Experience Thread: A noobie getting into a specialized vado 5.0 IGH

[dynamic]

IGH? I had the very same issue with mine more than 2 times, and upon returning to the LBS and being told, "Just turn it on/off, there is no fix", which began my return/refund process, credit card dispute, and "Rider-I-Don't Care" telling me bye-bye forever and do not ever contact them ever for anything. Well documented.

Well, if that is where this goes, then so be it. How long had you had the bike? (I am past my official return window)

 

[GuruUno]

Early March,
I ordered 2, one for me, and one for my wife, in March this year. Vado IGH men's and women. She never rode hers, I did about 150 miles and approximately 1 month later I initiated a return which was stalled (they had zero ideas as to how to proceed, as these were some of the very 1st direct web-to-consumer, ship-to-LBS (to build bikes).
My communications were:
I’ll save you the long-winded version and summarize it.
Got an error again on my bike (motor/firmware), died, and restarted.
Rick (manager) said I will keep getting them and I should ignore them, and restart the bike when it occurs.
1-2-3 strikes I’m done. Also, not a real fan of the IGH, automatic not. Still need a lot of “electronic button pushing” to achieve levels normally done via a derailleur bike.
I have about 150 miles on my bike.
My wife has yet to even ride hers, so it is as it was 1 mile on day one when picked up.
Maybe I got a lemon.
So, with that, please inform “Rider I-Don’t Care” I’d like to initiate a return of both bikes.
I’ve attempted to communicate with them, but there is never any reply or response to any calls or e-mails or uploading of diagnostics, etc.
It shall be interesting to see how this works out, given that you were the local bike shop I chose to have the bikes delivered to and set up, after buying from Specialized online.
So, can you or will you assist in resolving this matter for me? (They did assist)

Summary:
I got the dreaded motor error again.
(The one which Rick told me that WILL continue to keep happening and that I must turn the bike off and then back on to continue to ride).
The one that states, NOTE: Errors triggered on motor firmware 7.1.1 & 7.3.6 are wrongfully triggered. The 7.4.1 & 7.4.2 motor firmware provides improvements, and we are currently working on an update release to solve such events. Error code 16386. If issues do not resolve, please contact your retailer.
Rick, last week, did the update(s).
My concern, moving forward, is how long for a resolution, what next, and whether should I be proactive and do what? "Rider I-Don't-Care" does not reply to inquiries, calls, or e-mails, the dealer tells me to turn it off and turn it on and that's it.
It's not buyer’s remorse, it is unacceptable communication from Specialized and the bike not living up to the expectation of the IGH advertisement of “automatic shifting”. It does not.

April 19th

Subject: Re: Status of the returned Vado 5.0 IGH bikes?

