Rear hub and mid drive motor working at the same time. what is the the outcome?

[gordian9]

Can these two motors be used at the same time using separate batteries?

 

[Tom@WashDC]

The short answer is "yes". You will need two separate motor controllers, and yes you can use separate batteries, or combine your batteries safely by using a "reputable" parallel battery adapter similar to this: (make sure you know what you are doing running batteries in DIY parallel)

DATEx2 Parallel Battery Adapter | Big Game Bikes

This product will NOT be suitable if your bicycle has regenerative braking. Please, ensure your batteries are able to be charged via their discharge port if you purchase a DATEx2 device with charge function!

biggamebikes.com

My first question is why would you want to do this? What are you trying to achieve? You should have a really specific need that cannot be achieved with one or the other.

Assuming a properly configured transmission, a sufficiently powered (high amps) mid-drive, or rear hub, will deliver more power than you need for any road biking. For off-road biking with a lot of long duration steep climbing, or steep climbing at low speeds, I would recommend a mid-drive.

If you are asking how it will affect your ride and handling, there is some anecdotal data on that around these forums and on YouTube. Take a look at at this dual front and rear hub configuration from Eunorau.

 

[tomjasz]

https://electricbikereview.com/forums/attachments/wcec-2wd-wiring-diamgram-pdf.112767/

 

[PedalUma]

People who do not know, think that this is a desirable configuration. Those are the same people who ask if a bike charges itself when you ride.

 

[JRA]

"Take a look at at this mid-drive/front hub configuration from Eunorau using a Bafang BBS as the mid-drive."

Er, looks like two 750w hub motors to me and as described by Micah....

Mechanically you could use a mid drive and a rear hub motor as the hub motor doesn't have any effect on the drive train that the mid drive is activating. As mentioned getting the two powered up and coordinated electronically to sync together for a relatively seamless ride is another story.

 

[gordian9]

The short answer is "yes". You will need two separate motor controllers, and yes you can use separate batteries, or combine your batteries safely by using a "reputable" parallel battery adapter similar to this: (make sure you know what you are doing running batteries in DIY parallel)

DATEx2 Parallel Battery Adapter | Big Game Bikes

This product will NOT be suitable if your bicycle has regenerative braking. Please, ensure your batteries are able to be charged via their discharge port if you purchase a DATEx2 device with charge function!

biggamebikes.com

My first question is why would you want to do this? What are you trying to achieve? You should have a really specific need that cannot be achieved with one or the other.

Assuming a properly configured transmission, a sufficiently powered (high amps) mid-drive, or rear hub, will deliver more power than you need for any road biking. For off-road biking with a lot of long duration steep climbing, or steep climbing at low speeds, I would recommend a mid-drive.

If you are asking how it will affect your ride and handling, there is some anecdotal data on that around these forums and on YouTube. Take a look at at this mid-drive/front hub configuration from Eunorau using a Bafang BBS as the mid-drive.

I made the mistake of buying my first ebike without thoroughly doing the research. Now I am stuck with a ebike that lacks power. Now I can sell the bike and start fresh or add on to it and make it a more capable bike that can do everything I want. My goal is to climb steep dirt roads or trails and be able to pull a hundred pound bike trailer for bike camping like the Burley flat bed trailer.

 

[rich c]

If you really need to throw away some money and want an even heavier bike, go for it!

 

[PedalUma]

I made the mistake of buying my first ebike without throughly doing the research. Now I am stuck with a ebike that lacks power. Now I can sell the bike and start fresh or add on to it and make it a more capable bike that can do everything I want. My goal is to climb steep dirt roads or trails and be able to pull a hundred bike pound trailer for bike camping.

Got it. Sell it stock. It is worth more that way. Get a good bike from Craigslist. Something like a Boda Boda. Install a mid-drive. These bikes have extra-strong wheels. You will also want to upgrade the tires. Super Moto-X goes just about everywhere, or something more off road by Schwalbe. You likely will not need the trailer. The running boards and rack hold something North of 200 pounds. Use an ebike chain from KMC. A Nuvinci CVT cargo hub would be nice but is not necessary if you install an 11-42 with a long cage clutch derailleur. It also looks better when you remove the ugly extra wires and connectors.

 

[rich c]

Another person who wanted to throw away some money! PT Barnum was right!

