Please compare Bafang Ultra vs Bafang BBSHD, especially reliability.

[vincent]

Ahh sorry
But guessing Pushkar can build one with a solid fork...
I like suspension but curious to know if he will do that

bet it would be pretty with a titanium fork

 

[Mr. AH]

I want to get a bike with a mid-drive Bafang 1,000 watt motor. My options are the older BBSHD with nylon gears, or the newer Ultra with metal gears. I’m interested in a bike with the cheaper BBSHD motor but I’m afraid it will be less reliable and won’t last as long. Should I hold out until I can afford a bike with the Ultra motor? Thanks for your help.

No-question, if you're in the market for a mid-drive the Ultra is the way to go, stock is monster on hills which is why I have one, roughly 2 horsepower at present, easy-enough to boost that to 4 which is crazy on a bicycle with gears...

 

[Four Corners]

No-question, if you're in the market for a mid-drive the Ultra is the way to go, stock is monster on hills which is why I have one, roughly 2 horsepower at present, easy-enough to boost that to 4 which is crazy on a bicycle with gears...

Yes, the Ultra is rated for 30A, which amounts to about 1500W. It has huge torque; so if the rider is not aware and careful, the drive train can be damaged. Jacking it up to 60A is certainly possible, and the motor seems to be okay with that much current, but you would be setting it up for a lot more drive train maintenance. You would also need much more battery for a 3kW setup.

 

[tomjasz]

Ultra is the way to go

Yet there are limited frames available for a building owner. BBSHD are now frequently seen in the Pedicab world and reliable.

 

[Chomp]

Good information here. Thanks.

I'm wanting a mid drive fat tire bike. I would like the Ultra M620 (I think) but the BBSHD looks like a fine choice.

I have a bad knee which limits the torque my left leg can supply. Would that be an issue with the torque sensing in the M620? With a bum knee would I be better off with just the cadence sensing of the BBSHD?

Has Dave (who started this post) or anyone purchased the Eunorau FAT-HD? I have been looking at it as a possible choice but I have not seen too many real world accounts from owners.

Thanks

 

[AHicks]

Good information here. Thanks.

I'm wanting a mid drive fat tire bike. I would like the Ultra M620 (I think) but the BBSHD looks like a fine choice.

I have a bad knee which limits the torque my left leg can supply. Would that be an issue with the torque sensing in the M620? With a bum knee would I be better off with just the cadence sensing of the BBSHD?

Has Dave (who started this post) or anyone purchased the Eunorau FAT-HD? I have been looking at it as a possible choice but I have not seen too many real world accounts from owners.

Thanks

One of the biggest features available with either the BBSHD or the Ultra motors, is their "tuneability" - the ability to customize the motor's controller to a rider's priorities. One of these adjustments has to do with the minimum amount of effort required to engage the torque sensor used on the Ultra. I would think that if this was lowered a bit (by how much exactly might require a little trial and error), the bike would respond well even with your left leg issue.

I went with a Rize RX Pro based on the fact it was equipped with an Ultra, featured pretty decent hardware, as well as a 19.2ah battery as standard. Have had the bike just a couple of weeks, have over a hundred miles on it already, have been into the set up and found it was easily tailored to my preferences, and couldn't be any happier with the bike.

 

[Chomp]

Cool bike. It looks a lot like the JUGGERNAUT ULTRA 1000 from Biktrix.
I'm checking into belt-drive systems and I like the Luna FAT BABE. Although, it has the Bafang M600 ultra motor. I think this is a smaller version of the M620.

 

[Pro street]

Thanks again for the input, Thomas. So, there are two issues here.
1st) BBSD or Ultra. Is Ultra worth a few hundred more — say three hundred more?
2nd) Which provider? Biktrix costs a lot more than Eunorau or BPMImports — potentially enough to make it worth buying the cheaper bike and foregoing the support. I probably can’t afford the Biktrix with the Ultra. It’s about $3,150 with 17a battery and BPM is $2400 with 17a battery. (Eunorau is only $2150 for BBSD) Do you know anything about BPMImports?

Sonders, Rockstar. Embt.
comes with bafang Ultra
decent Brakes and components,48v. 21ah battery
$ 2600. just have to wait three to four months. just a suggestion . lot of great bikes out there. good luck

 

[ElevenAD]

Good information here. Thanks.

I'm wanting a mid drive fat tire bike. I would like the Ultra M620 (I think) but the BBSHD looks like a fine choice.

I have a bad knee which limits the torque my left leg can supply. Would that be an issue with the torque sensing in the M620? With a bum knee would I be better off with just the cadence sensing of the BBSHD?

Has Dave (who started this post) or anyone purchased the Eunorau FAT-HD? I have been looking at it as a possible choice but I have not seen too many real world accounts from owners.

Thanks

i Have the Biktrix HD, its similar to the Eunorau Fat HD and i have a Rize RX Ultra! both are fantastic but the HD is very easy on the knees for sure!

 

[Chomp]

Thanks for the input. You say the HD is easy on the knees. Does that mean you feel the Rize takes a bit more effort in pedal assist mode? When hill climbing on trails does one do better than the other?

 

[AHicks]

Thanks for the input. You say the HD is easy on the knees. Does that mean you feel the Rize takes a bit more effort in pedal assist mode? When hill climbing on trails does one do better than the other?

The BBSHD and the Ultra can be set up identically as they use the same software. The difference is the Ultra offers torque sensing - which is easily adjusted to suit it's rider.