I’d like to ask you to investigate as to why almost 1 week has passed (tomorrow will be 1 week) with no response from Rider Care as per multiple calls and e-mails to inquire of them about the same inquiry. I’m not sure if I need to interface with the credit card company to dispute the charges if there is to be no response for the normal channels of communication. I’m sure you can appreciate the frustration, but we still love Specialized Then on April 20th, this message: SORRY, YOUR RETURN CAN NOT BE COMPLETED Your return for order #US-0007723759 does not meet our Return Merchandise Authorization criteria and cannot be completed.  If you have any questions, feel free to contact our Rider Care Team at [email protected]  and review our RETURN POLICIES  for more details.  If you return items from multiple orders, please expect a separate email concerning those orders. So the only way was to initiate a credit card dispute, which worked, but that set the flare off in their ass and quite frankly I feel it's because they never had anyone as good as me push the limits to get things done. I have nothing but time, influence, lawyers, access to media, etc. So one might think that they would be really nice to me......but they are not. I TRULY LOVE THR VADO AND COMO, BUT THE THE COMPANY POLICIES SUCK. I can only imagine moving forward as my bike may need some authorization for another matter, and how that will go down.....I can only wait to see it. May 5th Wanting to thank you for your assistance with the previous returns of the Vado IGH’s, all went well. Challenging, but nonetheless, done and you were extremely helpful. Since then, I got my wife a Como 5.0 step-through (non-IGH), she loves it. Therefore, I’ve convinced myself to add another one to my stable (I still have a Vado 5.0 SL) and have a Como 5.0 in Red in the checkout basket ready to pull the trigger. Can I impose upon you to get a Promo Code to help me since I am a loyal and continuing customer? I’d very much appreciate it March ordered Como 5.0's for my wife and I, her Como has a defective fork, and LBS had to use my fork from my COMO SO SHE WOULD BE ABLE TO RIDE HER BIKE. MY CCOMO SITS FOR 5+ MONTHS WAITING FOR SRM fork, no idea when if ever to be repaired. So summary, I sold my 2021 Vado 5, and bought a Vado (2022) Vado 5 (Chain, no more IGH for me), and mt Como sits with no fork for 5 months, my wife Como is usable with my fork as a donor, but there has been zero assistance from Specialize and rider car. So, here we go again, take the money from them back to get reactions and responses. Sad way to do business. What gets me is that the bikes are killer. They have some issues. But why the company is a total jerk-off is far beyond comprehension. It's only money, I will win, and I will receive an extended warranty, offsetting appeasement offerings for the massive inconvenience, and for sure a news blurb beyond imagination on Twitter, FaceBook, Instagram....so the consumer has some insight as to how the company works. Like I said in an earlier post, the new guy at the head of the biz they for from Dyson, so he really, really sucks, as he hasn't even attempted to reach out to try to discuss a resolution.

 

[mschwett]

And through all that, I forgot to mention the HRM. The strap is driving me bat crap crazy. It rolls the *instant* I start moving. And I haven't been able to prevent it from rolling. The issue is, once it does roll, it is itchy and uncomfortable. So, when I put it on, I move around and make sure the rolling is done, and it is tolerable. Really want a different source for heart rate. (as I re-lose body fat, I imagine this problem will go away).

rolls? what do you mean by that? i guess if you really want a non-chest-strap one that does ANT and bluetooth, you can get a verity. good reviews generally.

 

[mschwett]

...I did a 2cm change, and suddenly my legs felt like they were bound and couldn't push nearly as much power. What about numbness? Well, when I lowered the saddle there seemed to be an "immediate" improvement, but it didn't seem to last on the rough roads. Meaning while the higher saddle probably does contribute to numbness if I am not actively working on core strength, but it's still vibration that may be the main culprit. Over time, core strength will help keep the body balanced, while I am not sure vibration will (or should) get much better.

Another thing is I spent 22% of the ride with the motor off. I found that the "bite" I could feel in the pedals on some sections was just nice. So much so that I may re-think my eco/sport/turbo distributions. I definitely prefer the just 1 or 2 button presses to switch through the modes over microtune. I also feel like turbo 100% is probably more than I really need a lot of the time.

Anyway, it was an extremely enjoyable ride despite the tech issue. In fact, maybe because of it. Forerunner should arrive today. Hopefully use it tomorrow.

vibration will absolutely be mitigated by core strength. the handlebars can vibrate all they want and if you don't have a death grip on them, it won't cause any problems. to not have a death grip, you need to not be leaning on them, meaning supported by your legs and core. give it time. especially if you're a heavier guy it'll take more than a season for sure. you'll also reduce the force of the vibration simply by reducing the mass of the bike+rider system.

on the power side, absolutely, 100 percent. consider that your typical trained and fit cyclist doesn't even generate 250 watts of average power over a long ride, and they go all over the place, up and down hills, gravel, trails, roads, etc, at reasonable average speeds. if you're not using the bike to commute, tote kits or dogs or gear around, there's really no reason you need a lot more than that in total except to overcome the weight of a heavy bike. when i ride for fun/fitness, my goal has always been to use as little power as possible, knowing it's there if i get in trouble. for errands and commutes, crank it up, but if you're out exploring, getting some air and exercise, what's the point other than to go a little further in the same time? that can be fun, but the difference is marginal.

