What's the hot ticket in the cargo bike arena nowadays? Things must have evolved enough with enough inventory some have probably ridden more than one brand/type, what impressed you or which did you prefer? Lets say you want to carry a 40# bag of bird seed. Cargo to the front or rear, doesn't matter.
New year, new cargo ebike
- Thread starter Marcela
- Start date
PedalUma
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- Petaluma, CA
Typically you want cargo low and between the axles. Many have running boards on the rear. That is a great place for a sack of birdseed. One of my favorite tie downs is an old innertube that is cut to remove the valve and to be a length. It is grippy and easy to tie. As for bikes there are so many flavors and price points. What is your region, price point, and what features do you want? One good start is to first look into local dealers that can service your new bike.
Nvreloader
Western Nevada
- Region
- USA
Marcela
Another option is a tow behind trailer, attach when needed,
then remove when you want a standard bike to ride.
There is numerous ones for Kids, Dogs and standard cargo types,
large and small, check Amazon, lots of choices..
Another option is a tow behind trailer, attach when needed,
then remove when you want a standard bike to ride.
There is numerous ones for Kids, Dogs and standard cargo types,
large and small, check Amazon, lots of choices..
That's kind of what I decided. Lots of options to choose from, since I have a well oiled Vado and Como to choose from.
Thought others may like to express their experiences with the cargo bikes. For most of '23 I used either the ebike or motorcycle to fetch errands and groceries around town. I could see going vehicleless but there are still those times when it's nice to have.
None
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
I ride compact cargo ebikes in NYC metro quite a bit, so towing a trailer is not an option that I would consider since the it would reduce my ability to filter among cars and present a larger footprint on the road.
Personally, I feel the compact cargo ebikes under $2K suits my purpose just fine and well, something more expensive would just attract bike thieves.
If you're not hauling significant weight or volume, compact cargo ebikes can well suit your purpose, too.
Personally, I feel the compact cargo ebikes under $2K suits my purpose just fine and well, something more expensive would just attract bike thieves.
If you're not hauling significant weight or volume, compact cargo ebikes can well suit your purpose, too.
indianajo
Well-Known Member
Unlike NYC, my city and county leave potholes and long ruts in the bike path unrepaired for decades. Fat tires on compact bikes are fine in the summer when the battery works, but in winter when temperature cuts range by 50% and you cannot charge LiIon outdoors, I take my battery off. Fat tires would be a real drag to pedal unpowered, especially with 60 lb groceries. Cargo bikes do not come with suspensions. If they did, you would have to pump up the cylinder every time you added a load of groceries and bleed down when the groceries were in the house.
My yuba bodaboda is about perfect, but I had to install the geared hub motor myself. The bosch they were selling 2018 had no throttle, and I use my bike as a wheelchair replacement 10-20 days a year after I have twisted my knee. Yuba has abandoned the big wheel light weight market, selling a steel frame bike with 24" wheels the compak. Their electric model is shimano drive, still no throttle. Useless on injured days. I would have to play grocery roulette with the delivery services. Last time I tried that, half the items I buy were "out of stock". Pro shoppers cannot pick suitable substitutes, especially for a diabetic. Nor find anything but sugary or high sat fat items that most Americans eat.
The momentum pakyak looks useful with a front basket, but there is no throttle XXXXX. Plus it is only 250 watts, which would climb the 15% hills in my county at maybe 3 mph. My 1000 w Mac12t will roll 22 mph with momentum from the previous hill and start 330 lb gross up 15% to 6 mph with no help from the pedals. I have to say the only alternative I see now if my yuba bodaboda gets run over by a truck or stolen, is the Blix Packa Genie. Geared hub motor 750 w, front basket, 24" wheels, throttle.
BTW the trek 4100 MTB I bought for my brother's house in Texas was run over by a dump truck 12/23. It was laying 18" off the road while I was trying to close the gate electrically at the control box.
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None
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
Actually, NYC has plenty of potholes & unrepaired roads.. even coble stone roads.
I've carried 50-80lb. weight with my compact cargo ebike with suspension fork (non-air sprung), just dial up the pre-load and handling is fine even under heavy braking.
Is this your Yuba Boda Boda build?
