Starting my ebike purchase journey

Anyone have or know much about this bike? I know it is older but it’s being offered at $2700 in a local shop.

Gazelle Cityzen T10 HMB Speed

I’ve also asked on the Gazelle forum.

I was considering the Medeo T9 HMB and came across this one for $100 more.
 
Gazelle is a premium brand with only 12 entries on known problems list. 3 are about a missing plug in the hydraulic brake leading to 3 or 4 warranty trips. CItyzen has 28" tires; even the 18" frame is for big people. No suspension, but I don't need one.
Understand if a used Gazelle needs a battery, Bosch batteries are about $1000. Don't understand your focus on mid-drives on Vancouver. Geared hub motors overheat on 1000' rise in an hour. Your island is not that big IMHO. I cross ~80 hills with my geared hub motor with 60 lb groceries on the uphill leg. I would insist on 500 w and 750 is better. But you're not planning to carry groceries. Besides my Army vet knee gives up sometimes, and I have to use a throttle those trips. Takes a week or two to heal up, and I don't keep a car. An electric wheel chair cannot negotiate roads from my summer camp except in the car lane and doesn't have the range to get home. Those gravel trucks don't give an inch of pavement, and I've had a pickup take passes at me with the door pushed open when I walked after blowing 2 tubes. I've had an iron bar thrown at me, too.
Mid-drives, if you break a chain or a motor gear or something, you're in for a tow truck, or pushing a long way. I wore out gears in a hub motor, rode it out to property and back again 45 miles without power by pedaling. No drag. Plus Bosch warrenty service would be a week or more. You have to haul bike to warranty shop in a vehicle or push it. I had a spare hub motor in the garage & was back under power after 2 afternoons work. No tow truck required.
 
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Gazelle is a premium brand with only 12 entries on known problems list. 3 are about a missing plug in the hydraulic brake leading to 3 or 4 warranty trips.
Understand if a used Gazelle needs a battery, Bosch batteries are about $1000. Don't understand your focus on mid-drives on Vancouver. Geared hub motors overheat on 1000' rise in an hour. Your island is not that big IMHO. I cross ~80 hills with my geared hub motor with 60 lb groceries on the uphill leg. I would insist on 500 w and 750 is better. But you're not planning to carry groceries.
Mid-drives, if you break a chain or a motor gear or something, you're in for a tow truck, or pushing a long way. I wore out gears in a hub motor, rode it out to property and back again 45 miles without power by pedaling. No drag. Plus Bosch warrenty service would be a week or more. You have to haul bike to warranty shop in a vehicle or push it. I had a spare hub motor in the garage & was back under power after 2 afternoons work. No tow truck required.
The difference between geared hubs and mid drive is not just hill climbing, although that's a HUGE factor. It's also about riding experience. Hub drives are great for DIY types. They're also found mostly on cheaper bikes, where the company also cuts corners on other components too, hence the problem reports here for many of those bikes. But you really don't like mid drives, do you? Why? Have you ever had one?
 
Gazelle is a premium brand with only 12 entries on known problems list. 3 are about a missing plug in the hydraulic brake leading to 3 or 4 warranty trips.
Understand if a used Gazelle needs a battery, Bosch batteries are about $1000. Don't understand your focus on mid-drives on Vancouver. Geared hub motors overheat on 1000' rise in an hour. Your island is not that big IMHO. I cross ~80 hills with my geared hub motor with 60 lb groceries on the uphill leg. I would insist on 500 w and 750 is better. But you're not planning to carry groceries. Besides my Army vet knee gives up sometimes, and I have to use a throttle those trips. Takes a week or two to heal up, and I don't keep a car.
Mid-drives, if you break a chain or a motor gear or something, you're in for a tow truck, or pushing a long way. I wore out gears in a hub motor, rode it out to property and back again 45 miles without power by pedaling. No drag. Plus Bosch warrenty service would be a week or more. You have to haul bike to warranty shop in a vehicle or push it. I had a spare hub motor in the garage & was back under power after 2 afternoons work. No tow truck required.
Vancouver, WA, or Island, CA? The island is pretty dang hilly 🤣!
 
Mid-drives, if you break a chain or a motor gear or something, you're in for a tow truck, or pushing a long way. I wore out gears in a hub motor, rode it out to property and back again 45 miles without power by pedaling. No drag. Plus Bosch warrenty service would be a week or more. You have to haul bike to warranty shop in a vehicle or push it. I had a spare hub motor in the garage & was back under power after 2 afternoons work. No tow truck required.
the whole if you break a chain fear is so way overblown. A new invention called a quick link for 5.00 will fix that. the drag is way overblown too. you have a very heavy rear wheel that will take far more work to get up to speed because of its mass. If a bosch bike beaks you can get service most places. good luck taking that odd brand hud drive in. or fixing ir yourself if you can find the parts fast. nope my bosch has given me 12,000 miles of daily riding no problem. you can ride any bike back and a bike that weighs less and with better gearing will be easier.
 