 

[dynamic]

rolls? what do you mean by that? i guess if you really want a non-chest-strap one that does ANT and bluetooth, you can get a verity. good reviews generally.

The strap rolls over on itself. It ends up feeling twisted with edges digging into me.

I have a forerunner. Will see how that goes.

 

[mschwett]

The strap rolls over on itself. It ends up feeling twisted with edges digging into me.

I have a forerunner. Will see how that goes.

weird! never heard of that. too tight or too loose? is it about an inch wide like the typical ones?

 

[dynamic]

if you don't have a death grip on them

I don’t have a death grip now. I can have a floating light grip and numbness still develops on the rough roads. It’s well within tolerable limits but still there. Not so much on pavement. Now, when I get tired and stop controlling the grip so well, it gets worse. Core strength will address that but I don’t think it will eliminate numbness entirely.

trained and fit cyclist doesn't even generate 250 watts of average power over a long ride

I have been wondering about the averages. Do they include coasting where power is 0? So if I simply put minimal effort in down hill, my average would rise?

I see a lot of bikers around me. But very few on these big back country hills. Almost all of them are down by the bike trail/town. The ones I have seen on these hills are almost certainly electric (I look at the bikes I pass). I did 2,032 feet of climbing today. When I was climbing hard, I would be pushing 800+ watts between me and the bike. Now, me+bike likely weighs 100lbs+ more than that fit guy+gravel bike. But he also isn’t pushing that much wattage without assistance (unless he is lance armstrong). The point is, I don’t think these routes are “recreational” routes for the average non-electric cyclist. I don’t even see that many road cyclists up the hill to my house.

I like to think I could do these routes one day on a regular bike. But, really, Not in these timeframes. Currently, I would estimate my 10 minute ride from town to home to be 25-30 minutes on a bike with sufficient gearing. Maybe I will try it on my vado with the motor off. See if it kills me.

Anyway, I am still tempted to buy a priority 600/600x just to have a hill friendly regular bike to measure my progress.

 

[dynamic]

weird! never heard of that. too tight or too loose? is it about an inch wide like the typical ones?

It’s probably due to body fat. But yeah, it’s pretty standard strap. Otherwise very comfortable when not rolled. Forerunner tomorrow! It’s all paired and ready to go. Assuming weather and family don’t cancel the ride.

 

[mschwett]

…
I have been wondering about the averages. Do they include coasting where power is 0? So if I simply put minimal effort in down hill, my average would rise?

I see a lot of bikers around me. But very few on these big back country hills. Almost all of them are down by the bike trail/town. The ones I have seen on these hills are almost certainly electric (I look at the bikes I pass). I did 2,032 feet of climbing today. When I was climbing hard, I would be pushing 800+ watts between me and the bike. Now, me+bike likely weighs 100lbs+ more than that fit guy+gravel bike. But he also isn’t pushing that much wattage without assistance…

you’re just going faster, that’s all. non-electric cyclists do every kind of road, up to 20% grades. even with my heart condition i often do 5,000 feet of climbing in a 50 mile ride on my standard road bike. my most common ride is around 1,600 feet in 20 miles. nobody puts out 800 watts for any sustained time, they just climb slower, and they absolutely climb big hills. around here, it’s hills / mountains everywhere and probably 90% non-electric bikes on pleasure rides. in the city, for commutes and hauling kids and stuff, where the hills are even steeper (we have 20-30% grades within city limits in spots!) it’s about 30-40% e-bikes, i’d estimate.

averages for a period do include the coasting time. if you’re trying to maximize exercise you’d definitely pedal donwhill - and it’s fun - but it’s not very energy efficient to dump another couple hundred watts at high speed when the wind resistance will just eat it up.

a better indication of effort is the weighted average, generally a bit higher than the true average for a course with coasting and stops. better still is to look at sub-segments without coasting or stopping to see the relationship of power to speed and heart rate over time.

the other factors which make it seem impossible without assistance is the significant added weight, resistance, and generally longer gearing of e-bikes. 10 or 20% can make a huge difference, and when you add than 10 or 20% a couple times, it really adds up to more than most legs and hearts can handle.