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Bicyclista
Well-Known Member
I have been riding a Yuba Spicy Curry AT (all terrain) cargo bike for the past two years. It's a good bike, although a few improvements would make it really good. The good: front suspension, seat-post suspension, 2-inch plus tires, dual battery option for 80-100 mile range. Bosch Cargo Line motor, front basket, large dual rear panniers, sturdy dual kickstand, passenger accomodations (footboards, seat cushions, handlebars, etc.). Improvements I made: Jones H-bar, Ergon handles, Mirrcycle mirror, Spurcycle bell,Brooks saddle. Things that would make it even better: 3-inch tires, tubeless rims. Unfortunately, 3-inch tires won't fit and tubeless rims would require new wheels.
I do wish that small parts for the Yuba would be readily available. I had to substitute a lock nut for the front basket (it fell off) and the rubber ends for the kickstand (they wear out) because Yuba could not furnish replacements. The hassle was that it took a while to find the right ones.
Although the Bosch Cargo Line motor is good, I still feel that my old 2016 Yamaha PW motor in my Haibike AllMtn is stronger. Both are mid-drive, and both are 250-watt motors, which is meaningless. The Bosch Cargo Line is rated at 85Nm, while the old Yamaha was 70Nm (if I remember correctly), yet the Yamaha is stronger, feels more responsive, and more lively. So the torque rating is also meaningless because it cannot be compared across brands and we don't know how they measure it.
Before getting my cargo bike I tried a Burley Travoy trailer with my Haibike. I did not like it because I had to slow down to a crawl to take a turn. At any decent speed, say 12 mph, the trailer would overturn. I got rid of it.
I do wish that small parts for the Yuba would be readily available. I had to substitute a lock nut for the front basket (it fell off) and the rubber ends for the kickstand (they wear out) because Yuba could not furnish replacements. The hassle was that it took a while to find the right ones.
Although the Bosch Cargo Line motor is good, I still feel that my old 2016 Yamaha PW motor in my Haibike AllMtn is stronger. Both are mid-drive, and both are 250-watt motors, which is meaningless. The Bosch Cargo Line is rated at 85Nm, while the old Yamaha was 70Nm (if I remember correctly), yet the Yamaha is stronger, feels more responsive, and more lively. So the torque rating is also meaningless because it cannot be compared across brands and we don't know how they measure it.
Before getting my cargo bike I tried a Burley Travoy trailer with my Haibike. I did not like it because I had to slow down to a crawl to take a turn. At any decent speed, say 12 mph, the trailer would overturn. I got rid of it.
Good point on the theft and not springing for the high dollar bikes. I am sometimes surprised how much two grocery sacks can carry, my panniers fit them perfectly. With the vado and como, I do a lot of pedaling without assist with minimal drag from the drivetrain, don't suspect I'd get that with a hub drive or some of the other mid drives.
Only a couple times I've had bigger objects where I had to use a 4 wheel vehicle. A cart could cut into that some. The best thing about this town I live in is the bike paths, lot of time I have my own personal 8' wide concrete path to heaven.
Only a couple times I've had bigger objects where I had to use a 4 wheel vehicle. A cart could cut into that some. The best thing about this town I live in is the bike paths, lot of time I have my own personal 8' wide concrete path to heaven.
Good to know about the Burley Travoy, I was looking at that and wondered how it would work vs a lower slung cart.
PedalUma
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- Petaluma, CA
Yuba used to be in my neighborhood. A woman who worked there used her employee discount to buy a Sweet Curry. She never rode it and after the allotted time sold it to me at wholesale. I then converted it to Spicy and it sold immediately. IMO the small rear wheel is weird. The price difference between a Sweet and Spicy is huge because the utility difference is equally large.
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spokewrench
Well-Known Member
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- USA
In a video, an Abound reviewer went on errands with the rear cargo rack and the panniers. When the bike arrived, I discovered that the cargo rack blocked the opening of the panniers. I considered using panniers alone. At 30 liters each, they were ample but less convenient than a basket. Besides, I wouldn't want to carry a jug of milk in a pannier. (When I buy a gallon, the cashier may ask if I want it in a bag. I say I'd rather keep it in the jug.)
I tried the panniers with the passenger rail, which could hold a 45-liter bin, lashed with velcro straps. Unfastening two straps would let me slide the bin a couple of inches to the side so I could open a pannier. This gave me a capacity of 105 liters. Packed to the brim, a standard grocery cart holds 140. I've never seen a grocery cart packed to the brim, so my bike had roughly the capacity of a grocery cart.
