REVIEW: QR-E 250W ELECTRIC BOOSTER BICYCLE MOTOR AND B60i AND B70 BATTERY
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metanewbie
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Welcome back! How many miles do you go on a full battery?
I have three different commutes:
1) 10 miles - 5 miles down, 5 miles up. One thousand feet climb.
2) 20 miles - 5 miles down, 15 miles flat.
3) 40 miles - 5 miles down, 15 miles flat, 5 miles up. One thousand feet climb.
I wonder if a second Pro battery would help in those scenarios. I don't plan on using the Pro continuously, mainly to boost from stop/start to get momentum. But some days, I may end up using it continuously more than others. Any advice is appreciated. I ask because they have a 2-battery Pro option, and I wonder if it's worth purchasing.
3dxl
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- Asia
Welcome back! How many miles do you go on a full battery?
I have three different commutes:
1) 10 miles - 5 miles down, 5 miles up. One thousand feet climb.
2) 20 miles - 5 miles down, 15 miles flat.
3) 40 miles - 5 miles down, 15 miles flat, 5 miles up. One thousand feet climb.
I wonder if a second Pro battery would help in those scenarios. I don't plan on using the Pro continuously, mainly to boost from stop/start to get momentum. But some days, I may end up using it continuously more than others. Any advice is appreciated. I ask because they have a 2-battery Pro option, and I wonder if it's worth purchasing.
On my H70 battery pack with continuous pressing the throttle/boost button on my way to office + mild pedaling + half km 20% gradient hill climb + 14km (8.6 miles) trip = consumed 2/4 blue bar on the battery. Means 50% of the battery pack consumed for that mentioned trip. Better to have 2x battery so you can swap interval without putting stress on single battery pack especially with repeated charging cycle and etc. Totally worth having 2x H70 if you're a daily cyclist. *Note: factor such as bike weight, tire low rolling resistance, bike aerodynamics, encountering tail/head winds, road surface and wheel diameter will affect battery endurance.
metanewbie
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3dxl
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I wouldn't recommend voltage regulator unless you know the peak amp (A) current consumption required between the battery and drive unit. Else i would love to use back my 52V 17Ah bafang battery pack on my Qiroll unit. You'll need to contact with Qiroll support, they have engineers on how to make thing works with battery compatibility.
Decided on the Flex after much deliberating and not wanting single purpose/proprietary batteries. My world revolves around small, light, efficient, versitility and minimal gear to store. My goal was to use the 2 Full battery packs that EMGX pictured a few post back. These power my Shimano mid drive as range extenders and power a newly built 18lb electric boat, so wanted to stay with compatibility.
I ordered off the website $218 shipped, was supposed to be 12 day delivery, however, mine ordered on oct 15 wont get here till Dec 3-5th. I've never even seen one of these in operation and have kind of struggled to grasp how it will all work. Used to be excited thinking the electric clutch would seperate from the tire giving me a true freeroll but have since found out differently. Not enthused about getting off the bike before and after a hill to engage or disengage. Reading the post from you guys has helped a lot. Trying to communicate with Jason by email in different time zones, communication gaps up to a few days etc is a long drawn out experience when you have many questions.
I've already discussed with Jason, a 36v battery either won't work or could cause harm.
Seems these are proprietary voltages and communication with the unit. I'm used to this as all the new major brand mid drives seem to require their own batteries
metanewbie
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That sucks on the delivery delay. I wonder why. I appreciate your honest perspective and second thoughts. It appears the clutch system works differently than expected, giving me pause. The pro's power is appealing, but the proprietary battery makes me doubt using it as a DIY person.
My alternative is to get a combo like this for my hybrid: Toseven DM02 500w Mid Drive Motor and 36V 12.8ah - ECO PACK - USED TESTED
metanewbie
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The mid-drive I'm looking at should work with any 36/48 batteries. See my other reply.
This is the battery. Light, small, efficient and good quality....these are my go too's unless I find something better
I've never tried one of these mid drives. The one I have works great but it's a 45lb bike. What I'm trying to accomplish is a lighter bike and most importantly a good freewheel experience, something all other systems lack. I think the amazon friction drive you found has promise as it would electronically engage but there is a ton of unknowns with that.
metanewbie
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Yeah, the appeal of friction drive is that it can be wholly disengaged and is lightweight, but based on what you're saying, I'm unsure about this method.
The last 10-15yrs I've been searching for a way to electrify my light, versitle xc bike made. I can't put heavy parts like hub or mid drives on her after replacing just about everything to reduce weight. The QR is my only attempt and seemingly viable option in the marketplace. Based on 3dxl and emgx's experience with hills, I'm not very optimistic, especially knowing 3d's already has a light road bike and in great physical biking shape. I was kinda banking on a 21 lb bike including electrics to make up for lower power. Not sure it will work but will give it a try.