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I’m not in Vancouver by the way. I’m in California and moving to the central coast of California where there are several shops nearby that will work on Bosch drives. Also this bike I found at the shop is still listed as new so I’m presuming warranty and battery are still fresh but I will ask before even riding it. Would like to learn more about these mid drive concerns as I’m not set on hub or mid yet. I’ve heard some mids can be ridden with very little drag. The ones I’ve ridden I even tried first without the bike being on and they seemed to be okay to ride.

@indianajo, I’m truly sorry for the way you’ve been treated on the road. I wish people were nicer to each other. Also much respect and appreciation for the service you’ve provided all of us so that I can ponder these questions about ebikes in comfort and safety. Your sacrifices are priceless.
 
I’m not in Vancouver by the way. I’m in California and moving to the central coast of California where there are several shops nearby that will work on Bosch drives. Also this bike I found at the shop is still listed as new so I’m presuming warranty and battery are still fresh but I will ask before even riding it. Would like to learn more about these mid drive concerns as I’m not set on hub or mid yet. I’ve heard some mids can be ridden with very little drag. The ones I’ve ridden I even tried first without the bike being on and they seemed to be okay to ride.

@indianajo, I’m truly sorry for the way you’ve been treated on the road. I wish people were nicer to each other. Also much respect and appreciation for the service you’ve provided all of us so that I can ponder these questions about ebikes in comfort and safety. Your sacrifices are priceless.

I’m not in Vancouver by the way. I’m in California and moving to the central coast of California where there are several shops nearby that will work on Bosch drives. Also this bike I found at the shop is still listed as new so I’m presuming warranty and battery are still fresh but I will ask before even riding it. Would like to learn more about these mid drive concerns as I’m not set on hub or mid yet. I’ve heard some mids can be ridden with very little drag. The ones I’ve ridden I even tried first without the bike being on and they seemed to be okay to ride.

@indianajo, I’m truly sorry for the way you’ve been treated on the road. I wish people were nicer to each other. Also much respect and appreciation for the service you’ve provided all of us so that I can ponder these questions about ebikes in comfort and safety. Your sacrifices are priceless.
I am curious as to whether you have learned anything useful regarding 2022 Giant ebikes? I am finding them hard to research. Momentum is no longer on their website (No longer in production?). Anyone have any insight regarding the Entour or Daily Tour or what they cost, availability in the US, etc?
 
I am curious as to whether you have learned anything useful regarding 2022 Giant ebikes? I am finding them hard to research. Momentum is no longer on their website (No longer in production?). Anyone have any insight regarding the Entour or Daily Tour or what they cost, availability in the US, etc?
I’m not sure what Giant is doing for MY2022 - wondering if they will release models that compete with the new Bosch systems. I still find Momentum and Liv listed as brands on their US website. Perhaps you have a different region selected? I haven’t heard about any halt in production on them. There have been reports of production slowdowns across Giant though so finding a specific configuration of the model you want may be difficult.

Entour and DailyTour are listed on Giant’s international website but not on the US website so either not selling here or not yet here.
 
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My suggestion is to test ride a Gazelle C380. Or a the C380+ if speed is a need. The belted mid motor with internal gears is low maintenance easy to use and Gazelles are reliable. I had to buy online as no one nearby had the model/size I wanted. This bike eats up hills and leaves a smile on your face. My road bike days ended in my 60’s with health issues. Now in my 70’s I dipped my toes into E-bikes with a $800 Schwinn EC1. The rear hub motor is jerky and built quality is not the best. But it works and is now a good stand by. Sure the Gazelle is heavy but if you do not need to haul it up stairs that is not a problem. I take the battery off when putting it on our rear car carrier without a problem. This bike has made me stronger with every mile. A great buy.
 
My suggestion is to test ride a Gazelle C380. Or a the C380+ if speed is a need. The belted mid motor with internal gears is low maintenance easy to use and Gazelles are reliable. I had to buy online as no one nearby had the model/size I wanted. This bike eats up hills and leaves a smile on your face. My road bike days ended in my 60’s with health issues. Now in my 70’s I dipped my toes into E-bikes with a $800 Schwinn EC1. The rear hub motor is jerky and built quality is not the best. But it works and is now a good stand by. Sure the Gazelle is heavy but if you do not need to haul it up stairs that is not a problem. I take the battery off when putting it on our rear car carrier without a problem. This bike has made me stronger with every mile. A great buy.
Appreciate the suggestion but those bikes are unfortunately far above my price range. That is why I am considering the Medeo T9 HMB. I'm hoping to ride one of those in the near future to see if it works for me. I might be tempted into the Medeo T10 HMB as it has the Performance Line motor, better gearing, and front tube mounted battery instead of a rack battery.
 
