Luna Z1 - First impressions

[Jeebuspwnz]

Oh, meant to ask - as 'first buyers of new model' did you get the toolkit etc. or just the bike?

All I got was a box with the bike and charger and a few minor bits for components. No tool kit. Bike was packaged well. No instructions but assembly was easy. Just needed pedals, bars, and front wheel installed. Derailer was not perfectly adjusted either.

I went into the display settings to change from kmh to mph. I also noticed the wheel was set to 26" rather than 27.5 and the voltage was set to 52 rather than 48. I changed those settings to match the bike specs...I assume the wheel size impacts the accuracy of speedo but what does the voltage setting do?

 

[blueskyca]

Seems like they set it for 750W configuration vs 1KW then... that bike is also a fair amount heavier if I'm not mistaken.. ?
Notice any difference in how the power is applied (as opposed to one being faster) across the levels?
Just really curios as Luna likes to say 'tuned by Luna' but at least for the Ludi v1 - that wasn't a positive thing for most.

If it's programmed sanely, switching to 9 levels will just give a bit more granularity, e.g. if you think PAS 1 of 5 is a bit over-powered, PAS 1 of 9 should be a bit lower in comparison, 2 should be == current 1 of 5, etc. If not, then yeah - a programming cable or Eggrider is your friend. The cables are $20 or so, not much...

The power delivery felt a little more sluggish on the M2S bike, which may be partially due to the heavier weight. The power on the Luna feels pretty natural and kicks in quickly and smoothly when peddling and cuts off quickly when you stop. The only jerkiness I felt was peddling at slow speed (even in PAS 1). I've seen reviews bashing the stock Ultra programming but I've never ridden one to compare. I have no major complaints with the Luna tuning.

My only other power delivery gripe is with the throttle. I generally light to start out with throttle if I'm off road in a technical section, but as others have also complained it's a bit of an on off switch at low speeds and hard to modulate. Once you're up to speed the throttle works great.

 

[blueskyca]

Oh, meant to ask - as 'first buyers of new model' did you get the toolkit etc. or just the bike?

I received just the bike but I'll add a compact toolkit like I have on my other bikes. Another reason a rear rack is a priority for me.

 

[blueskyca]

I got mine on Friday. Didn't have the issue with the charge port that the OP had. I do echo his thoughts on the other areas though. Managed to snap the chain on my second ride though, ugh.

This is my first mid drive ebike. I have two other hub motor bikes (csc ft750 and juiced scorpion). I also have two sur-rons. I didn't think I was going too wild with power while being in too tall of a gear, but maybe I need to level set my expectations.

Ouch. I've read so many warnings about nailing the throttle in too high a gear or peddling in the wrong gear at a high PAS level that I was probably over cautious on my first rides. I see that some other riders with strong mid drive bikes carry an extra chain. Some of the trails I'm on take me to the middle of nowhere so this is one of my major concerns with this being my first mid drive bike as well.

 

[Jeebuspwnz]

Ouch. I've read so many warnings about nailing the throttle in too high a gear or peddling in the wrong gear at a high PAS level that I was probably over cautious on my first rides. I see that some other riders with strong mid drive bikes carry an extra chain. Some of the trails I'm on take me to the middle of nowhere so this is one of my major concerns with this being my first mid drive bike as well.

Yeah. I did more walking home than I prefer lol. I think I'll be carrying an extra chain now.

 

[JES2020]

All I got was a box with the bike and charger and a few minor bits for components. No tool kit. Bike was packaged well. No instructions but assembly was easy. Just needed pedals, bars, and front wheel installed. Derailer was not perfectly adjusted either.

I went into the display settings to change from kmh to mph. I also noticed the wheel was set to 26" rather than 27.5 and the voltage was set to 52 rather than 48. I changed those settings to match the bike specs...I assume the wheel size impacts the accuracy of speedo but what does the voltage setting do?

I think the voltage setting would effect the battery level indicator.

 

[JES2020]

Yeah. I did more walking home than I prefer lol. I think I'll be carrying an extra chain now.

You could carry a folding hub drive bike in a trailer to get you home .

