Sondors Fact Finding. Due Diligence. Scrutiny.
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FTC Complaint
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The picture provided by Storm shows a "green" label branding; that would not be a Bafang motor.
stevenast
Well-Known Member
If the Sondors is actually in "full swing production", as they say, then they must know what components they are using!!
Why can't they publish it?
FTC Complaint
Active Member
I think Sondors used Bafang in his prototype; because it can be found in the US market; there must be many Chinese manufactures (one of which has a green/white label).
FTC Complaint
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Another puff piece article, written by someone who does not ask any questions (parroting rather than reporting, reporting being something nobody does anymore).
http://www.autoevolution.com/news/s...eek-gets-production-underway-video-95939.html
There is no shortage of Chinese ebike manufacturers. I saw a "Chinese self balancing wheel whiz by me on the streets of Manhattan a few days ago," it must have been a "Ninebot." Chinese "Segways" were designed using "cell phone parts" as opposed to the electronics and mechanics within the highly-redundant-sophisticated Segways.
What may leak in from China may not be to US standards, see Lumber Liquidators.
From toothpaste to toys and medical drugs to dog food, there's been a slew of recalls involving products that were made in China. Children have died, adults have died, pets have died and many people have become sick or injured due to unsafe products that were manufactured in China.
If you import from China you need business depth and diligence, not just a factory manufacturing-production line.
http://www.autoevolution.com/news/s...eek-gets-production-underway-video-95939.html
There is no shortage of Chinese ebike manufacturers. I saw a "Chinese self balancing wheel whiz by me on the streets of Manhattan a few days ago," it must have been a "Ninebot." Chinese "Segways" were designed using "cell phone parts" as opposed to the electronics and mechanics within the highly-redundant-sophisticated Segways.
What may leak in from China may not be to US standards, see Lumber Liquidators.
From toothpaste to toys and medical drugs to dog food, there's been a slew of recalls involving products that were made in China. Children have died, adults have died, pets have died and many people have become sick or injured due to unsafe products that were manufactured in China.
If you import from China you need business depth and diligence, not just a factory manufacturing-production line.
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A
Anomander Rake
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I would have assumed good journalism is based on facts and a non-partial bias towards the subject.
I wonder what will happen after people start getting their bikes if they get them?
Like the Australians and all the Europeans..Me thinks many of the Sondor products will be ending up in Custom houses for failing to bring the bikes up to European and Australian standards as required by law.
Then there is the Canadians and their fight with UPS and it horrendous and fraudulent clearance and custom charges which is in a class action suit. Nice one Mr. Sondors, pick one of the worst freight carriers in Canadian history.
The utter lack of good questions still remain to be answered both from the Advertising team and GOSONDORS because Mr. Sondors has not been forth coming. No wondors he has nicknamed himself storm because all I can see is Storm clouds over this entire messy campaign or should I say Scampaign.
Then lets us not forget the Spampaign pulled by that infamous Sondors closed facebook team who utterly failed in their poor attempt to muzzle all the honest buyers of the Sondors ebikes. For more than a week their team of trolls spammed the comment section of the Sondors Campaign to avoid all the questions of show up more picture, videos and please answer our questions about, warranty etc etc etc..
Sincerely...
....The Incredible Hulk....
...Raging again...
ps:...I wonder what will happen to a lithium battery on a hot day sandwiched in a restricted space between your legs, with very little air circulating around the battery. It is very important to keep a lithium battery COOL while it discharges. It heats up rather dramatically or so I am told, I could be wrong...
I wonder what will happen after people start getting their bikes if they get them?
Like the Australians and all the Europeans..Me thinks many of the Sondor products will be ending up in Custom houses for failing to bring the bikes up to European and Australian standards as required by law.
Then there is the Canadians and their fight with UPS and it horrendous and fraudulent clearance and custom charges which is in a class action suit. Nice one Mr. Sondors, pick one of the worst freight carriers in Canadian history.
The utter lack of good questions still remain to be answered both from the Advertising team and GOSONDORS because Mr. Sondors has not been forth coming. No wondors he has nicknamed himself storm because all I can see is Storm clouds over this entire messy campaign or should I say Scampaign.
