Mechanical brakes vs Hydraulic brakes

[fooferdoggie]

Those same mechanics who charge you $60 for break pads no doubt.

Mechanics don't charge me for brake pads. what does it matter what I spend on brake pads? I brake a lot and I demand a fantastic brake setup. when you use your brakes for miles at a time you need a good setup.

 

[J.R.]

I buy my pads from Universal Cycles. They have a west coast and east coast store and ship anywhere. They are located in the next county for me, I like supporting them. Great prices.

I can go years without needing to bleed the system. When required, it's an easy quick job. Purging and replacing the fluid is also easy and doesn't take that much time. Pad replacement takes less time than cleaning the chain. I mention all this because I want anyone reading through this to know that most people can perform these tasks. It's not difficult and it's so much cheaper, quicker and no need to make an appointment or haul your bike to the shop. And no charge for the satisfaction of a job well done

 

[fooferdoggie]

I buy my pads from Universal Cycles. They have a west coast and east coast store and ship anywhere. They are located in the next county for me, I like supporting them. Great prices.
right here in portland. well almost. I have ridden out there before. but they don't have much of a selection of pads. also biketiresdirect its even closer but still not many pads. but several local shops have them.

 

[BigNerd]

I used think it really didn't matter... until I went from my hydraulic disc brake bike back to my mechanical disc brake bike... very noticeable difference.

I'm now a hydraulic disc brake snob... if I don't see those reservoirs on your brakes, I'm not inviting you to my birthday party.

 

[Dave Rocks]

which system has the most stopping power with the least grip pull?

 

[fooferdoggie]

which system has the most stopping power with the least grip pull?

I think Shimano 4 piston. it is almost too easy and you need to learn to have a light touch. Liked the feel of my magura's but even when I put 1 finger levers on there was no way to get full braking with one finger. I can stop out tandem that comes in close to 400 pounds with 1 finger on each lever.

 

[BlackHand]

I buy my pads from Universal Cycles. They have a west coast and east coast store and ship anywhere. They are located in the next county for me, I like supporting them. Great prices.

Huh, my last couple orders for tubes and pads and some Bosch parts came from 365Cycles which looks like it is only a couple of miles from Universal Cycles in PA. They are on Amazon and eBay as well as their own website which makes it convenient.

 

[PedalUma]

I like DOT 5.1. But the problem is dissolved gasses. When you use a syringe under suction you see it. The bubbles keep on coming. It looks like soda pop. I have a solution for getting the bubbles which contain the nasty stuff out. Yes, hydro is in many respects preferable. But would you want it riding across Africa? Getting an air lock on a down hill in Summer sucks. What about for a casual bike or daily commuter?

 

[Taylor57]

The mechanical disc brakes are fine, the only real difference I noticed was noise and ease of use. But for the money, why not use the hydraulics?

 

[Gionnirocket]

Mechanics don't charge me for brake pads. what does it matter what I spend on brake pads? I brake a lot and I demand a fantastic brake setup. when you use your brakes for miles at a time you need a good setup.

I think Shimano 4 piston. it is almost too easy and you need to learn to have a light touch. Liked the feel of my magura's but even when I put 1 finger levers on there was no way to get full braking with one finger. I can stop out tandem that comes in close to 400 pounds with 1 finger on each lever.

I like all of them! They are like children. Each one is different. I make electric bikes with coaster brakes for people with hand issues. Some people want a simple system that does not need to bleed, yet works in the rain and cannot get dirty. They get mechanical internal roller brakes. Some people want to win the downhill race on race day. They get hydraulic discs. Mechanical rim brakes come in several flavors and if properly set up they are light weight have good stopping power because their rotor can be 700c and not 160mm. And they have a low life cycle cost and are simple to adjust and maintain. Bottom line it depends on the bike and on the rider. Bike shops like Hydro-discs best because they can make much more servicing them. They can also l charge $40 for $6 pads if there is a logo.

I don't believe anyone is arguing that full Hydraulic brakes don't have the most stopping power. But as @PedalUma said, are they always best?

