the reason

 

[opimax]

Switch bikes and see if the bike is the fastest or maybe she is the fastest. Nothing beats real world, people can talk torque rating and all but your butt knows which works the best when it is given the chance.

 

[Jagudelo12]

1)
BTW: To support the landing procedure of the SI2 solar sailing/motor plane the company set up a few ST2 with 60km/h...

Can you explain this sentence a bit more?
Stromer has a bike that I can purchase that can do 60km/h ? ?

St2 s that can hit 60km/h ? If so I’m in today.

 

[bluecat]

Stromer has a bike that I can purchase that can do 60km/h ? ?

Nobody can buy these bikes. Stromer bikes on sale are strictly street legal.

Stromer published a short (Link Removed - No Longer Exists), where you can see the modified ST2. For me, the motor looks smaller, probably a geared hub drive. Earlier, they used pimped ST1 (in 2009, Stromer sold also 55km/h models).

If you really want go fast, check out the M1 Spitzing (mentioned above)

 

[TForan]

I always like these Bafang advertising. At the regulars' table, you'll be the best with these huge numbers ... until somebody with an M1 Spitzing will crash the party.

I don't think it will run away from a Bafang Ultra.