The panniers were less convenient than baskets, and they impeded rear-wheel maintenance. I put the rack back on and found that it would carry a 67-liter and a 45-liter bin. Bungee cords make it easy to use both, either, or just the rack. On rainy days, it's easy to snap a lid on the larger bin. Panniers keep weight low, but the cargo rack is pretty low, anyway.
Two big reasons I bought an Abound were the seat post angle and the quick handlebar adjustment. As you can see, I use a layback post to put the seat a little farther back. High-wheelers had to have the seat almost over the crank. Rear-wheel-drive bikes were marketed as safety bikes because they were unlikely to go end over end, and you sat lower. At first, manufacturers put the seat almost over the crank, as on high-wheelers. They were unpopular. Maybe the bike wouldn't go end over end, but you could still go over the handlebars. They rode rougher than high-wheelers because the wheels were smaller.
High-wheelers became obsolete in 1885 when John Starley realized the seat didn't have to be so far forward. A bicyclist keeps most of his weight over the pedals, so moving the seat back meant less weight on the seat and a more comfortable ride. (Raising the bars keeps most of this weight on the legs, not the arms.) A rider's stability depends on a sort of tripod based on the hand grips and seat. Moving the seat back meant more rider stability for better control.
It also improves the use of the quads, the most powerful human muscles, which straighten knees. A typical cyclists produces most of his power between 2 and 4 o'clock as the pedal moves down from 12 to 6. Quads could start the power stroke at 12, pushing forward, but if the knee is bent more than 90 degrees, pushing the foot forward would raise the knee. At the same time, the glutes would be pushing the knees down, to press down on the pedal for traction. Quads and glutes would be fighting each other. If you move the seat back to a point where the knee isn't bent past 90 degrees, the quads can start the power stroke without trying to lift the knee against the glutes.
The 1891 Paris-Brest-Paris race showed that pneumatic tires were faster. One of the pneumatic riders finished 8 hours ahead of the other. The runner-up had his seat nearly over the crank, as in his high-wheeler days. The winner had his seat at least a foot farther aft. Longer power strokes allowed taller gearing and a slower cadence. In effect, he raced in overdrive.
I found the stock seating position better than most. The layback made my power stroke enough longer that I can get underway in high gear without motor assistance. Tilting the seat forward makes seating more stable because I ride with back pressure and not much down pressure. It also makes it easy to slide onto the seat as I get underway.
I tried the panniers with the passenger rail, which could hold a 45-liter bin, lashed with velcro straps. Unfastening two straps would let me slide the bin a couple of inches to the side so I could open a pannier. This gave me a capacity of 105 liters. Packed to the brim, a standard grocery cart holds 140. I've never seen a grocery cart packed to the brim, so my bike had roughly the capacity of a grocery cart.
The panniers were less convenient than baskets, and they impeded rear-wheel maintenance. I put the rack back on and found that it would carry a 67-liter and a 45-liter bin. Bungee cords make it easy to use both, either, or just the rack. On rainy days, it's easy to snap a lid on the larger bin. Panniers keep weight low, but the cargo rack is pretty low, anyway.
Two big reasons I bought an Abound were the seat post angle and the quick handlebar adjustment. As you can see, I use a layback post to put the seat a little farther back. High-wheelers had to have the seat almost over the crank. Rear-wheel-drive bikes were marketed as safety bikes because they were unlikely to go end over end, and you sat lower. At first, manufacturers put the seat almost over the crank, as on high-wheelers. They were unpopular. Maybe the bike wouldn't go end over end, but you could still go over the handlebars. They rode rougher than high-wheelers because the wheels were smaller.
High-wheelers became obsolete in 1885 when John Starley realized the seat didn't have to be so far forward. A bicyclist keeps most of his weight over the pedals, so moving the seat back meant less weight on the seat and a more comfortable ride. (Raising the bars keeps most of this weight on the legs, not the arms.) A rider's stability depends on a sort of tripod based on the hand grips and seat. Moving the seat back meant more rider stability for better control.
It also improves the use of the quads, the most powerful human muscles, which straighten knees. A typical cyclists produces most of his power between 2 and 4 o'clock as the pedal moves down from 12 to 6. Quads could start the power stroke at 12, pushing forward, but if the knee is bent more than 90 degrees, pushing the foot forward would raise the knee. At the same time, the glutes would be pushing the knees down, to press down on the pedal for traction. Quads and glutes would be fighting each other. If you move the seat back to a point where the knee isn't bent past 90 degrees, the quads can start the power stroke without trying to lift the knee against the glutes.