I am considering the Medeo T9 HMB.
A good choice, I’d suggest getting the Medeo T9 HMB with the Active Line Plus motor. Gazelle introduced a Medeo T9 City model this fall with a weaker Active Line motor, but they continue to sell both models in the US
 
A good choice, I’d suggest getting the Medeo T9 HMB with the Active Line Plus motor. Gazelle introduced a Medeo T9 City model this fall with a weaker Active Line motor, but they continue to sell both models in the US
Got it. I first thought about the City but moved on to the other as it was not much more for the Active Line Plus motor and other improvements. Will still ride the Cityzen T10 HMB Speed as well. They have a bridge nearby the LBS that has a good climb so will be able to test them out well. Hopefully both tomorrow as it is my last day of work before retiring and I hope to make it a short day!
 
Got it. I first thought about the City but moved on to the other as it was not much more for the Active Line Plus motor and other improvements. Will still ride the Cityzen T10 HMB Speed as well. They have a bridge nearby the LBS that has a good climb so will be able to test them out well. Hopefully both tomorrow as it is my last day of work before retiring and I hope to make it a short day!
Good luck!
 
Retirement? Congrats, that’s a big moment. I did it about two years ago. Enjoy the search for the bike.
 
Appreciate it very much folks. It will now be fun to dedicate more time to my search. As well as our move to the central coast of California of course.
 
I tried the Gazelle Medeo T9 HMB, IZip Vida, and Groove Step-Thru (built by the LBS). The Cityzen T10 HMB Speed was used and the wrong size for me so I didn’t ride that. I liked the three bikes and all three did well on the climb over and back from the nearby bridge. The Groove is a rear hub with a torque sensor but I’m shying away from shop built bikes as service may be an issue in the future. It was the most powerful and lightest bike but felt less natural and was bumpier than the other two. The Vida was nice and a bit lighter than the Medeo and both bikes felt comparable. The Medeo was nice but felt the heaviest and was a low step so not as easy to get on as a step-thru. So I’m not sure which I liked best. I did realize that I need a decently powered motor and I do prefer the mid drives. I may reach up and try the Ultimate C8 and C380 but am not sure I can afford those.
 
I tried the Gazelle Medeo T9 HMB, IZip Vida, and Groove Step-Thru (built by the LBS). The Cityzen T10 HMB Speed was used and the wrong size for me so I didn’t ride that. I liked the three bikes and all three did well on the climb over and back from the nearby bridge. The Groove is a rear hub with a torque sensor but I’m shying away from shop built bikes as service may be an issue in the future. It was the most powerful and lightest bike but felt less natural and was bumpier than the other two. The Vida was nice and a bit lighter than the Medeo and both bikes felt comparable. The Medeo was nice but felt the heaviest and was a low step so not as easy to get on as a step-thru. So I’m not sure which I liked best. I did realize that I need a decently powered motor and I do prefer the mid drives. I may reach up and try the Ultimate C8 and C380 but am not sure I can afford those.
Have you ridden the La Free yet? I'm curious what you think of it, and what changes Momentum had made since 2019 😉.

Congrats on your retirement!
 
Have you ridden the La Free yet? I'm curious what you think of it, and what changes Momentum had made since 2019 😉.

Congrats on your retirement!
Not yet. We are wrapping up our final stuff including family holiday festivities in SoCal before moving up. The LBS there is within three miles of the house and carries Giant and Momentum. I hope to try the LaFree and Vida and perhaps Roam there. I’ll post as soon as I’m done with those rides too. I’m in no hurry and might want to see what comes up in 2022 as well. Appreciate the congrats.
 
Kuat rack. It's expensive but easy to use.
Yakima makes a rack with a ramp. It is called On Ramp. MSRP is $999 but can be purchased at Amazon for $650 and a few other sites like Backcountry, etc. I have this rack for my Allant+ 8s and it works just fine. Loading an 80 pound bike by just lifting it on to the rack is out of the question for me as I am 78 years old with a bad back, etc.....Rack is built like a tank and is very heavy (43 pounds) to load onto the back of my Jeep.


 
Yakima makes a rack with a ramp. It is called On Ramp. MSRP is $999 but can be purchased at Amazon for $650 and a few other sites like Backcountry, etc. I have this rack for my Allant+ 8s and it works just fine. Loading an 80 pound bike by just lifting it on to the rack is out of the question for me as I am 78 years old with a bad back, etc.....Rack is built like a tank and is very heavy (43 pounds) to load onto the back of my Jeep.


Thank you so much for the suggestion. When I get through the holidays, I’ll get serious about the bike search and check out the racks. Just curious; we are midway tonight between houses. Couldn’t leave for our 8 1/2 hr trek til 1, so in a motel for the night. If I had the bike/rack on my car, would I have to take the bike off and bring it to the room? (Probably a dumb question, and I’m pretty sure I know the answer…)
 
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