Stefan Mikes
Gravel e-biker
- Region
- Europe
- City
- Mazovia, PL
Bzzzzzz! 
eMTB Options For 2024
- Thread starter Browneye
- Start date
Stefan Mikes
Gravel e-biker
- Region
- Europe
- City
- Mazovia, PL
Guys. I was thinking if I wanted to order an R&M ebike today. Seriously. Then I remembered it was the Bosch motor and gave up. I prefer to ride a bike in silence. Who of you two rode the Vado?
Browneye
Well-Known Member
Brose worldwide headquarters: https://www.brose.com/de-en/
"...one of Germany's most innovative companies."
Fascinating.
Odd that I've never heard of them. I've owned nearly fifty vehicles in my driving career. They're likely making 'oem' products.
"...one of Germany's most innovative companies."
Fascinating.
Odd that I've never heard of them. I've owned nearly fifty vehicles in my driving career. They're likely making 'oem' products.
FlatSix911
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- Silicon Valley
Glad to see EBR community enjoying a healthy discussion... we must have too much time available. I'm heading out for a ride!
Stefan Mikes
Gravel e-biker
- Region
- Europe
- City
- Mazovia, PL
Oh, Chris will forgive us 
It is his thread anyway.
It is his thread anyway.
Browneye
Well-Known Member
The PW 'sport' motor is nearly silent. Much much quieter than the 'X' I got in the mountain bike. Even so, it has quieted down quite a bit with some breaking in. Surely not offensive or annoying.
@PDoz says the new 2020 version is much quieter yet. I have not test-ridden one.
The shimano is really quiet. The Brose and Specialized are silent. Seems to me there's a belt drive in the primary, instead of gears.
As I always say, the wind noise is louder than all the mid-drive assist motors. [shrug]
Based on what I've learned over the past six month, I would take any of them if I had a good dealer backing it. I haven't heard anyone, end user or pro-reviewer, knock any of them. I will say that I didn't like the little idler-gear Bosch had for some 2018 and 2019 models, and some had a really small primary chain ring. I prefer a standard configuration. Some riders mentioned them to be noisy and clattery. Just seems like another failure point.
I also did not care for a front shifter we saw on some the yamahas - Haibike had them, and they put them on their own brand of bikes - the TORQ was one, I think. Unnecessary, IMHO, especially for a ebike.
@PDoz says the new 2020 version is much quieter yet. I have not test-ridden one.
The shimano is really quiet. The Brose and Specialized are silent. Seems to me there's a belt drive in the primary, instead of gears.
As I always say, the wind noise is louder than all the mid-drive assist motors. [shrug]
Based on what I've learned over the past six month, I would take any of them if I had a good dealer backing it. I haven't heard anyone, end user or pro-reviewer, knock any of them. I will say that I didn't like the little idler-gear Bosch had for some 2018 and 2019 models, and some had a really small primary chain ring. I prefer a standard configuration. Some riders mentioned them to be noisy and clattery. Just seems like another failure point.
I also did not care for a front shifter we saw on some the yamahas - Haibike had them, and they put them on their own brand of bikes - the TORQ was one, I think. Unnecessary, IMHO, especially for a ebike.
linklemming
Well-Known Member
I have owned two Brose eBikes(1 standard, 1 speed) for about 1.5 years now. While I LOVE the feel and quietness of the Brose Motors, they do seem to have questionable reliability. I would love to own a Specialized Turbo Levo (just love how it is designed)
I just could never warm up to the feel/noise of the bosch.
I got to ride a Shimano 8000 FS eMTB for about 2 weeks/300miles. I like alot about the shimano but the noise was a tad much for me. It seemed to get alot of attention from other bikers/hikers due to the noise. I finally had to modify my technique when passing people (quick burst of speed, then phantom pedal as I would coast past). I actually had a shimano bike on order but cancelled it and got a brose speed pedelec bike instead
I have tested a few Yamaha ebikes and like them alot. My second favorite after the Brose. Browneyes Giant is a great bike at a great price.
I really wanted to pick up a haibike allmtn 2.0 on black friday for $2700 but couldnt really ride it on local trails it was designed for. I bought a Santa Cruz Tallboy acoustic bike instead.
If the local harder MTB trails open up here, I will be buying a FS Giant, Turbo Levo or yamaha equipped haibike.
I just could never warm up to the feel/noise of the bosch.
I got to ride a Shimano 8000 FS eMTB for about 2 weeks/300miles. I like alot about the shimano but the noise was a tad much for me. It seemed to get alot of attention from other bikers/hikers due to the noise. I finally had to modify my technique when passing people (quick burst of speed, then phantom pedal as I would coast past). I actually had a shimano bike on order but cancelled it and got a brose speed pedelec bike instead
I have tested a few Yamaha ebikes and like them alot. My second favorite after the Brose. Browneyes Giant is a great bike at a great price.