Then lets us not forget the Spampaign pulled by that infamous Sondors closed facebook team who utterly failed in their poor attempt to muzzle all the honest buyers of the Sondors ebikes. For more than a week their team of trolls spammed the comment section of the Sondors Campaign to avoid all the questions of show up more picture, videos and please answer our questions about, warranty etc etc etc..
Sincerely...
....The Incredible Hulk.......Raging again...ps:...I wonder what will happen to a lithium battery on a hot day sandwiched in a restricted space between your legs, with very little air circulating around the battery. It is very important to keep a lithium battery COOL while it discharges. It heats up rather dramatically or so I am told, I could be wrong...
A
Anomander Rake
Guest
This is a good article about lithium batteries....
http://www.techlicious.com/blog/the-risk-of-exploding-lithium-ion-batteries/
What causes lithium ion batteries to fail?
Lithium ion batteries have circuitry inside to prevent overcharging and short circuits, but if this circuitry is damaged, the battery could become overheated, resulting in a process known as "thermal runaway." Thermal runaway is a chemical process where the battery generates heat, causing additional reactions that generate more heat, and so on until the entire thing finally erupts in flame. Manufacturing defects can also result in thermal runaway.
How much heat it takes to get a battery to go into thermal runaway may vary based on the type of battery. According to Tony Olson, CEO of D2 Worldwide, which conducted the lithium ion battery test for PC Pitstop, thermal runaway can occur if the battery is heated to anywhere from 140 degrees fahrenheit up to 350 degree fahrenheit. Not standard household temperatures, obviously, but possible if the battery experiences a failure.
While the likelihood of lithium ion battery fires is still very low, two factors are increasing the risks. First is the simple fact that it's becoming far more common for us to own devices containing lithium ion batteries, including laptops, tablets, smartphones, Kindles, etc. Secondly, as manufacturers are pushing to put more and more power into these devices, the results of a failure become more pronounced.
To help avoid issues with your batteries, the Consumer Product Safety Commission recommends the following safety tips:
http://www.techlicious.com/blog/the-risk-of-exploding-lithium-ion-batteries/
What causes lithium ion batteries to fail?
Lithium ion batteries have circuitry inside to prevent overcharging and short circuits, but if this circuitry is damaged, the battery could become overheated, resulting in a process known as "thermal runaway." Thermal runaway is a chemical process where the battery generates heat, causing additional reactions that generate more heat, and so on until the entire thing finally erupts in flame. Manufacturing defects can also result in thermal runaway.
How much heat it takes to get a battery to go into thermal runaway may vary based on the type of battery. According to Tony Olson, CEO of D2 Worldwide, which conducted the lithium ion battery test for PC Pitstop, thermal runaway can occur if the battery is heated to anywhere from 140 degrees fahrenheit up to 350 degree fahrenheit. Not standard household temperatures, obviously, but possible if the battery experiences a failure.
While the likelihood of lithium ion battery fires is still very low, two factors are increasing the risks. First is the simple fact that it's becoming far more common for us to own devices containing lithium ion batteries, including laptops, tablets, smartphones, Kindles, etc. Secondly, as manufacturers are pushing to put more and more power into these devices, the results of a failure become more pronounced.
To help avoid issues with your batteries, the Consumer Product Safety Commission recommends the following safety tips:
- Only purchase batteries and chargers directly from the manufacturer or from a manufacturer-recommended source. Buying counterfeit or poorly manufactured batteries increases the chance of having an issue.
- Do not let a loose battery come in contact with metal objects, such as coins, keys, or jewelry. Metal objects can cross the electrical connections and cause an incident if the internal protection circuitry isn't functioning correctly.
- Do not crush, puncture or put a high degree of pressure on the battery, as this can cause an internal short-circuit, resulting in overheating.
- Do not place the phone or batteries in areas that may get very hot, such as on or near a cooking surface, cooking appliance, iron, radiator or the dashboard of your car in the summer.
- If you drop your phone or laptop on a hard surface, it can potentially cause damage the battery. If you suspect damage to the battery, take it to a service center for inspection.