 

[rtp]

All I got was a box with the bike and charger and a few minor bits for components. No tool kit. Bike was packaged well. No instructions but assembly was easy. Just needed pedals, bars, and front wheel installed. Derailer was not perfectly adjusted either.

I went into the display settings to change from kmh to mph. I also noticed the wheel was set to 26" rather than 27.5 and the voltage was set to 52 rather than 48. I changed those settings to match the bike specs...I assume the wheel size impacts the accuracy of speedo but what does the voltage setting do?

Battery percentage indicator mainly, AFAIK...

 

[rtp]

The power delivery felt a little more sluggish on the M2S bike, which may be partially due to the heavier weight. The power on the Luna feels pretty natural and kicks in quickly and smoothly when peddling and cuts off quickly when you stop. The only jerkiness I felt was peddling at slow speed (even in PAS 1). I've seen reviews bashing the stock Ultra programming but I've never ridden one to compare. I have no major complaints with the Luna tuning.

My only other power delivery gripe is with the throttle. I generally light to start out with throttle if I'm off road in a technical section, but as others have also complained it's a bit of an on off switch at low speeds and hard to modulate. Once you're up to speed the throttle works great.

On the throttle, I think it's down to the throttle itself, as in how it measures/outputs versus the programming - it 'should' be more or less a simplest rheostat type of device. Has anyone every tried one of these to see if it's the same behavior?

Bafang BBS02/BBSHD Left Thumb Throttle

This is a Bafang left thumb throttle that is compatible with BBS01/BBS02/BBSHD motors. Throttle mechanism moves from right to left Designed to be mounted on left side of handlebars Easy plug and play connection with Bafang Main Wiring Harness

bafangusadirect.com

 

[Jon A]

I've got 5 PAS levels right now but it appears easy to change, up to 9. My only complaint is even PAS 1 is pretty punchy - I would like to see a lower assist level. 1-5 seem pretty well spaced out although I haven't spent much time above PAS 3.

Yeah, that's a common complaint with the stock Ultra programming--even level 1 is equivalent to "turbo mode" on many other bikes. The tune I'm running (similar to Frey) cuts that in half and makes it more dynamic--in Level 1 you can barely tell the motor is on. Battery would darn near last forever in that mode...but I like going fast.

After tuning to make the response more dynamic, I find 9 levels way more than needed--when the system responds to torque input over a larger range (less cadence sensor-like) there's so much overlap between modes in normal riding it's difficult to even tell them apart when you have 9.

My only other power delivery gripe is with the throttle. I generally light to start out with throttle if I'm off road in a technical section, but as others have also complained it's a bit of an on off switch at low speeds and hard to modulate. Once you're up to speed the throttle works great.

That can be greatly improved easily--set the throttle to "current" mode and set "designated assist" to "by display's command." This makes the throttle much more usable at lower speeds in low to medium assist levels.

In any case, being able to tune this bike to suit your liking is a huge benefit it has over some of the other Ultra powered bikes currently sold.

Managed to snap the chain on my second ride though, ugh.

You definitely want to make sure your derailleur is adjusted as close to 100% perfect as you can get it before giving it the beans. When I make a change I usually ride the bike around with the motor off while fiddling with the adjustments so I don't break anything in the process. Even then, try to ease up on the power during shifts. Be sure to check your chainline to make sure it's close to the center of the cassette as well.

I'm assuming this bike doesn't come with a shift sensor? I added one to my E06--it's a PITA but was well worth it to me. In my opinion they really should come on all Ultra equipped bikes--it's easier for the end user to unplug one if he doesn't like it than it is to install one. I've never carried a spare chain, but usually do have a multi-tool with a chain breaker and some quick-links with me. But I've put my bike through some hard use and haven't broken one yet.