I really wanted to pick up a haibike allmtn 2.0 on black friday for $2700 but couldnt really ride it on local trails it was designed for. I bought a Santa Cruz Tallboy acoustic bike instead.
If the local harder MTB trails open up here, I will be buying a FS Giant, Turbo Levo or yamaha equipped haibike.
FlatSix911
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- Silicon Valley
My experience is based on the EBikes that I own and ride... 2 Shimano and 2 Yamaha mid-drive systems.
They each have their relative strengths for specific applications... here is the bottom line:
They each have their relative strengths for specific applications... here is the bottom line:
- The Shimano motors are smooth and provide excellent range for the road and trekking.
- The Yamaha motors are powerful and provide great torque for off-road & aggressive climbing.
- Both have great reliability and local support for software and hardware... none has been needed.
onlineaddy
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- San Diego, CA, USA
Apparently it's happening and not just a render:
The 15 Best Electric Bikes of 2024
We've done the research, so you don't have to. Elevate your ride with one of the best e-bikes of 2024! Get ready to hit the pavement or trail.
electricbikeaction.com
Stefan Mikes
Gravel e-biker
- Region
- Europe
- City
- Mazovia, PL
Get a local support for that. Heh.
(60 Nm in 2020? Heheh.)
(60 Nm in 2020? Heheh.)
FlatSix911
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- Silicon Valley
The target market group for Forestal is for people who want a lightweight bike with limited assistance and are in good shape.
Stefan Mikes
Gravel e-biker
- Region
- Europe
- City
- Mazovia, PL
Let them buy Turbo Levo SL.
Browneye
Well-Known Member
I was going to say, it seems rather more similar to the TL SL. Seems to me the SL had quite a lower nm motor output as well - like 45 or 50nm comes to mind.
As I mentioned up thread, I test rode a SL. Nice smooth bike, but just not enough punch of this old fart.
38lbs is sure nice and light though, for sure.
As I mentioned up thread, I test rode a SL. Nice smooth bike, but just not enough punch of this old fart.
38lbs is sure nice and light though, for sure.
Stefan Mikes
Gravel e-biker
- Region
- Europe
- City
- Mazovia, PL
You should have tried the regular Turbo Levo, Chris
Browneye
Well-Known Member
I did, liked it too. In fact, liked enough to buy one.
But after riding the YT Decoy you start to compare everything to it. That and the Trubo Levo Comp. The YT was about $700 less, for arguably more bike. So the shopping exploration continued.
There were a few 2019 TL Comp models left in the DC, another dealer had a M and a L in stock. $5300 plus tax, about another $450 usd for us. My Giant was $4100 otd including tax. That's $1650 less!
The 2020 TL has the 700+ watt pack on the Comp model, basically a grand more than the base Levo. Which BTW, the latter has a dropper seatpost for this year. But the Comp also has a bunch of other upgrades - suspension, brakes, shifter, etc. So you get a lot of extras for the cost of the upgraded battery pack. But now $6000 plus $500 in tax - $2400 more than the Giant I got. That difference is what some were buying whole bikes from Crazy Lenny's.
As mentioned, if I could have gotten a TL Comp for about $4500 otd that is what I probly would be riding now. That Commencal was looking really good too - it was under four-grand shipped IIRC.
But after riding the YT Decoy you start to compare everything to it. That and the Trubo Levo Comp. The YT was about $700 less, for arguably more bike. So the shopping exploration continued.
There were a few 2019 TL Comp models left in the DC, another dealer had a M and a L in stock. $5300 plus tax, about another $450 usd for us. My Giant was $4100 otd including tax. That's $1650 less!
The 2020 TL has the 700+ watt pack on the Comp model, basically a grand more than the base Levo. Which BTW, the latter has a dropper seatpost for this year. But the Comp also has a bunch of other upgrades - suspension, brakes, shifter, etc. So you get a lot of extras for the cost of the upgraded battery pack. But now $6000 plus $500 in tax - $2400 more than the Giant I got. That difference is what some were buying whole bikes from Crazy Lenny's.
As mentioned, if I could have gotten a TL Comp for about $4500 otd that is what I probly would be riding now. That Commencal was looking really good too - it was under four-grand shipped IIRC.
FlatSix911
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- Silicon Valley
Price aside, I am going to take a good look at the Forestal in October... the prefect light bike for riding with analog-bike friends.
Browneye
Well-Known Member
Is there a local dealer? Or is this another direct-to-consumer company?
bob armani
Well-Known Member
Holy cow, did not know they made fat 8 inchers. Now that is a radical move. Something I would expect to see our friend Arnie riding on the ocean side somewhere in Cal.This rack might be a better match for plus size tires... adjustable up to 8" in maximum width.
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