- If your phone gets wet, even if the device dries and operates normally, the battery contacts or circuitry could slowly corrode and pose a safety hazard.
stevenast
Well-Known Member
Created a seed? The way Sondors is teaspooning out information the campaign itself had sprouted an entire tree of "negative tone"!
Ann M.
Well-Known Member
Folks, @Credible Hulk has resolved his angst and is keeping on the refund track. We need to keep on the Due Diligence track, please, rather than veering off on this tangent.
Brambor
Well-Known Member
Sondors campaign is not perfect and they indeed may be crooks. I don't know as I have never gone to their web site or the indiegosomething web site but I know one thing:
If there is a negative tone about Sondors here it has been purely created and maintained by a handful of frequent posters.
If there is a negative tone about Sondors here it has been purely created and maintained by a handful of frequent posters.
Ann M.
Well-Known Member
Yes, and it would be interesting to hear if anyone has heard from the Sonders Support Team powered by Zendesk. Sonders posted on the IGG site 29 days ago-- 'Since creating a support system with Zendesk (major player in the support market), we’ve worked furiously to improve response time and hope you’re noticing and benefiting from the quicker responses.'
stevenast
Well-Known Member
I respectfully disagree. The many negatives about this campaign are already existing, not created by the people who see and report those issues.
Brambor
Well-Known Member
Well I know one thing: if I listened to EBR Sondors threads I would think that first there was no bike and the guys were criminals who took a suitcase full of money and are retiring in South America... or something like that.
And gradually we seem to be learning that indeed there is some bike and that they are indeed making a few of them already and even though they are working out the kinks of running a new business the first bikes may indeed ship soon.
And gradually we seem to be learning that indeed there is some bike and that they are indeed making a few of them already and even though they are working out the kinks of running a new business the first bikes may indeed ship soon.
stevenast
Well-Known Member
This very thread has a video of the "assembly line". It has pictures of the battery box. it has "factory pictures". I think both sides are being presented here, perhaps a little too much
but both sides are certainly represented.
FTC Complaint
Active Member
20-25% of the gross sales go to marketing (5% IGG, 3% paypal, 5% Google, 10% Agency 2.0, x% litigation), with 75% to 80% remaining. What remains is about $480 a bike shipping and all. That is why you are not going to get (as was contracted for) the lesser of the shipping amount paid, versus actual shipping costs. That is also why Storm stated that if he pays Agency 2.0 he does not know if he has enough money to fulfill the project. Storm is playing fast and loose with your money, and your safety.
stevenast
Well-Known Member
exactly the same
PowerMe
Well-Known Member
I have no dog in this fight and I'm neutral. I see the positives and negatives, although I personally would be wary about a large purchase (large >$125) on IGG. But everyone has their own comfort level and no one is forced to contribute, and crowdfunding can be an unsure bet.
A
Anomander Rake
Guest
It is extremely easy to silence the people asking questions and all the haters.
Supply answers to the best of their ability.
Then it becomes a non issue, sure mistakes will be made. But it is how those mistakes are handled that makes a GREAT campaign.
Nothing new can be added to this thread. It is now time to wait for all of Mr Sondors e-bikes to arrive at their final destination.
I would like to wish Mr. Sondors the very best in his huge endeavor. His campaign and his product was achieved in an amazing amount of time a very short amount of time. In today's ultra fast economy everyone wants things INSTANTLY.
Only time will tell.
And Thank you Mr. Greg Dawson, you have my utmost respect. You and your firm SPEC PR is doing a great job in trying circumstances and your handling it with professionalism. Cheers....
Supply answers to the best of their ability.
Then it becomes a non issue, sure mistakes will be made. But it is how those mistakes are handled that makes a GREAT campaign.
Nothing new can be added to this thread. It is now time to wait for all of Mr Sondors e-bikes to arrive at their final destination.
I would like to wish Mr. Sondors the very best in his huge endeavor. His campaign and his product was achieved in an amazing amount of time a very short amount of time. In today's ultra fast economy everyone wants things INSTANTLY.
Only time will tell.
And Thank you Mr. Greg Dawson, you have my utmost respect. You and your firm SPEC PR is doing a great job in trying circumstances and your handling it with professionalism. Cheers....
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