Need Help Troubleshoot Volt Mariner

[josephny]

I have a Volt Biker Mariner from 2018 that stopped functioning -- no life at the controls.

I removed the battery and tested the resistance across the battery terminals on the bike side (not on the battery side) and discovered a dead short -- 0 ohms.

I opened the controller compartment and do not see any visible damage.

I one by one disconnected the wires from the controller to see if the short would open.

Nothing made any change to the resistance except for the blue wire (one of three: Yellow, Green and Blue) from the controller to the motor. When I disconnected the blue wire, the resistance went up quite a bit.

I then tested the resistance between the yellow/green, yellow/blue, and green/blue wires coming from the motor and discovered they all have a resistance of 0 ohms. Is that normal?

I don't know what to do next to determine if the fault is with the controller, the motor, or one of the connected devices (on/off switch, display, throttle, motion sensor, etc.).

Here are pictures.

Thank you!

 

[PCeBiker]

I'm thinking that tossing a new controller at it is a lot cheaper and easier than new motor guts or an entire rear wheel hub motor ??

Mariner Not Working

I have a Volt Biker Mariner from 2018 that stopped functioning. The battery was charged and indicated full. But, will not turn on. So I opened the wiring and controller box (4 screws), disconnected the positive lead and confirmed 54 volts. The inside of the controller box was clean and dry...

electricbikereview.com

@AHicks @harryS @m@Robertson @Slaphappygamer @Gionnirocket @tomjasz
@PedalUma ,.. any ideas??

 

[josephny]

Would it be as simple as swapping in a new controller? Or would the controller need programming?

 

[PCeBiker]

I would think that there's a good chance that a new controller will fix your ebike, but I don't know about programming it.

I replaced my Das-Kit Controller and display with a KT controller and display, and the controller is "programmed" by the display.

It may be the same for your ebike?
Your display may be able to program a new controller using the settings that should be available on your display?

 

[PCeBiker]

This is my KT controller.
It has the same basic specifications as your controller.

It isn't really "programmed", it just does what my display settings tell it to do, but it does need to be connected to a KT display to operate.


I would think that replacing your controller with the same model would work for you.
I'm guessing that your display will set it up for you?

 

[josephny]

I googled your KT controller to see if there was any info that it would be a good replacement for mine and found nothing like that.

 

[harryS]

Your troubleshooting info tells me the blue phase circuit driver is blown. A new controller would be the fix. If you put it all back together and rotate the rear wheel backwards, if it is hard to turn unless you disconnect the heavy blue wire, that verifies there is a short circuit, Also verify that the motor can turn backwards with its cable disconnected, to make sure none of the phase wires melted together.
.
Controllers only work with their paired displays, and you need a KT display for a KT controller. Maybe you can still buy the original voltbike controller, or they may be like Radbike and use KT products,
.
If you buy a foreign controller, you first make sure the motor connectors are the same type. No guarantee they will work, but matching the wire colors has always worked for me. Choosing the rest of the connectors is complicated. How does Voltbike connect to the handlebars? One harness or individual rats nest of cables?.

 

[josephny]

There are separate groups of cables for the display, the throttle, the front and rear lights and the on/off-power-level switch.

I would be fine buying a controller and display (replacing the existing display). Would I also need a new on/off-power-level switch?

As far as connectors, my system uses the little round color coded multi-lead airtight pop-sounding types for all but the battery and motor connectors. The motor connector also has a multi-lead disconnect.

Can you suggest the easiest/fastest path to get back up and running?

Thank you!

 

[PCeBiker]

Can you suggest the easiest/fastest path to get back up and running?

Replacing your controller with an exact replacement from Voltbike would be the easiest thing to do, if it is available for purchase.
You would simply swap out the controllers.
Assuming that your phase wires (the big fat wires) aren't shorted or melted.
That would mean a new motor.

Replacing your controller/display with a KT controller and display would also work.
The on/off-power-level switch is part of the display and connected to it.
You would need to connect your throttle and brake switch wires to the KT cable.
The PAS sensor would also need to be connected to the new controller.

I installed a KT controller/display to my ebike and had to do a lot of cutting and splicing of wires, but there are KT controllers available with "standard" type connectors.

This thread has a lot of information about my purchase and installation of my KT controller/display.

Alternative Display and Controller for NCM (DAS-KIT)

Wanting to increase the PAS Max speed on my NCM bike I be quite satisfied with around 30-35kmh it currently 25kmh The Das-Kit system appears to be complete locked down so I'm considering if Sourcing a alternate KT display and controller that would plug and play with the current hub motor...

electricbikereview.com

PS,.. the KT controller is AWESOME !!
It allows you to control the power delivery and has "imitation torque control" which REALLY helps the throttle and PAS modes feel smooth and controlled.

 

[PCeBiker]

,.. Also verify that the motor can turn backwards with its cable disconnected, to make sure none of the phase wires melted together.
.

Can he also check the resistance between each of the phase wires and each other as well as between each phase wire and ground for comparison? Or does that not work?

I think that it's much more likely that your controller has failed than melted or shorted motor wires.