 

[gordian9]

Got it. Sell it stock. It is worth more that way. Get a good bike from Craigslist. Something like a Boda Boda. Install a mid-drive. These bikes have extra-strong wheels. You will also want to upgrade the tires. Super Moto-X goes just about everywhere, or something more off road by Schwalbe. You likely will not need the trailer. The running boards and rack hold something North of 200 pounds. Use an ebike chain from KMC. A Nuvinci CVT cargo hub would be nice but is not necessary if you install an 11-42 with a long cage clutch derailleur. It also looks better when you remove the ugly extra wires and connectors

Another person who wanted to throw away some money! PT Barnum was right!

 

[gordian9]

I am currently into this ebike for 2 grand and adding a mid drive is another 1500 ish. So at the end I end up with, I agree a heavier bike but will have two bikes in one for 3500. I will post more if I go through with it. But in the mean time I would appreciate more helpful thoughts or advice that anyone might have.

 

[AHicks]

I am currently into this ebike for 2 grand and adding a mid drive is another 1500 ish. So at the end I end up with, I agree a heavier bike but will have two bikes in one for 3500. I will post more if I go through with it. But in the mean time I would appreciate more helpful thoughts or advice that anyone might have.

My vote. Either sell or keep that bike as an extra. Then find the best deal on an Ultra or BBSHD powered bike. They both claim to have the same amount of torques, but the Ultra will be the one that can handle overheating the best. It's also a little heavier....

If you keep the bike you have, you'll have 2 bikes for 2 different purposes. The best of both worlds. The geared hub for it's ability to get on and ride in brain dead mode, and a geared hub for it's ability to climb.

 

[Tom@WashDC]

I am currently into this ebike for 2 grand and adding a mid drive is another 1500 ish. So at the end I end up with, I agree a heavier bike but will have two bikes in one for 3500. I will post more if I go through with it. But in the mean time I would appreciate more helpful thoughts or advice that anyone might have.

what brand/model of bike did you purchase?

 

[Tom@WashDC]

"Take a look at at this mid-drive/front hub configuration from Eunorau using a Bafang BBS as the mid-drive."

Er, looks like two 750w hub motors to me and as described by Micah....

Mechanically you could use a mid drive and a rear hub motor as the hub motor doesn't have any effect on the drive train that the mid drive is activating. As mentioned getting the two powered up and coordinated electronically to sync together for a relatively seamless ride is another story.

Error corrected, thank you JRA.

 

[gordian9]

what brand/model of bike did you purchase?

Wallke x3 Pro I really thought it was a good deal at the time and got $300 off.

 

[gordian9]

My vote. Either sell or keep that bike as an extra. Then find the best deal on an Ultra or BBSHD powered bike. They both claim to have the same amount of torques, but the Ultra will be the one that can handle overheating the best. It's also a little heavier....

If you keep the bike you have, you'll have 2 bikes for 2 different purposes. The best of both worlds. The geared hub for it's ability to get on and ride in brain dead mode, and a geared hub for it's ability to climb.

What do think about this mid drive system?

X1 PRO Gen 2 5000W Ebike Conversion Kit | CYCMOTOR LTD

The X1 PRO Gen 2 is the most powerful ebike conversion kit rated with over 5000W of power & 250 N.m. of torque. This is a complete ebike or emtb mid drive conversion system made by CYCMOTOR LTD. Transform you mtb or road bike into an electric bicycle with ultimate performance.

www.cycmotor.com

 

[JRA]

First thing I thought of was to get a regular rear wheel and a BBSHD which would simplify things and give you plenty of power and climbing ability by going through the drivetrain. Then looking at where your battery is, in the top tube, that even though beefy does not look like it will hold more than 500wh of battery @ 48v your range will be pretty minimal, certainly not enough to support two motors. Adding another battery could be an issue but not unsolvable. You definitely don't have enough stock battery to support that CYC motor at the level advertised.

Cheapest solution would be to put a chain ring with say 32t on the front and as big of a freewheel/cassette low cog cluster as you can source on the rear wheel and try to pedal on top of the motor you have. You will not be roaring up the hill but with the combined efforts you will get there eventually.

 

[Tom@WashDC]

Wallke x3 Pro I really thought it was a good deal at the time and got $300 off.

Gordian9, what about this bike are you specifically unhappy with?

 

[gordian9]

This bike needs more power as I am not able to climb steep hills or steep dirt roads. Also I would like to pull a bike trailer like the Burley flat bed. I am not in it to go fast or to tearing down public roads but more torque. More off road capability.

 

[jdmvette]

I am currently into this ebike for 2 grand and adding a mid drive is another 1500 ish. So at the end I end up with, I agree a heavier bike but will have two bikes in one for 3500. I will post more if I go through with it. But in the mean time I would appreciate more helpful thoughts or advice that anyone might have.

I put a 2000w hub on the front along with a 2000w rear hub motor..tons of fun