Satiator Charger with Specialized?

[Hammick]

Lets all ignore the (never-ending) arrogance on display here and shift to a simpler approach. There's a way to do limited charging (80% etc.) that is much simpler and uses the unfortunately restricted Specialized hardware.

Spend $9.99 and use a cutoff timer.

Amazon.com

Learn the charge rate per hour and set the timer accordingly. You want to use a rate-per-hour so you can work your way forward from any starting voltage.

A timer like this also serves as a safety cutoff to cut power to the unit.

View attachment 107596

On a Specialized battery do you find the charge rate per hour to be consistent up to 80%? Surely over 80% it slows way down.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

I assume you have access to the Specialized dealer software.

No, it is BLEvo, a US$10 smartphone app. It is capable of extracting detailed information from the battery, which is quite smart.

I may just end up using a smart plug with timer capabilities

The best and safest option.

there is absolutely nothing wrong with using a different charger assuming it is the proper voltage/amperage.

Are you sure the Specialized charger doesn't "talk" with the battery? Experiment then, please.

 

[Hammick]

No, it is BLEvo, a US$10 smartphone app. It is capable of extracting detailed information from the battery, which is quite smart.

The best and safest option.


Are you sure the Specialized charger doesn't "talk" with the battery? Experiment then, please.

Stefan this will be my last post engaging with you about whether the Satiator is safe to use. I will do a full review if the company ever gets back to me and I end up buying one to charge our bikes.

However, I must point out your hypocrisy for using the Blevo app with your bike. Specialized has gone to great lengths to limit the tuning ability of Blevo and have changed their Bluetooth protocol on the new Mastermind bikes so it doesn't work at all. But you know all about this having installed a chip in you bike to remove the speed limiter and then correcting the displayed speed with Blevo. I'm pretty sure any warranty you had on your SL drivetrain is gone (probably frame warranty as well) and I'm also pretty sure that a new Brose motor for your bike costs a lot more than a battery.

Now that I am done exposing your blatant hypocrisy I will say that I have been using Blevo for over two weeks and love it. Especially the smart heart rate function. I will not chip my bike to remove the speed limitation because I want the maximum range out of our bikes and 20mph motor assist is plenty fast for us. I take no issue with anybody that uses hardware or software to remove the speed limiter. Lord knows I have chipped plenty of things that run on gas or diesel.

Now let's please direct this thread back to using the Satiator to charge a Specialized Turbo bike. I am also going to explore if by chance the Luna Advanced charger can be configured to put out 5v on the Canbus pin needed to wake up a Turbo battery. That changer only costs $99. But it doesn't have the ability to charge to anything less than 80% which is probably a deal breaker for me.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

However, I must point out your hypocrisy for using the Blevo app with your bike. Specialized has gone to great lengths to limit the tuning ability of Blevo and have changed their Bluetooth protocol on the new Mastermind bikes so it doesn't work at all. But you know all about this having installed a chip in you bike to remove the speed limiter and then correcting the displayed speed with Blevo. I'm pretty sure any warranty you had on your SL drivetrain is gone (probably frame warranty as well) and I'm also pretty sure that a new Brose motor for your bike costs a lot more than a battery.

I must correct you, Hammick, because you seem to be not quite aware how the things work.

1. You live in America, so if you bought a Vado SL it would be restricted to 28 mph (45 km/h). Meaning, the e-bike is capable to achieve such speeds; why could a U.S. Vado SL assist the rider up to 28 mph, and the same European Vado SL should be only 15.5 mph capable?
2. The chip I'm using is transparent to the system, that is, it relieves the speed restriction but it reports true speed and distance ridden to the TCU. Therefore, I do not use BLEvo for "e-bike tuning" because I don't need to do it.
3. I use BLEvo as a perfect GPS e-bike computer with deep access to the Specialized e-bike internal data. After I have bought Wahoo ELEMNT Roam, I practically stopped using BLEvo, only using the app for diagnostics and detailed post-ride analysis.
4. It is true using the chip has probably invalidated my warranty but it is because I tampered with the legal speed restriction, not because riding up to 28 mph is beyond the technical capability of the e-bike.