The 1891 Paris-Brest-Paris race showed that pneumatic tires were faster. One of the pneumatic riders finished 8 hours ahead of the other. The runner-up had his seat nearly over the crank, as in his high-wheeler days. The winner had his seat at least a foot farther aft. Longer power strokes allowed taller gearing and a slower cadence. In effect, he raced in overdrive.
I found the stock seating position better than most. The layback made my power stroke enough longer that I can get underway in high gear without motor assistance. Tilting the seat forward makes seating more stable because I ride with back pressure and not much down pressure. It also makes it easy to slide onto the seat as I get underway.
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PedalUma
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- Petaluma, CA
My go to bike these days has that geometry. I love it. It is not a 'cargo' bike but I carry a lot on it with a rack & panniers plus the flat area above the rack. The rack is rated for 25kg and that is plenty for my needs. The wheel base is extra-long for a regular bike giving it a nice stable ride. The mid-step is so comfy and it has an 11-47 cassette for climbs. Now it has full fenders which are very useful this time of year.
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m@Robertson
Merciless (on the inside)
- Region
- USA
I built one of each (see the article below). The winner by far is the frontloader. Nothing else is even close in terms of easily handling a heavy cargo load with zero penalty to balance or ride comfort. The only way you know you are carrying anything is when you hit the brakes and the laws of physics remind you via inertia.
talesontwowheels.com
This is 100 lbs of gravel. Doesn't look like much and it doesn't come even close to filling the box, but 100 lbs plus 230 lb me is all I care to load on the bike. I have done the same load on my Big Fat Dummy and the penalty in balance and ease of riding is colossal. With the frontloader, I just need to watch I don't hit anything really solid at speed because a bike weighing well over 400 lbs hitting a pothole is pretty stressful on the system.
And absent gravel, if the load is just groceries you can stack quite a bit. I can do a full Costco cart when I add on panniers and stack a couple of bins in the front. Or don't do that, keep just the cargo box and the rakish tonneau and still have plenty of room to toss stuff in for most errands.
The frontloader was the third cargo bike I built. If I had just not chickened out on building it initially, I would have never built the first two, which started out as a tentative "lets see if I can deal with this kind of bike" and went to "I need more capacity" with #2. The frontloader if built first would have been one-and-done. The sole drawback to a frontloader is parking. The bikes are big and if you have to carry your bike upstairs or have no garage space period you are screwed.
As far as locking is concerned, if you step up to a proper locking scheme, assuming you are also not doing something like leaving it outdoors in an alley away from the street all day, you can now use an effectively angle-grinder-proof lock. If instead you are parking at a store for a half hour or 20 minutes at the bank, you're covered. A Litelok X3 is good for 30 minutes of resistance against a corded angle grinder and even then you need about 6 discs.
talesontwowheels.com
Mid Tail, Long Tail or Front Loader (which cargo bike do I choose)?
I never planned on building three different classes of cargo bike, but I did. What are their strengths and weaknesses?
talesontwowheels.com
This is 100 lbs of gravel. Doesn't look like much and it doesn't come even close to filling the box, but 100 lbs plus 230 lb me is all I care to load on the bike. I have done the same load on my Big Fat Dummy and the penalty in balance and ease of riding is colossal. With the frontloader, I just need to watch I don't hit anything really solid at speed because a bike weighing well over 400 lbs hitting a pothole is pretty stressful on the system.
And absent gravel, if the load is just groceries you can stack quite a bit. I can do a full Costco cart when I add on panniers and stack a couple of bins in the front. Or don't do that, keep just the cargo box and the rakish tonneau and still have plenty of room to toss stuff in for most errands.
The frontloader was the third cargo bike I built. If I had just not chickened out on building it initially, I would have never built the first two, which started out as a tentative "lets see if I can deal with this kind of bike" and went to "I need more capacity" with #2. The frontloader if built first would have been one-and-done. The sole drawback to a frontloader is parking. The bikes are big and if you have to carry your bike upstairs or have no garage space period you are screwed.
As far as locking is concerned, if you step up to a proper locking scheme, assuming you are also not doing something like leaving it outdoors in an alley away from the street all day, you can now use an effectively angle-grinder-proof lock. If instead you are parking at a store for a half hour or 20 minutes at the bank, you're covered. A Litelok X3 is good for 30 minutes of resistance against a corded angle grinder and even then you need about 6 discs.