About 30 years ago I met a couple of biking electrical engineers who let me use their friction drive product designed to give a boost over tough hills. It was a water bottle battery with a very quick to mount, small friction drive. The thing I remember was it engaged to the tire electronically which made it very convenient and practical. The range wasn't good, I was in great shape at the time so lost interest but think they nailed it with the electric engagement to the tire. Kinda think this is what will make a viable friction drive pop looking forward.
Just my opinion but I wouldn't worry much about physically disengaging the drive unit unless you ride in mud or other debris that you don't want to wedge between the tire and the roller (I addressed that somewhat by mounting the unit on a spring base so it can be pushed away from the tire instead of the drive being fixed and immobile). The "electronic clutch" uses very little battery and except for a small amount of assist that it provides it isn't really noticeable to me when riding. I entirely agree about bike weight being an issue for me. If the Qiroll Mute Plus had worked better for me where I wanted assist on steeper grades I would have considered buying a very light weight bike, possibly carbon fiber, to use it on. I hope it works well for what you want, time and your experience will tell.
The more powerful, standard 48v, disengaging drive unit that meta linked on Amazon is interesting but not enough info to purchase with confidence, for me at least.
metanewbie
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I've been researching alternatives on the Endless Sphere forums, here, and eBikes Discord. Everything has its pros and cons. Mid-drives have a lot of power and can handle almost any terrain or condition, but they seem to break frequently, wear down the drivetrain a lot, and are often unreliable. The QiRoll, based on 3dxl's comments, is at least very reliable. Although the 3M grip tape hack should probably be used for hills and wet conditions, that's a minor tweak compared to the epic MacGyvering I'm reading about with mid-drives. Bafangs seem to be a more reliable mid-drive brand, but cadence riding kind of sucks, IMO — it feels more like a moped than a bike.
This thread alone makes me hesitant about mid-drive solutions.
I've had front and rear hub drives in the past, but after about a year, the internal gearing overheats because of constant hill climbs. I had one Direct Drive, but that was a burden because it wasn't consistent unless I gave it constant power, anything less, and it resisted my pedaling.
For me, what's promising is 3dxl's experiences with QiRoll. So far, he's been running them on two bicycles in somewhat rigorous traffic and brutal road conditions.
The fact that it can be physically disengaged, even if it requires stopping and doing that, is a huge plus. That means I can use the bike normally whenever I want, and it's not a permanent ebike mod — a major plus because I also use my bike to keep in shape.
The other factor is weight. Mid-drives and hubs are heavy, and so are batteries. Often so heavy, I wonder how much of the ebike wattage is being used to carry the motor/battery/controller vs my own pedaling.
Jason, I assume the owner of Qiroll, has been fantastic with replying to my questions.
By the way. He said the Flex is bidirectional, but for engineering/safety measures, they couldn't make it have regen with third-party batteries. I'll quote what he said; I'm sure he won't mind:
"Flex has bidirectional function but no regenerative braking because many third-party electrical structures are not optimized for regeneration and for safety reasons, this function is not available."
The more I research and discover problems with other methods, the more likely I'll get the QiRoll Pro.
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metanewbie
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Agreed. Jason from QiRoll has been responding to my emails. Flex is bidirectional, FYI. But I'll probably go for the Pro version since it's more powerful and purchase an extra battery for it, eventually, when I order. There is a two-battery version.
However, Jason said: "What is the riding distance? Generally, a set of H70 batteries can fully meet the needs of a day's riding. We recommend that you try to order a set of H70 first, and then decide whether to continue to purchase batteries after using them for a period of time." and "If you have an existing 36V battery, we recommend ordering a Flex to give it a try. If it works as you expect, then ordering a more comprehensive PRO is a solid choice."
So he provides pretty sincere and reasonable non-sales pitchy advice. That earns high respect from me.
In my case, I'd consider ordering two quick-releases and an extra Qiroll S2 start switch + Power cable. That would make it easy to swap between my bicycles.
If I order so much, all at once, I'll see if they offer a discount.
I also asked him about S-1 vs S-2 switches, and he said: "The latest batch has all been updated to S-2 switches, which are an upgraded version of S-1, smaller and less prone to damage."
metanewbie
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That's great!
Jason's honest communication and follow-up support are really making me want to order this. I consider that an important factor when purchasing a product, especially for this kind of project.
I'm not saying it'd work, but maybe a step down to actual 36v could possibly work with the 33v Pro. You'd have to check but I think a prior post several pages back indicated that 38v didn't work but maybe 36v is close enough? Personally I don't think that I'd risk it but I did use a similar 36/48v to 24v step down Buck converter on my Mute version and it worked without an issue. The converter didn't get hot with miles of continuous use and it seemed peppier than the Qiroll battery which starts at 25v then drops with use while the Buck converter maintained 24v output continuously as close to the battery's low voltage cut out as I ran it.
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