Melted wires are usually the result of over powering the motor, and your original setup shouldn't provide more power to the motor than the wires can deal with.
I suppose that you could have a phase wire that has worn through the insulation and shorted out though, but I think that a failed controller is much more likely.

 

[ElevenAD]

I believe PCeBiker is correct but im just curious about Volt's CS, did you(OP) reach out to Volt and if so were they helpful at all?

 

[harryS]

As far as connectors, my system uses the little round color coded multi-lead airtight pop-sounding types for all but the battery and motor connectors. The motor connector also has a multi-lead disconnect.

Can you suggest the easiest/fastest path to get back up and running?

Thank you!

That would be great, but that's not what I see in your pictures, You're describing a controller with WP (waterproof) connectors like these.

But if that's what you have, a controller with display is under $100, and the WP connectors do follow a common pinout. You may want to buy a 4:1 extension to go to the handlebars. There, the display and throttle will be plug compatibe, but the brake connectors are either yellow (3 pin) or red (2 pin). You have to look at your bike's connectors for compatibilty.

 

[PCeBiker]

That would be great, but that's not what I see in your pictures, You're describing a controller with WP (waterproof) connectors like these.

I think @josephny was referring to these "waterproof" bullet connectors?

The KT controller has a version with regular connectors except for the motor cable, and it's hard to say if the other connectors will plug into your original connectors and have the proper pin configuration.

The connector plug for the motor would have to be cut off to expose the wires to connect them individually to the motor wires.

There is a larger 12 mosfet KT controller that has more accessible motor connector wires, but that controller is probably too big to fit in the controller compartment on your ebike, and it looks like all the other connectors won't connect to your original connectors.

It looks like your Mariner has a headlight and a rear taillight powered by the bike battery, as well as a switchable throttle, making the wiring more complicated.



Your best bet is to see if a replacement controller is available directly from Voltbike.

A KT controller/display would only be a good option if a replacement controller isn't available.
You may need to have a non-original controller installed at a local bike shop unless your handy with wiring and electronics.

There's a few of us here on the forum that can help you get something installed on your e-bike if you can't find an original replacement controller.

 

[josephny]

I am so sorry for adding to the confusion.

The wires coming out of the controller do not terminate in the WP connectors; They terminate with square snap connectors. The WP connectors I was referring to are along the wires near the handlebars.

This is my controller.

Is there an easy replacement?

 

[PCeBiker]

I am so sorry for adding to the confusion.

That picture helps a lot.

This is my controller.

Is there an easy replacement?

View attachment 158237

Yes.

Get in touch with Voltbike and see if they have a replacement for you.
It may cost more than a complete KT replacement, but installing a KT is A LOT of work. (PITA)


Send that picture along with a close-up of the specs and model number of the controller to Voltbike.

You're not trying to make a Warranty claim.
You're buying.

 

[Slaphappygamer]

I am so sorry for adding to the confusion.

The wires coming out of the controller do not terminate in the WP connectors; They terminate with square snap connectors. The WP connectors I was referring to are along the wires near the handlebars.

This is my controller.

Is there an easy replacement?

View attachment 158237

Those square plugs are JST connectors. I have a similar set up. I have JST connectors, at the controller. There are WP connectors at the devices (throttle, PAS, display, hall sensors, lights, and break light).

The JST connectors are great, because they can be de-pinned. More here. This is extremely helpful, in that, you can rewire without much effort. I only had to rewire my throttle connection.

Between the controller and the devices, there is a “jumper”. It’s JST, on one side, and WP on the other. This is fine as my controller is inside my downtube. You can get “jumpers” that are WP on both sides. Only downside, is you’ll have to cut the wire, and splice, if you have to rewire something.

I agree with @PCeBiker, there is no easy replacement unless you can get the controller from the vendor. If you do get a KT controller, don’t get anything higher than a 25a max. Anything more and the controller will not fit. I had a similar 20a Lishui (LSW) controller and the 25a max controller was a very close fit. Measure twice, order once.

 

[Slaphappygamer]

I’m super curious about the throttle. If the throttle only has the 3 leads, I can see the connector but can’t tell if there is another JST connector in the same cable, then the switch must open and close one of those 3 leads. If that is the case, then you can rewire the throttle without much difficulty. If there are more than the 3 wires, then it will be a bit more difficult as we would have to figure out what the other wires do, then figure out where they go. You can easily replace the throttle, with another half twist type, but that may be a rabbit hole that you might not want to travel.

 

[PCeBiker]

I’m super curious about the throttle. If the throttle only has the 3 leads,..

I was wondering about that too.
My throttle has 3 leads and I will get a throttle fault if the signal wire isn't between 0.8V and 4.1V, or if throttle is On when I turn on the bike, but I can unplug the throttle and not get a fault, I just don't have a throttle.

Perhaps just switching Off the Positive lead will deactivate the throttle?

 

[josephny]

So it's been a few more weeks and Volt bike says I need a "new LCD, harness and controller as well as a cadence" for a total of $330 (plus shipping and tax) and hopefully my battery still work (but who knows).

But, they do not have all of these items in stock.

I've basically missed most of the riding season with this bike.

If I'm replacing all these components, can I get non-Volt components and make this work?

Thank you.

 

[josephny]

Anyone?