I agree Specialized made it hard to derestrict the Mastermind e-bikes. It has been a part of a bigger campaign led by wretched Bosch E-Bike. Let us see how Specialized Turbo sales plunge in Europe.

The point is, 15.5 mph derestriction leads to not worse results than riding a U.S. Vado SL. And there is no warranty on the drivetrain (you better could read Specialized Warranty terms: the warranty is for the frameset, wheels, motor, and electronics -- or anything bearing Specialized, S-Works or Roval brand).
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Your thread is "Satiator Charger with Specialized?" You seemed to be surprised no EBR Forum member shared their experiences with an aftermarket charger. It was of no surprise to me: Specialized chargers are good, and there is no chance to damage the expensive battery or even set the e-bike on fire. If you try an alternative charger with positive outcome, I will be very much interested to learn about it.

A rhetoric question: If you knew Satiator could be used, why did you ask the question in the first place?

 

[m@Robertson]

On a Specialized battery do you find the charge rate per hour to be consistent up to 80%? Surely over 80% it slows way down.

All CC/CV chargers will do that. You have to put in some some time getting a feel for charging to know how to handle both this and your cutoff timer (which you should be using as a fail-safe). BTW I use Mean Well LED power supplies as do many DIY builders as an alternative to a Satiator. Arguably the Mean Wells are a better choice given their using pots instead of a software interface thats a little clunky and limits you to specific profiles. Since they are genuinely IP65 I mount them onto some of my bikes as a permanently attached onboard charger.

An Ultra Reliable Ebike Battery Charger…

How about a charger – quickly adjustable for voltage and current – that is rated for hundreds of thousands of hours of use before it typically fails?

talesontwowheels.com

I also have a 60v lab power supply at my office that does the same job. It lacks the incredible MTBF of the fanless, weatherproof Mean Wells, but it can be set down to a charge rate of around 0.20 amps (Satiator bottoms out at about 0.50a) and has nice dials to quickly set from one voltage or current rate to another, with a nice 3-digit-accurate display. When I am at work, if I am making a trip to the bank during the day, or taking an extended trip across town to Costco after work, I can benefit from a quick, convenient change to voltage and current levels. Its a small convenience but when you're riding daily for utility not recreation little stuff like this counts.

On that 0.2a charge rate, I charge only to a level needed to finish to my target by end of the current day. Typically 0.20a is sufficient, 0.50a or even a whopping 1.0a if I want to throw caution to the winds and just pour on the juice willy-nilly.

 

[Hammick]

A rhetoric question: If you knew Satiator could be used, why did you ask the question in the first place?

I asked because I'm not 100% sure if it will work. They have an adapter for Specialized bikes that is supposed to supply the 5v over one of the CAN pins to allow it to work with the Turbo batteries.

Satiator hasn't responded to my email so I asked on the forums. If they don't respond I won't be buying their product.

I'm not sure why you are critical of me wanting to do this knowing you voided the warranty on you SL.

All CC/CV chargers will do that. You have to put in some some time getting a feel for charging to know how to handle both this and your cutoff timer (which you should be using as a fail-safe). BTW I use Mean Well LED power supplies as do many DIY builders as an alternative to a Satiator. Arguably the Mean Wells are a better choice given their using pots instead of a software interface thats a little clunky and limits you to specific profiles. Since they are genuinely IP65 I mount them onto some of my bikes as a permanently attached onboard charger.

An Ultra Reliable Ebike Battery Charger…

How about a charger – quickly adjustable for voltage and current – that is rated for hundreds of thousands of hours of use before it typically fails?

talesontwowheels.com

I also have a 60v lab power supply at my office that does the same job. It lacks the incredible MTBF of the fanless, weatherproof Mean Wells, but it can be set down to a charge rate of around 0.20 amps (Satiator bottoms out at about 0.50a) and has nice dials to quickly set from one voltage or current rate to another, with a nice 3-digit-accurate display. When I am at work, if I am making a trip to the bank during the day, or taking an extended trip across town to Costco after work, I can benefit from a quick, convenient change to voltage and current levels. Its a small convenience but when you're riding daily for utility not recreation little stuff like this counts.
View attachment 107685
On that 0.2a charge rate, I charge only to a level needed to finish to my target by end of the current day. Typically 0.20a is sufficient, 0.50a or even a whopping 1.0a if I want to throw caution to the winds and just pour on the juice willy-nilly.