With my cable actuated Hydraulic calipers I have yet to find myself in a situation where I found my self thinking I need more stopping power. The ease of installation and adjustment coupled with smoothness, less failure points and lower overall cost make it an easy choice. . Believe it or not, not everyone is riding a 400lb tandem strickly down mountain sides. I've had 6 piston Brembo calipers on my sports car but would never suggest that everyone should have them or that what they are using somehow mysteriously and falsely absorbs moisture.

And this whole one finger thing that you keep repeating I find ridiculous. I ride with 3/4 fingers on the lever for both comfort and safety. You know.. same reasons you don't steer your car with one finger though you easily could. And I actually prefer and appreciate a little tactical feedback as it helps to modulate especially in emergency situations. Same concept airplane manufacturers use when adding feedback and resistance to fly by wire systems... The brain processes it faster and more accurately and you are less likely to over_break.
So for me spending more on full Hydraulic system would not only be a waste of money but would unnecessarily complicate things and leave me with potentially a greater risk of failure.

 

[PDoz]

And this whole one finger thing that you keep repeating I find ridiculous. I ride with 3/4 fingers on the lever for both comfort and safety. You know.. same reasons you don't steer your car with one finger though you easily could. And I actually prefer and appreciate a little tactical feedback as it helps to modulate especially in emergency situations. Same concept airplane manufacturers use when adding feedback and resistance to fly by wire systems... The brain processes it faster and more accurately and you are less likely to over_break.
So for me spending more on full Hydraulic system would not only be a waste of money but would unnecessarily complicate things and leave me with potentially a greater risk of failure.

Sorry, but one finger braking makes sense anatomically. Two finger braking is the next best thing, but you lose dexterity with 3 fingers.

Flexor indicis functions independently for single digit beaking , whilst flexor digitorum profundus splits and acts on the 2/3 rd digit seperate to the 4/5 th.

Grip with digits 3-5 , brake with the index finger - optimal grip AND dexterity IF the brakes are good enough for single digit use.

 

[rawlus]

i don’t categorically suggest one is better than the other, they share many similarities as noted.
there’s been several detailed explanations above that go into those differences and their potential meaning or contribution to using them.
if i had my preference ive been most happy with full hydraulic on past bikes,
myncurrent ebikes are folders so came with mechanical cable activated discs, the sense of feeling throug. the levels is in my impression much diminished over how full hydro felt and the level of fine control full hydromfelt it delivered.
a future upgrade when i wear out these brakes could be cable + hydro calipers. i’ve yet to experience this combo but because my bike is a folder i don’t think full hydro is practical or even possible for me, i’d have to research it some more.

my personal, main benefits for hydro (full or presumably only hydro calipers) is simply having both braking surfaces move equality against the disc plate, tends to result in more predictable and quieter braking operations. for me has nothing to do with stopping power, whatever that even is beyond a human impression.

the vast majority of braking i find myself doing on the ebike is feathering to modulate low speeds in precise ways that make the bike feel most nimble, adept, and controllable…. think navigating around intersections, multi-use trail heads and street crossing where they have bollards, gates, mazes to keep cars and motorcycles out… these are all areas where total,stopping power is less needed for me and ability to modulate betwen say 2.3 and 2.5 mph to navigate and steer without having to walk the bike…. i’m always slowing when passing people on certain trails, being cautious and responsible but most of that is not about braking distance or stopping power and on other bikes, hydraulic systems seems to have faster response and more precise response…. not a scientific measurement, just how one person feels having used both mechanical discs and full hydro (i have not use cable + hydro calipers yet)

majority of my use is paved and packed gravel trails, not off-road and not on road, i’m not a commuter. so my needs and experiences could be quite different from others.

 

[sc00ter]

I currently have both. My RadRunner has mechanical disc. They work well enough and they are simple to work on. I also took a Cannondale Treadwell 2 in on a trade and it has hydraulic disc and they just work. Never need adjusting. My next ebike will have hydraulic.

