Front page LA Times today regarding Ebikes

It is interesting to think about when the number of EV bike miles traveled surpasses the number of car miles traveled per year. What would it take to get us there? For me it is my transportation. I have done two rides today.
Honestly, in North America, it is going to take decades. That just means we should start immediately.

It will take a lot of infrastructure. But we need to realize that even the relatively modest amounts of infrastructure proposed and built have prompted fairly deranged backlash (ref: "The War on Cars"). I find it hilarious and ironic that there has been a lot of backlash at projects that have increased the throughput and safety for cars as well. Roundabouts are superior in every way to traditional controlled intersections with traffic lights: they are safer, everyone gets through the intersection faster, and they cost less -- sometimes much less. Yet if you talk to people in the states and Canada most everyone vehemently hates them.

Safe and secure bicycle parking needs to be widely available.

Most of all, it will take a lot of squeaky wheels getting active in politics and being so obnoxiously persistent that the easiest way forward for elected officials is to just give us what we need and want.
 
Honestly, in North America, it is going to take decades. That just means we should start immediately.

It will take a lot of infrastructure. But we need to realize that even the relatively modest amounts of infrastructure proposed and built have prompted fairly deranged backlash (ref: "The War on Cars"). I find it hilarious and ironic that there has been a lot of backlash at projects that have increased the throughput and safety for cars as well. Roundabouts are superior in every way to traditional controlled intersections with traffic lights: they are safer, everyone gets through the intersection faster, and they cost less -- sometimes much less. Yet if you talk to people in the states and Canada most everyone vehemently hates them.

Safe and secure bicycle parking needs to be widely available.

Most of all, it will take a lot of squeaky wheels getting active in politics and being so obnoxiously persistent that the easiest way forward for elected officials is to just give us what we need and want.
North America is full of so many car-f***Ed places that using it as the metric is more trouble than it's worth. Better to limit it to urban areas however defined, and new vehicles only. Even then ebikes are prob way behind.

Roundabouts often take up way way more space than regular intersections, they add a lot of distance for pedestrians, and at higher speeds (maybe 20+ mph) can be pretty daunting for cyclists.
 
Ooh, now it's hitting home:


Less than a year ago, Brad Hepfer thought his beloved daily bike rides in the outdoors were over.

A diabetic, the 72-year-old underwent two knee replacements and just when he felt he was back on track, he suffered a heart attack and had surgery.

But on a recent raw Sunday, the Quarryville resident was pedaling across the Safe Harbor railroad trestle that connects two of Lancaster County’s most popular rail trails.


Rather than hanging up his bike and giving up his forays into the outdoors, Hepfer has ridden 3,300 miles since his heart surgery. Thanks to an electric bike.

“It’s been a godsend,” he says.

Electric bikes, commonly called e-bikes, are one of the hottest things in bicycling and outdoor recreation these days. They are used both for commuting to work or getting around on city streets, and for riding on Lancaster County’s many multi-use public trails.

“The pandemic just launched it. People wanted something to do and decided to try this,” says Ryan Finger, co-owner of the Let’s Roll electric bike shop and rentals in Lancaster city, which opened in 2022. Business has been so good that Finger and his brother-in-law partner, Tim Hill, are opening a second location in April, a block from the Northwest Lancaster County River Trail in Columbia.

With an all-but-silent electric motor and battery, a rechargeable e-bike helps you pedal when you need it. Many e-bikes also have the option of a full throttle, fully taking over the pedaling for you.

During pandemic times when record numbers of people are getting outdoors, e-bikes have become just what the doctor ordered for many seniors and those with physical impediments. Even healthy people find they can go farther and see more with the pedal assist offered by the bikes.

“Seventy-five percent of our customers is the older crowd. They need just a little bit of help on the hill, or want to go a little farther,” Finger says. “And it’s a great way for families to do things together outside.”

But there also has been pushback by some trail users, most frequently complaints of high speeds and being startled by the silent vessels zooming by or bearing down on them.

“I’ve been kind of shoved off the beaten path by people coming down the trail at me at ungodly speeds. They are not pedaling at all. They’re basically dirt biking on the trail. Their hair is blowing in the breeze,” says Jim Hearn, a member of the Martic Township Rail Trail Advisory Committee which guides use on the Enola Low Grade Trail. “There’s a real courtesy problem we foresee happening more frequently.”

But Hearn also has friends who are riding bikes again because they purchased e-bikes. “What we’re seeing are older people. People who would not be riding a bike are now pedaling out in the open air. There’s a lot of positives from it.”