Litelok X3 Review – From a Bike Owner’s Perspective
The angle-grinder-resistant Litelok X3 bicycle and motorcycle lock has been getting a lot of pre-release publicity. Here’s my take as an owner, not a professional trying to destroy one.
talesontwowheels.com
m@Robertson
Merciless (on the inside)
- Region
- USA
If you do go with a longtail, explore your own options for carrying. Don't buy a commercial solution. I did a duffel attachment system using dowels and cargo loops that can be removed from the bike in about 30 seconds, and lets you carry the bag in via the handles built in already. Capacity is either very large (78L each) or colossal at 138L each, with wideloaders built into the frame to help support heavy loads with the bike frame.
talesontwowheels.com
Big And Cheap: DIY Cargo Bike Bags
There is another post that shows later improvements to these bags. Here is another one that covers a hole I left in this article below. Great Big Bags 2.0 uses a better attachment method. I h…
talesontwowheels.com
spokewrench
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- USA
Some fitters say that as a rule of thumb, after you set saddle height, it should be back at at point where, when a pedal is straight forward, a plumb line through the spindle will be even with the end of your knee. From there, an inch or two forward or back can make a big difference.
I had to alter my Radmission radically. The layback I bought didn't get the seat back nearly far enough, so I heated and bent it. To support it, I cut a triangle of plywood, drilling a hole at the top for the seat post and notching it at the bottom for the rack rails. In use, the layback held it in place. I had to use two risers to bring the bars up and out enough for a stable, comfortable ride.
Usually, stuff would fit in the crate or the panniers. The exception was a big box containing a pedestal fan. Strapping it to the rack was a hassle.
For economy, Raleigh developed a design where one size could fit all, about 1900. From the bottom bracket, the seat tube would go back about 30 degrees from vertical. For every inch you raised the seat for a longer inseam, you'd move it back half an inch for a longer femur and longer arms. That got you in the ball park for comfort and efficient muscle use.
The 28-inch Roadster was for men. Later, Raleigh came out with the 26-inch Sport, for women, for people who might have to roll bikes up and down stairs, and to be less expensive. Until 1930, bikes in England were for adults. That year, Raleigh produced a color documentary. A white-collar man who rode to work on a Roadster, bought his 10-year-old daughter a Sport. After a couple of days of learning to ride, he took her on a ride to a town a hundred miles away, over hills so high that there were scenic lookouts at the top. It was feasible to me. With a good seating position, quads and calves do almost all the work, as in walking or climbing stairs. Those muscles have a lot of stamina.
When she was interviewed in her 90s, her tone showed that the outing had been as pleasant as depicted. She said on long hills, her father would pedal alongside and ask how she was doing. She'd say she was fine. The corker was something she added: the next day, they pedaled home. If they'd been at all tired and sore, the film crew would have given them a ride back.
In first grade, I began riding my sister's 26 inch Raleigh several miles a day. I was still riding a 26 inch Raleigh 10 to 50 miles a day when I graduated from high school. One size could fit all.
About that time, Americans were buying 10-speeds and bending down over low bars to reduce wind resistance. That didn't work very well with a seat so far back. I guess that influenced the style of the Radmission, so it was a 1-speed utility bike with the disadvantages of a 10-speed "road bike."
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PedalUma
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- USA
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- Petaluma, CA
I still ride a three speed town bike. It is electric with a coaster brake and 85Nm mid-drive. I love it. I started riding a 26" Raleigh in second grade. These bikes are elegant and simple, but oh so much fun. It now has tan wall gravel tires and I pass $12,000 MTBs on trails with it and they can not tell that it is electric. It now has a rack and panniers.
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spokewrench
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- USA
Sometimes I haul 40 pounds of gravel on my Radrunner. I shovel some into a 6-gallon bucket, heft it, bring it home, and, for curiosity, weigh it. I think the Radrunner's center stand is too high so that rolling off is a violent drop. Getting on and making u-turn to head home feels funny because the rack is 30 inches high and I'm not used to the weight.
The Abound has a gentler center stand, and the rack is only 25 inches high. In video reviews, it seemed routine to ride with more than 100 pounds on the rack. In one, they rode dozens of miles that way, including up steep grassy hills. More than one reviewer noted that the steering was squishy when it was loaded. They blamed it on flexing in the steering column. Mine doesn't flex. I think their tires were not inflated for the load.
The design limit for the rear rack is 150 pounds, so it doesn't match your bikes.
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