 

[fooferdoggie]

And this whole one finger thing that you keep repeating I find ridiculous. I ride with 3/4 fingers on the lever for both comfort and safety. You know.. same reasons you don't steer your car with one finger though you easily could. And I actually prefer and appreciate a little tactical feedback as it helps to modulate especially in emergency situations. Same concept airplane manufacturers use when adding feedback and resistance to fly by wire systems... The brain processes it faster and more accurately and you are less likely to over_break.
So for me spending more on full Hydraulic system would not only be a waste of money but would unnecessarily complicate things and leave me with potentially a greater risk of failure.

actually you are talking about steering with one finger when you have three on the caliper. only one finger gives me more control of the bike and better ability to do the things while I have one finger on the lever. especially with gloves on. the whole failure thing your going on a about is more likely to happen with the system you have now. my brakes are a mature technology tested for many years not some cheap Chinese knockoff who who knows what materials and testing. you loose feedback with all of that resistance you have with the cable. I don't over brake and those brakes have saved my life when cars pull out in front of me and I can stop as fast as traction allows. when it is raining I need the max braking the bike can give me. it has saved my life or my heath a few times. I have had a ton of experience on bikes way over 30,000 mikes riding on the road.

 

[6zfshdb]

IMO, the answer to this question depends on:
1 - Equipment cost and what you can afford.
2 - The type of riding you do.
3 - The quality of the braking systems you use
4 - Experience and personal preference.

There really isn't a right or wrong answer. It's what works for you that matters.

 

[indianajo]

I use one finger for braking on my cable pull brakes. Finger 5 out on the end of the 5" lever. Fingers 1 & 2 are for the twist shifter (r) or the throttle(l).

 

[Gionnirocket]

Sorry, but one finger braking makes sense anatomically. Two finger braking is the next best thing, but you lose dexterity with 3 fingers.

Flexor indicis functions independently for single digit beaking , whilst flexor digitorum profundus splits and acts on the 2/3 rd digit seperate to the 4/5 th.

Grip with digits 3-5 , brake with the index finger - optimal grip AND dexterity IF the brakes are good enough for single digit use.

Good point. Especially depending on the type of handle bars and lever combo you have... Drop bars in particular come to mind.
I've found holding any grips with curled fingers over time exacerbates my carpal tunnel and that's why I prefer to straighten and rest 4 fingers on the break lever with the grip in my palm and thumb wrapped underneath for stability and shifting on the left. Not riding technical downhill this provides more than enough steering control and in emergency breaking I've never felt a loss of steering ability. If desired the line pull hydraulic caliper could easily actuate with one finger but I've found no reason to implement it.
But to the bigger point... it doesn't have to be that you either do what I do and buy the most expensive everything or its automatically just cheap Chinese crap.

 

[PedalUma]

I would rather ride high quality rim brakes than crappy disc brakes. Many eBikes come with crappy discs, hydo and mechanical. I like to put fishing reel lube inside high quality mechanical housings when I set them up and to use the super slick and strong stainless cables. These brake pads (photo) have twice the surface area of most. And the rubber inserts are nice, replaceable too. Cheaply made ones on big box store bikes are waxy and you can slice them with your thumb nail.
Funny story. I had a job where I was expected to take home various eBikes a couple of days per week so I could test them. A neighbor liked the Creo I had one day and wanted to try it. He did and was favorably impressed. His friend wanted to try it and went over the handlebars in 12 feet when he locked up the front wheel. He was using the four finger grip technique.

 

[Gionnirocket]

I would rather ride high quality rim brakes than crappy disc brakes. Many eBikes come with crappy discs, hydo and mechanical. I like to put fishing reel lube inside high quality mechanical housings when I set them up and to use the super slick and strong stainless cables. These brake pads (photo) have twice the surface area of most. And the rubber inserts are nice, replaceable too. Cheaply made ones on big box store bikes are waxy and you can slice them with your thumb nail.
Funny story. I had a job where I was expected to take home various eBikes a couple of days per week so I could test them. A neighbor liked the Creo I had one day and wanted to try it. He did and was favorably impressed. His friend wanted to try it and went over the handlebars in 12 feet when he locked up the front wheel. He was using the four finger grip technique.

First thing I always do when mounting an unfamiliar bike and what I advise a guest to do when they get on my loaner is to gently try out the breaks and get a feel for their stopping power. You don't want to learn about it as you catapult the handlebars or continue on into a car

 

[BlackHand]

First thing I always do when mounting an unfamiliar bike and what I advise a guest to do when they get on my loaner is to gently try out the breaks and get a feel for their stopping power. You don't want to learn about it as you catapult the handlebars or continue on into a car

Good advice for cars as well.