An e-bike can enable someone to keep up with a partner, resulting in more together time outdoors. Some trail users polled on rail-trails in the county grumble that e-bikes are a kind of a cheating way to ride a bike.

Amid this sudden and growing popularity of e-bikes, trail and land managers around the county are scrambling to determine what controls, if any, should be put on the new kids on the block.

The results have been all over the map, with many officials waiting to see what others will do.
Everything in bold can also describe someone on a regular bike. I've seen spandex bikers speeding down trails and roads, almost got hit by a flock one time on my own bike. They are just as quiet as an Ebike.

But they found the problem, it's a matter of common courtesy, not the vehicle being ridden. Sadly common courtesy ain't that common anymore. As far as being "startled" too many people walking around with earbuds in and not being able to hear what's going on around them. Even on the very few trails that I get to ride on (there aren't many around me) that's all you see, people with earbuds walking down the middle of the trail. They can't hear the bell, and I figure as long as I tried to warn them, I'll go around them, slowly. If they get startled, that's really their problem, not mine, because if I were to use my horn, that would certainly piss them off even more.

Then there's the young mothers club, 5 or 6 of them at a time, with their oversized designer strollers taking up the entire trail and gabbing so much they never hear the bell.
 
The latest earplugs, as I call them, have automatic ambient 'noise' cancelation. They couldn't hear a foghorn! And they are looking down while walking, jogging, or even riding a bike. 6 out of 10 have them on the MUPs around here. Some of the remainder are just self medicated insane people. We live in a world of zombies.
 
The latest earplugs, as I call them, have automatic ambient 'noise' cancelation. They couldn't hear a foghorn! And they are looking down while walking, jogging, or even riding a bike. 6 out of 10 have them on the MUPs around here. Some of the remainder are just self medicated insane people. We live in a world of zombies.
The obvious solution is to have VW design ebikes.

 
It sounds as though the biggest problem with Ebikes on trails is their silence. Contact me for a kit to ensure that you can be heard while on the trails. No longer will you be able to sneak up on the clueless. My kid guarantees that you will be heard.

The kit is only $49.95US via Paypal. Order yours today.

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Utter nonsense.

I note the comment in the article about how many kids are not wearing helmets. Helmet usage is required for those under 18 in California even for ordinary bicycles.
It's a matter of perception. When you are around pedestrians who see you not pedaling, on bikes that look like skinny motorcycles, you will get complaints to authorities. It's utter nonsense to discount this. Throttled bikes should not mix with pedestrians.
 
I wasted premo collector baseball cards on bike spokes as a kid. With no idea. I wish they made the local speedway all electric and just used baseball cards in the spokes for the sound affects.
 
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It's a matter of perception. When you are around pedestrians who see you not pedaling, on bikes that look like skinny motorcycles, you will get complaints to authorities. It's utter nonsense to discount this. Throttled bikes should not mix with pedestrians.
Sam Franks Disco. The height of arrogance. If riding home on a MUP at cruiser pedal bike speed how am I a danger to pedestrians? The only injury locally was a spandex putz with no bell or verbal warning riding at class 2 speeds. But in your narrow world that’s OK. @JedidiahStolzfus nailed it.
 
Sam Franks Disco. The height of arrogance. If riding home on a MUP at cruiser pedal bike speed how am I a danger to pedestrians? The only injury locally was a spandex putz with no bell or verbal warning riding at class 2 speeds. But in your narrow world that’s OK. @JedidiahStolzfus nailed it.
Pedestrians look at throttles bikes and think it's a motorcycle. They want motorcycles off the pedestrian paths. It's perception that counts and what is narrow is to assume that people understand the difference.
 
Pedestrians look at throttles bikes and think it's a motorcycle. They want motorcycles off the pedestrian paths. It's perception that counts and what is narrow is to assume that people understand the difference.
That’s just silly. 99% wouldn’t know I have a throttle. It looks less like an eBike than your RM. Good land man get a grip. R&M, KHS smoothie 350W rack battery.
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The problem with throttles that no one seems to mention: people who ride via throttle only often ride with an air of impunity - they may not be going fast, but they just barrel through the lane even when they ought to slow down or move a little to give others more space.

It's not a matter of the speed per se, since their bikes are often capped at 15 or 20 mph. It's just that they're not very responsive to other users. Sharing a lane can be like a dance with other users, with mutual accomodations. People throttling along on 100-200 lb ebikes/slow mopeds often simply don't do that. Seen it in Netherlands, Montreal. I think it's partly that the vehicles often weigh a lot more and lack agility, but also that adjusting your speed via pedaling or not is a lot more intuitive and instinctual.
 
He's right... perception is the problem.
Another example of feelings over facts.
That's true and does not help us at all.