 

[Chomp]

Thanks AHicks. I think I would rather have the Ultra M620.

I'm going to be moving to the coast and would like to ride on the beach. That's the main reason for a fat tire bike. Also the big fat tires make the ride a little softer and they look bad ass With beach/sand riding I'm thinking a belt-drive with an internal geared hub would hold up better.

 

[AHicks]

I looked at those too. I guess my concern, the reason I decided against one, was 2 fold. What something like that did to the price of the bike, and how well they'll hold up when powered by something like an Ultra....

I do love the concept....

 

[Chomp]

Check out this bad-boy:

Warthog MD1000 - 1000 watt mid-drive motor - Belt Drive

Introducing the MD1000 from Bikonit! A brand new bike that's an absolute killer. This is the mid-drive version of the bike. If you're looking for the hub motor version, click here. POWER Bafang Ultra G510 Mid-Drive Motor 1500W Peak Output 160NM Torque, 500Lbs Towing Max Speed electronically...

boltonebikes.com

 

[ElevenAD]

Thanks for the input. You say the HD is easy on the knees. Does that mean you feel the Rize takes a bit more effort in pedal assist mode? When hill climbing on trails does one do better than the other?

yes the Ultra is torque sensor so you will have to apply a little pedal pressure, not trying to spook you its nothing major and i love it but it is different from the HD where as long as the cranks are turning you still get the full set power level, as far as climbing goes Flip a coin lol, i have not run into any hill they cant tackle! The Ultra is Faster, The HD is smoother and silent,both have 160nm of torque! if i had to choose a motor its the Ultra, i can dial that in to haul ass or get a killer workout!

 

[ElevenAD]

Thanks AHicks. I think I would rather have the Ultra M620.

I'm going to be moving to the coast and would like to ride on the beach. That's the main reason for a fat tire bike. Also the big fat tires make the ride a little softer and they look bad ass With beach/sand riding I'm thinking a belt-drive with an internal geared hub would hold up better.

awesome! whatever you choose your gonna love it! both motors will rip through beach sand!

 

[Pharroh]

I never had any reliability issues with the BBSHD but mostly ran it conservatively under 1000w @ 48v with fairly low gearing (highest gain ratio was 5.5). Plug n play after two years, never even had to re-grease it. The only things that bothered me was that I didn't install it correctly and it would swing a bit at the bottom bracket (they now make brackets to prevent that), and the chain would occasionally skip off (even though I had a straight chain line). Not a fan of derailleurs in general. I sold it because I wanted to try belt drive with an IGH and wound up going with a front hub motor for that next build.

As for the Ultra (G510) kit I only have a few hundred miles on it so far - can't say for sure just yet. It's been comfortably handling my stress tests and towing my trailers. At full power (1560w, 30A stock controller @ 52v) it does get real hot during summer... I may need to re-grease it at some point depending on the continued abuse, but it feels like a solid workhorse. It can probably handle 1000w peak with little to no maintenance.

I did need to adjust the torque sensor settings to get a consistent power flow, the factory settings are not great for road use. The torque sensor feels nice and smooth now but I probably wouldn't base the decision on that. There are also some people running the Ultra @ 60v or 72v, or even swapping the controller out for more amps. I'm not there yet and have no clue on reliability at that point but it's a consideration if you might want to eventually bump up your power.

The only issue I'm trying to figure out with my Ultra setup (52v Luna wolf pack 30Q) is that when I hit the LVC during range tests the motor shuts down and the only way to start it back up is to disconnect and reconnect the battery cable (or plug in the charger). Not a big deal but I have all the connectors internally routed so it's a pita to get to. I'm still range testing but obviously the goal is to avoid triggering the LVC in general.

Unfortunately the Ultra still doesn't have many frame options yet, but if you do go purpose built make sure you take a good look at the frame geometry specs. I almost bought a Frey HT1000 but wouldn't be able to get the frame to fit me properly. Biktrix seems like a good deal but I don't do fatbikes for transportation.

Hopefully some bike builders will eventually see the potential for a rigid Ultra commuter and give us one!

You might want to REGREASE it NOW because when I got mine replaced directly from bafang it came with LITTLE to almost NO grease in it .
When I installed the new one it just made so much more noise than the original one did and I decided to take it apart and check it and as I suspected LITTLE to NO grease in the main gearing.
When I reinstalled it everything is good and quiet now as it should be (G510)

 

[Taylor57]

Check out this bad-boy:

Warthog MD1000 - 1000 watt mid-drive motor - Belt Drive

Introducing the MD1000 from Bikonit! A brand new bike that's an absolute killer. This is the mid-drive version of the bike. If you're looking for the hub motor version, click here. POWER Bafang Ultra G510 Mid-Drive Motor 1500W Peak Output 160NM Torque, 500Lbs Towing Max Speed electronically...

boltonebikes.com

View attachment 69767

80 lb monster no rear suspension 5 grand no thanks. The tires look like they weight 20 lbs apiece!

 

[Chomp]

I see that there is a MD-750 ebike that shows the Bafang G510 750W motor. There is the same bike called the MD-1000 which also shows the Bafang G510 motor but claims it is 1000 watts.
Question: is the difference in the controller/programming or is there a difference physically with the 750W vs. the 1000W Bafang G510?

 

[AHicks]

80 lb monster no rear suspension 5 grand no thanks. The tires look like they weight 20 lbs apiece!

I think it's 80lbs because of the dual batteries. I've changed the tires on my fatty, and was surprised they were as light as they are.