 

[dynamic]

they just climb slower, and they absolutely climb big hills.

Yeah. It’s not the question of “can it be done” it’s the timing. I knew when I tested the diverge that I couldn’t maintain a speed that made it 1) practical 2) fun. At least, not yet.

 

[dynamic]

What gets me is that the bikes are killer. They have some issues. But why the company is a total jerk-off is far beyond comprehension.

This. IT has been my experience as well. My LBS saved the sale. And will probably continue to do so. I get why people love the bikes, but the rest of the company has nome work to do. And, I can safely say that if this bike becomes a "problem" it will be my last specialized bike. Because if the bikes aren't amazing, there is zero reason to buy from this company. I would rather work with the "less advanced" priority with phenomenal customer service if I am dealing with broken bikes.

I dodged a bullet on buying 2 bikes. We originally purchased 2 currents for myself and my wife. After that, it became too late in the season to justify my wife's bike (we are already beyond her bike weather). So we started with one. But there is no doubt in my mind that a Como 5.0 IGH is the best bike in *concept* for my wife. If this bike doesn't screw things up by spring, a como is a nearly guaranteed purchase. If it does, I would bet we would go back to the current, or try the evelo or gazelle options. Maybe giant if I feel I can give up belt.

 

[dynamic]

Forerunner. No bike yet. I just have some comments.

1) It's big. Bigger than my larger apple watch. Probably similar to an ultra though. I was thinking this is a "smaller" watch. And maybe it is in garmin's world.

2) The data is crazy awesome. Like really pretty spectacular. They have a refined way of dealing with the complexity and still making it easy to use and visualize.

If this thing doesn't mess up bike riding like the 1040 did, it really should be amazing. On to the day!

 

[dynamic]

If this thing doesn't mess up bike riding like the 1040 did, it really should be amazing.

HA! The forerunner constantly pauses and unpauses the activity while I am moving. Gonna do some research on it. I could turn off auto-pause, but it seems odd that it can't handle it with gps, power, cadence and speed sensors attached.

Good ride. Will update more after I figure some stuff out.

 

[dynamic]

Oh, and the bike motor is making a new noise. Gonna bring it to the shop.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Oh, and the bike motor is making a new noise. Gonna bring it to the shop.

The cost of buying "the latest and the greatest", "well into the 21st century"

How comes I ride a 2017 Vado 5.0 (derailleur) with the 2020 free upgrade and experience zero issues? (It was a rhetoric question).

 

[dynamic]

The cost of buying "the latest and the greatest", "well into the 21st century"

How comes I ride a 2017 Vado 5.0 (derailleur) with the 2020 free upgrade and experience zero issues? (It was a rhetoric question).

Are the 2017 motors better than the 2022 motors? Cause that would answer the question.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Are the 2017 motors better than the 2022 motors? Cause that would answer the question.

2017 motors are totally silent...

 

[dynamic]

2017 motors are totally silent...

2022 are not. At least, mine never has been.

 

[mschwett]

2022 are not. At least, mine never has been.

different people have different ideas what totally silent means!!!! full power vado is much quieter than SL motor, but i’ve never heard one that’s “totally silent.” not as loud as a freewheel, rough pavement, or high wind speed, but quite audible in ideal conditions like climbing a steep smoothly paved hill at low speed but high power.

 

[mschwett]

HA! The forerunner constantly pauses and unpauses the activity while I am moving. Gonna do some research on it. I could turn off auto-pause, but it seems odd that it can't handle it with gps, power, cadence and speed sensors attached.

Good ride. Will update more after I figure some stuff out.

auto-pause and auto-start are horrible features! turn off.