 

[Jeffr]

I received mine today and set it up. Adding to OP points:
PROS:
1) Paint is beautiful. metal multicolor flakes is hard to photograph, but looks great in light
2) Easy assembly. Gears are NOT adjusted correctly so be sure to do that BEFORE you ride! Once they are adjusted they are very smooth.
3) spokes and swing link torque settings were all correct out of the box.
4) supplied pedals are metal, not plastic like most other bikes. Most people will want to install their own pedals but these are perfectly serviceable.
CONS:
1) Motor is LOUD. I have another Ultra (Aluminum) and it is whisper quiet, about like a Bosch. This one is like a coffee grinder. I am told it will quiet down after it is worn in, and perhaps the Magnesium is louder than Aluminum, but crimminy this thing is LOUD ,and that the main reason I shied away from the M600 (X2).
2) Charger is adequate, 2.8 amps fan cooled.
3) Dropper seat is KS 100mm travel, inadequate for bike that is otherwise splendid as a hard core off road machine.
4) rear axle is quick release but front axle requires an Allen wrench, disappointing since removing the front wheel is required to put it in my car, I can buy one online.
5) Runs Small. I a little under 6' and ordered a medium. Seat is extended to almost max reach, I had to add a longer stem. I could easily have taken a large. It is significantly smaller than my other eMTB which is a 17"/medium. Oh well if its too small somebody here will take it, Im sure!

Tomorrow I'l get to actually ride it. Report to follow.

 

[rtp]

5) Runs Small. I a little under 6' and ordered a medium. Seat is extended to almost max reach, I had to add a longer stem. I could easily have taken a large. It is significantly smaller than my other eMTB which is a 17"/medium. Oh well if its too small somebody here will take it, Im sure!

This line's killing me. At 6' I can't say how many times I waffled between M and L frames, although in my case, it's for the X2. I ordered a Medium after reading probably all of the E10 builds and X1 comments I could find. Mine shows on Wed. Frames are different but I have to assume (have the specs somewhere) probably fairly similar both coming from Dengfu.
Please let me know how you get on with the Medium frame.

Tomorrow I'l get to actually ride it. Report to follow.

Looking forward to it!

 

[Jeebuspwnz]

I received mine today and set it up. Adding to OP points:
PROS:
1) Paint is beautiful. metal multicolor flakes is hard to photograph, but looks great in light
2) Easy assembly. Gears are NOT adjusted correctly so be sure to do that BEFORE you ride! Once they are adjusted they are very smooth.
3) spokes and swing link torque settings were all correct out of the box.
4) supplied pedals are metal, not plastic like most other bikes. Most people will want to install their own pedals but these are perfectly serviceable.
CONS:
1) Motor is LOUD. I have another Ultra (Aluminum) and it is whisper quiet, about like a Bosch. This one is like a coffee grinder. I am told it will quiet down after it is worn in, and perhaps the Magnesium is louder than Aluminum, but crimminy this thing is LOUD ,and that the main reason I shied away from the M600 (X2).
2) Charger is adequate, 2.8 amps fan cooled.
3) Dropper seat is KS 100mm travel, inadequate for bike that is otherwise splendid as a hard core off road machine.
4) rear axle is quick release but front axle requires an Allen wrench, disappointing since removing the front wheel is required to put it in my car, I can buy one online.
5) Runs Small. I a little under 6' and ordered a medium. Seat is extended to almost max reach, I had to add a longer stem. I could easily have taken a large. It is significantly smaller than my other eMTB which is a 17"/medium. Oh well if its too small somebody here will take it, Im sure!

Tomorrow I'l get to actually ride it. Report to follow.

Mine isn't whisper quiet but I wouldn't say coffee grinder. I'm 6'3 and the large fits pretty well.

 

[blueskyca]

I received mine today and set it up. Adding to OP points:
PROS:
1) Paint is beautiful. metal multicolor flakes is hard to photograph, but looks great in light
2) Easy assembly. Gears are NOT adjusted correctly so be sure to do that BEFORE you ride! Once they are adjusted they are very smooth.
3) spokes and swing link torque settings were all correct out of the box.
4) supplied pedals are metal, not plastic like most other bikes. Most people will want to install their own pedals but these are perfectly serviceable.
CONS:
1) Motor is LOUD. I have another Ultra (Aluminum) and it is whisper quiet, about like a Bosch. This one is like a coffee grinder. I am told it will quiet down after it is worn in, and perhaps the Magnesium is louder than Aluminum, but crimminy this thing is LOUD ,and that the main reason I shied away from the M600 (X2).
2) Charger is adequate, 2.8 amps fan cooled.
3) Dropper seat is KS 100mm travel, inadequate for bike that is otherwise splendid as a hard core off road machine.
4) rear axle is quick release but front axle requires an Allen wrench, disappointing since removing the front wheel is required to put it in my car, I can buy one online.
5) Runs Small. I a little under 6' and ordered a medium. Seat is extended to almost max reach, I had to add a longer stem. I could easily have taken a large. It is significantly smaller than my other eMTB which is a 17"/medium. Oh well if its too small somebody here will take it, Im sure!