That Meanwell Ebike charger looks great but I'm guessing it won't work on a Specialized bike since it won't put the needed 5v on the CAN pin even if I splice on a Rosenburg plug.

Satiator responded to my email saying it will work with my Specialized bikes. See below. I'm going to order the charger on Amazon so I can return it if it doesn't work. Will have to get the $40 adapter cable directly from Grin Tech.


"Hey Brian,

The XLR->Rosenberger adapter cable should get the job done, and you can purchase it via this link here: https://ebikes.ca/shop/electric-bicycle-parts/charger-accessories/xlr-rosenberg.html

Best,

Hailin

Technical Sales & Support"

 

[m@Robertson]

I asked because I'm not 100% sure if it will work. They have an adapter for Specialized bikes that is supposed to supply the 5v over one of the CAN pins to allow it to work with the Turbo batteries.

Yeah reading your post above, I suspect thats the case. Too bad you get to spend the $300. But since Grin fashions this adapter they can make it so it does what they want it to vs. the Mean Well which is + and - and thats it. Probably the 3rd pin on the XLR was customized on the adapter and Grin worked on the Satiator internals to feed power to that pin under the right circumstances.

FYI you can buy the Grin programming cable that in turn can (maybe) let you hook into a PC and use the Grin Widows app to install up to I think 12 different profiles. You'd be surprised how fast they run out. [email protected]. [email protected] (100% and 80% on a 14S/52v battery) and then multiply that out for 2a, 3a, 4a and 5a. Thats 10 profiles right there.

Before you mess with that - and the joy of making a serial connection to your PC thru a USB port relying on Plug-n-Pray - just try the menu on the unit. It offers more features as you can customize how it dials down when it gets to the CV stage. Its not something you do a lot so maybe try and get by without first.

If I were you I'd buy the 96v charger. That way if you are blowing $300 you have a shot at it working on some newfangled hi voltage thing you may buy someday down the road.

 

[tomjasz]

A question: If you knew Satiator could be used, why did you ask the question in the first place?

Apparently you're not reading very closely.

Satiator responded to my email saying it will work with my Specialized bikes. See below. I'm going to order the charger on Amazon so I can return it if it doesn't work. Will have to get the $40 adapter cable directly from Grin Tech.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Apparently you're not reading very closely.

Exciting news!

 

[Hammick]

If I were you I'd buy the 96v charger. That way if you are blowing $300 you have a shot at it working on some newfangled hi voltage thing you may buy someday down the road.

Unfortunately the high voltage model is not sold on Amazon. And the all in price is closer to $400 so it has me rethinking the purchase.

Thanks for all the great info!

 

[m@Robertson]

Wow. I see they have gone up in price. I am upgrading my 2wd ti bike and as part of that I'm upgrading the onboard charger from the current 320w unit to a 480w ($160). Where I'm riding it, if I *need* the power, I will be stuck on a remote beach in the open with one known power outlet, and 5a going to a 32ah battery... I want to be able to do better.

Glad my systems don't hobble me like this.

 

[tomjasz]

Wow. I see they have gone up in price.

Shipping from Canada to USA has doubled in price. SUCKS!

 

[mndparish]

I may be trying to simplify this too much but here it goes. My charger went down I opened it up and it apparently fried a FET. I can test the output of the charger and have a Pos+ Neg- and a 5v what I believe since wire, so only 3 wire output off the charger. The 5v since wire coming off the charger I am thinking is there to wake the onboard battery BMS to allow it to charge. So my dilemma is buy a $24 charger with the same part number as the Specialized charger and swap the output cable with the old Rosenburg connector or buy a $200 specialized charger.

 

[tomjasz]

This is a Grin charger thread. You may be better served by posting on a thread devoted to you eBike!

 

[tomjasz]

Unfortunately the high voltage model is not sold on Amazon. And the all in price is closer to $400 so it has me rethinking the purchase.

Thanks for all the great info!

On sale! 25% off! Ordered Sunday delivered today.