The "perception" is likely to get e-bikes banned in a lot of places (and probably for sale as well) in the coming years. To be blunt, a lot of the posts on this forum, if presented to a board deciding trail access issues and presented out of context and as negatively as possible, would be excellent fuel for such a ban.

Many folks posting here clearly believe that they can just ignore any rules and ride wherever they damned well please. And they are extremely vocal about it. That attitude sits poorly with agencies that set access rules.

If we want e-bikes to be accepted in civilized society a damned good start would be to behave in a civilized fashion.
 
North America is full of so many car-f***Ed places that using it as the metric is more trouble than it's worth. Better to limit it to urban areas however defined, and new vehicles only. Even then ebikes are prob way behind.

Roundabouts often take up way way more space than regular intersections, they add a lot of distance for pedestrians, and at higher speeds (maybe 20+ mph) can be pretty daunting for cyclists.
Fact you put more roundabouts in the US there will be more accidents.
 
Fact you put more roundabouts in the US there will be more accidents.
Might be. But there will certainly be far fewer accidents with fatalities or serious injuries. This is largely because you can't have head-on collisions or high-speed collisions at right angles. Nearly all collisions will be at lower speeds and shallow angles, and since speed kills in accidents this is a Big Deal.

All of the evidence is that roundabouts are safer, move traffic more quickly, and cost less than controlled intersections. Also, depending on design you can fit them into existing right-of-ways most of the time and you can tune the speed (mainly by controlling the turning radius) down to about 20mph.

A good feature of roundabouts is that you set the crosswalks back from the intersection but close enough that cars are slowing down. Cyclists can either use the crosswalks or can take the lane and ride through the roundabout.

I agree multi-lane roundabouts (so-called turbo roundabouts) are awful, confusing, and kind of silly.

Also, please show your work on your claim that more roundabouts mean more accidents. When I look online I quickly found this page which I quote from below:

  • Studies of intersections in the United States converted from traffic signals or stop signs to roundabouts have found reductions in injury crashes of 72-80 percent and reductions in all crashes of 35-47 percent (Retting et al., 2001; Eisenman et al., 2004; Rodegerdts et al., 2007).
  • A study of 19 higher-speed rural intersections (speed limits of 40 mph or higher) that originally had stop signs on the minor approaches and were converted to roundabouts found a 62 percent reduction in all crashes and an 85 percent reduction in injury crashes (Isebrands & Hallmark, 2012).
 
That's true and does not help us at all.

The "perception" is likely to get e-bikes banned in a lot of places (and probably for sale as well) in the coming years. To be blunt, a lot of the posts on this forum, if presented to a board deciding trail access issues and presented out of context and as negatively as possible, would be excellent fuel for such a ban.

Many folks posting here clearly believe that they can just ignore any rules and ride wherever they damned well please. And they are extremely vocal about it. That attitude sits poorly with agencies that set access rules.

If we want e-bikes to be accepted in civilized society a damned good start would be to behave in a civilized fashion.
Much the same way the spandex flock currently rides though. It's not uncommon around here to see them, en masse blowing through stop signs while the rest of the traffic is trying to get through a 4 way stop with everyone taking their turn. They regularly ride more than 2 abreast making it nearly impossible to pass while still giving them the required amount of space. They ride with no lights and don't signal their turns. Basically doing all the same things that ebikes are accused of doing.

Everyone riding bikes on the roadways should be obeying the rules of the road and actually sharing the road. Something that bikers have been screaming about long before ebikes came about. Which I always find funny since they're doing what they can to not share the road. Not saying all, but I've seen enough to see that many don't care about the rules. While its a shame when one gets hit, I have to wonder how much they contributed to it happening.

As far as the throttle haters. I'm not really sure where that comes from. I have a throttle, the only time I use it is to get rolling from dead stop. I can pedal with assist at the same speed the throttle will get me to. I don't believe that everyone should be punished because of the wrongdoings of a few. I don't think as a society we should be looking to that as a solution either. Everyone remember in school when one kid did something wrong and the teacher punished everyone? Is that really the solution in a mature society?

I don't really believe there's a good answer to it though. LE doesn't have the resources to sit out on trails with a radar gun and to watch for pedaling. Personally, I'd rather them be doing anything but that. The problem is today's society, too many are selfish and uncaring of other road/trail users. I see it every day when I drive, cars and trucks blowing through stops signs and red lights. Illegal passes because they have to get to their destination a few seconds earlier.

TBH, I don't have a problem with speeders either, I have a problem with slowers. Especially the front platers that like to slowly run the backroads so they can stare at cows.
 
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