Tomorrow I'l get to actually ride it. Report to follow.

Good points. I'm a little over 6' and my seat post is right at the min insertion line. My motor is pretty loud as well but I figured that was part of the "Luna Steel helical gears" upgrade. And my spokes were nowhere near properly torqued.

 

[blueskyca]

The pricing swings on this bike were also interesting. I ordered mine on 11/28 and picked it up on 12/1. I paid $4200 and 3 days later it was $4800. Now it's back to $4500 but they appear out of stock on the medium frame. Still a good value but Luna appears to be watching the market closely.

 

[blueskyca]

What tools you guys have to check spokes tourqe? Are the rims warped when it come out of box?

Both of my rims were true within about 1 mm, but they were very loose. I've used the screwdriver thump and listen method but now prefer the fingernail strum technique for my "precision" spoke adjustments. If you've ever taken your bike to a good bike shop for wheel truing you'll be amazed at how tight the spokes are set based on a strum pitch. I assume this is the correct torque value.

And some of my very loose spokes take a lot of torque to adjust and some are very easy. I think that's why this stiction makes it difficult to specify a precise torque value.

 

[blueskyca]

I've already got the MTX bag that slides on this rack from my other bike so it was easy to keep things in the family. There's concern that the clamp may prevent the dropper from actuating so I'm going to be the guinea pig with this.
View attachment 108710

So far I'm pretty impressed with the rack. I was worried about slamming a metal clamp on my alloy seatpost tube, but there are rubber inserts that attach securely to the inside of the clamp so they won't scratch the painted tube. I think I've got plenty of rear tire clearance. I'll have to see if it moves around.

 

[m@Robertson]

I got mine on Friday. Didn't have the issue with the charge port that the OP had. I do echo his thoughts on the other areas though. Managed to snap the chain on my second ride though, ugh.

This is my first mid drive ebike. I have two other hub motor bikes (csc ft750 and juiced scorpion). I also have two sur-rons. I didn't think I was going too wild with power while being in too tall of a gear, but maybe I need to level set my expectations.

Mid drives have a learning curve for sure.

How To Ride a Mid Drive Ebike Without Breaking It

If you can ride a bicycle you already know how to ride a hub drive ebike. Not so a mid drive. Particularly a powerful one that can tear your chain apart. Fear not. The rules are simple.

talesontwowheels.com

 

[m@Robertson]

Ouch. I've read so many warnings about nailing the throttle in too high a gear or peddling in the wrong gear at a high PAS level that I was probably over cautious on my first rides. I see that some other riders with strong mid drive bikes carry an extra chain. Some of the trails I'm on take me to the middle of nowhere so this is one of my major concerns with this being my first mid drive bike as well.

Yes carry a chain. Its a default rule: If you are riding a badass motor a spare chain, sized to work (doesn't have to be exact to work with every gear; you just need to get home) is the easiest way to get back riding and not do the walk of shame back home, or have to spend any more time than necessary snuggled up against a rock on a cliffside trail dinking around with links to get your busted chain back in action. I also carry a couple spare quicklinks, a extra-small Park chain breaker (as a fallback in case I get really screwed) and chain pliers. The pliers are just something to make my life easier. There are all sorts of workarounds like shoelaces etc. but when there is no real penalty for doing it I prefer carrying the right tool for the job.

 

[PedalUma]

That is a bummer about the charging port nut. Looks like you will need to drop the motor to access the back side and will need to cut the leads to slip on the nut. Soldering up in there will be a pain. But you can't just leave it flopping and open.
I would use the Thule Tour Rack. It has four mounting points and does not cantilever. I would use vinyl wrap to cover the logo. Here is some on a center console. It shapes with a heat gun. I covered my fist electric bike with it.